Leaky Pinion Seal - Replaced - Still Leaking

[roccov12345]

ok all, here I go again....

1998 Mountaineer, since I bought the car the rear diff has been leaking so I decided to tackel the job over the weekend. Inspected the leaking to be coming from the pinion seal. Disconnected the driveshaft, took off the pinion nut (PITA!). Pulled off the disc that the driveshaft connects to (needed a gear puller) then pulled out the old pinion seal. Put in the new seal, put together as a took it apart and it's still leaking.

I noticed the reason it was leaking in the first place is because the plastic sleeve on that disc thats in there was catching on the pinion seal causing it to spin the seal with the driveshaft as it turns. This is whats happening now. I didn't tap the seal in because it didn't look like I could. It sit in there the same way that my 95 explorer sits with a little lip hanging out. Any ideas? Should I tear it back down and tap the seal into place? When I put it in it just kinda moved around in there. HELP! :fire:

 

[roccov12345]

bump

 

[ExplorerDMB]

sure you have the right seal? Those seals should be snug and need to be tapped into place, flush.

-Drew

 

[roccov12345]

sure you have the right seal? Those seals should be snug and need to be tapped into place, flush.

-Drew

Could possibly be the issue. I wouldn't think it would be any different from any other 8.8 explorer rear but could be. I bought it from autozone for about 10 bucks. It fit in really easy.

 

[Creager]

What brand of seals? in my gear adventures, the brand of pinoin seal makes A BIG DIFFERENCE! The cheap ones i was never able to get to work right, they just caused frustration....

Try BCA seals, best constructed in ones ive come across. The BCA seal makes the timken seals look like kindergarden ****.

None of them are going to fit easy. Since yours did, i am thinking you didnt install it correctly. If the dust shield (grey plastic thing on the flange) is dragging along the inside of the seal, then you have a CRAP seal.

When you go to the autoparts store, bring the flange with you. Test how the seal seats on the dust shield. if it takes ANY effort to turn or to even press the seal on he dust sheild, then thats a junk seal, dont use it.

You really should replace the crushsleeve and reset the pinion bearing preload when you install a new seal. There needs to be ~10inlbs of drag on the pinion bearings (stock) so it will avoid faliure.

 

[roccov12345]

What brand of seals? in my gear adventures, the brand of pinoin seal makes A BIG DIFFERENCE! The cheap ones i was never able to get to work right, they just caused frustration....

Try BCA seals, best constructed in ones ive come across. The BCA seal makes the timken seals look like kindergarden ****.

None of them are going to fit easy. Since yours did, i am thinking you didnt install it correctly. If the dust shield (grey plastic thing on the flange) is dragging along the inside of the seal, then you have a CRAP seal.

When you go to the autoparts store, bring the flange with you. Test how the seal seats on the dust shield. if it takes ANY effort to turn or to even press the seal on he dust sheild, then thats a junk seal, dont use it.

You really should replace the crushsleeve and reset the pinion bearing preload when you install a new seal. There needs to be ~10inlbs of drag on the pinion bearings (stock) so it will avoid faliure.

I just went back to autozone for the 3rd time and had them look up a 2wd pinion seal which is a different part number. I bought it to try it out but who knows. The only difference I can tell is it's a different color lol. When we talk about crush sleeve, forgive my unknowing, are you talking about that piece after you take off the seal that looks like a washer?

What is the process for reseting the pinion bearing preload. BTW both of them are Timken seals and I know I put it in the right way. It was just very loose. You could put the seal in and have to hold it in place while you put the flange back on. Piece of ****.

 

[roccov12345]

Crush Sleeve anyone Crush Sleeve?

 

[ExplorerDMB]

 

[mechanix]

In my days of working on cars full time I have NEVER changed the crush sle ve when changing the pinion seal, this is new to me. I might add I have NEVER had one come back cause of the rear end was messed up from this. I don't think it is necessary to replace the crush sleeve.

Eric

 

[Creager]

Its considered to be very necessary to replace the crush sleeve. With older bearings its really not as big of a deal for it to be 'loose (preload).' Most guys are going to throw the old crush sleve in there, tighten the pinon nut as tight as it will go. They dont realize its takes 300ftlbs or so to crush the sleve, so they tighten it up to the sleeve. Which in that case its probably fine, a rear end thats seen a a good 100k+ doesn't need to be super tight. But its not good practice to reuse crushsleeves. Esspecially if you are using new parts.

