Real problem...truck won't move in 2WD, just grinds

dummy · 02-04-2008, 05:02 PM

I'm about to go crawl under my truck (2001 explorer sport V6) and check the driveshaft and joints, but thought I would post here first and come check the responses later.

I have had zero issues with my explorer, 100k miles and going....until yesterday that is.

While driving home from the store I all of a sudden had a loud noise coming from the rear of the car, seemed like a wheel bearing whine. ABS light came on and my truck would pull slightly to the passenger side as well making me think that my caliper locked up. Today I decided to drive it around the block one last time before picking up a caliper just to be sure of what I was feeling down there. Well, 2 blocks from my house my truck REALLY started to grind bad.

I parked and walked around the truck looking at the rotors hoping it was just that locked up caliper.....but none of my rotors have any ground out areas (at least the outside, I am going to check the inside here soon).

Now is where things get really bad. I turned around not wanting to get too far from home....and all of a sudden the truck will not move and I hear a terrible grind from the rear end (I'm in 2WD at this point). I put it in park right away and the grind stops, but as soon as I put it in gear it comes back. Hoping I wouldn't be stuck I put it in 4hi and luckilly my truck got a moving but with a griiiiind..no grind..griiiiind..no grind type of noise. I made it home and jumped on here to search...but no one really has posted about my issue (or I am not able to find it with the right search words).

I don't think it's my drive shaft, wheel bearings, or caliper now....my worst fear is that it's the transfer case. Just looking for advice on what to look for...and if you have had this problem let me know. Thanks.

EDIT:

I should say that I have zero fluids leaking from the truck anywhere.

After checking the truck, there is a little bit of play in the rear driveshaft and absolutely zero in the front one. The front rear driveshaft also has zero play.

The boot between the front rear and the rear driveshaft has no holes, seems to be in pretty good shape for a truck this age.

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 05:21 PM

Yeah could be the transfer case or the rear differential is destroyed. I'm leaning more towards the latter because you said the ABS blinked (theres a sensor at the rear in the differential housing) and the vehicle pulled to the right.

For now, get someone to drive you to the local parts store and pick up 3 quarts of gear oil for the rear axle (80 or 90 weight will work, you're in cold climate) and one tube (at least 2 ounces) of RTV sealant. Then remove the rear axle's cover (put an oil pan under it before you remove the bolts) and inspect the carrier and gears.

If its not already obvious that something is definitely wrong with the rear axle's internals after you remove the cover, take a pic and upload it. Oh and as soon as you remove the differential cover, look at the oil as it flows out. Watch for any metal parts in the oil.

If you must move your vehicle in order to remove the rear differential cover (like into a garage or driveway), remove the rear drive shaft completely from the vehicle and drive the vehicle in 4HI (just go slowly). The rear driveshaft can be removed by a 12-mm 12-point (not 6-poiint) socket.

Gear oil looks like this:

RTV looks like this:

12 point (on the left) versus 6 point (on the right) socket:

Here is the axle cover you want to remove:

What the axle looks like internally:

96eb96 · 02-04-2008, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IZwack

Yeah could be the transfer case or the rear differential is destroyed. I'm leaning more towards the latter because you said the ABS blinked (theres a sensor at the rear in the differential housing) and the vehicle pulled to the right.

For now, get someone to drive you to the local parts store and pick up 3 quarts of gear oil for the rear axle (80 or 90 weight will work, you're in cold climate) and one tube (at least 2 ounces) of RTV sealant. Then remove the rear axle's cover (put an oil pan under it before you remove the bolts) and inspect the carrier and gears.

Wow .. nice pics of your open diff!

Just one FYI, loosen the fill bolt on the differential first. I believe it is located in the drivers side at the top of the diff and uses a 3/8" square drive to get out. You may need some PB blaster. He could be mucho screwed if he opens the diff and can't get the bolt off afterwards to refill it.

Also, instead of the messy RTV I use this...a solid formed gasket. Makes for a bit less mess!

http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...umber=RDS55341

dummy · 02-04-2008, 05:33 PM

Thanks, I'll get to it and get back here with pics in a bit. Truck is already in the garage and up on stands, so no worries there....I pulled it right in when I got it home.

This truck has never been off-road....just a commuter truck. And of course...this is my first issue lol damn.....

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 96eb96

Just one FYI, loosen the fill bolt on the differential first. I believe it is located in the drivers side at the top of the diff and uses a 3/8" square drive to get out. You may need some PB blaster. He could be mucho screwed if he opens the diff and can't get the bolt off afterwards to refill it.

Yes good point!

But no worries, we have a SOLID differential cover dealer in the house (JTSMITH)

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/...d.php?t=200809

Also, one can install a drain plug kit on the original cover (except use it as a fill port) -- which would kind of make filling the differential easier than the original fill plug since the new one would be accessible from the back of the axle. The SOLID differential cover of course already comes with this fill plug at the back.

Kit:

dummy · 02-04-2008, 06:00 PM

Before I get too