The peice you are talking about that looks like a washer is the oil slingar... that you do not need to replace. Just make sure its CLEAN; all your parts should be kept clean on an OCD level when working on this stuff.

The 2wd and the 4wd rear pinion seals should be identical... not sure why they have different parts? If the seal isnt fitting the bore properly then i would try a different brand. BCA is my personal favorite for this job. Timken makes good bearings, but ive noticed their seals to be less then the best at times.

When you go to the parts store, bring in the pinion flange with you. That plastic part you are talking about is called the dust shield, correct? (check image below) Bring that to the part store with you, and run the seal along the plastic dust shield. Make sure it slips on and off the dust shield and spins around the diameter of it with no effort. Any excess effort to spin (or remove/replace) the seal around the circumfrance of the dust shield is going to cause problems when you go to install it.

---
If you want to put a new crushsleeve in there, read below...

The crush sleeve is right infront of the tail bearing. remove that rear bearing and voila, there it is.

this is the snipit from my gear install directions that talks about setting the pinion bearing preload

You will need a Good breaker bar here. Also an inlb torque wrench that can read as low as 10 inlbs. You probably will want some extra crush sleeves and pinion seals too... Assemble your pinion... shims, inner bearing, crush sleeve, outer bearing, oil slinger, oil seal, pinion flange then finally the OLD pinion nut from your stock gear set. You want to use the old nut to CRUSH the crush sleeve, ill elaborate on this some more in a second...

Start cranking that Nut, it will take a good 200ftlbs to crush that crush sleeve to specification. An impact may only get you so far, but even the ones with like 550ftlb burst fire won’t get that nut as tight as it needs to go. What you are trying to do it shrink that crush sleeve until the bearings are pressed up against the races. Every Quarter turn you put on the pinion nut, tap the pinion with a soft (rubber) hammer. Then use your inlb torque wrench to check the amount of drag that’s on the pinion.

When your preload is close (somewhere like 2-5inlbs), remove the old nut, and start over with the new one. Although it will be MUCH easier the second time around, because the crush sleeve is already crushed. Remember to put some lock-tit on there. The reason its good practice to crush the sleeve with the old nut, is because the threads on the pinion nut taper. The threads on the old nut are worn and will loosen up easily, especially with new bearings. There is some debate on this, and ill go by what I’ve always been taught... and that’s to not re-use the old nut.

It should take 16-29inlbs (on new bearings) to make the pinion move or in other words to correctly preload the pinion bearings. If it goes above that then you have to start over with a new crush sleeve.

It will take about 2 full turns till you close to specification. That’s not exact, you need to check every quarter turn, but once it gets close it happens very quickly. When you feel drag on the pinion, and maybe you are at 4 or 5 inlbs, only a very slight turn is needed; very slight.

You can read the rest here...

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144780

 

[roccov12345]

Its considered to be very necessary to replace the crush sleeve. With older bearings its really not as big of a deal for it to be 'loose (preload).' Most guys are going to throw the old crush sleve in there, tighten the pinon nut as tight as it will go. They dont realize its takes 300ftlbs or so to crush the sleve, so they tighten it up to the sleeve. Which in that case its probably fine, a rear end thats seen a a good 100k+ doesn't need to be super tight. But its not good practice to reuse crushsleeves. Esspecially if you are using new parts.

The peice you are talking about that looks like a washer is the oil slingar... that you do not need to replace. Just make sure its CLEAN; all your parts should be kept clean on an OCD level when working on this stuff.

The 2wd and the 4wd rear pinion seals should be identical... not sure why they have different parts? If the seal isnt fitting the bore properly then i would try a different brand. BCA is my personal favorite for this job. Timken makes good bearings, but ive noticed their seals to be less then the best at times.

When you go to the parts store, bring in the pinion flange with you. That plastic part you are talking about is called the dust shield, correct? (check image below) Bring that to the part store with you, and run the seal along the plastic dust shield. Make sure it slips on and off the dust shield and spins around the diameter of it with no effort. Any excess effort to spin (or remove/replace) the seal around the circumfrance of the dust shield is going to cause problems when you go to install it.

---
If you want to put a new crushsleeve in there, read below...

The crush sleeve is right infront of the tail bearing. remove that rear bearing and voila, there it is.

this is the snipit from my gear install directions that talks about setting the pinion bearing preload



You can read the rest here...

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144780

Thanks Creager, I appreciate all of the info. Big Time. Comes to be that Autozone once again gave me the wrong part. Wrong part number, wrong part. Thanks be to Autozone. She's all fixed and non-leaking. Thanks to all who replied.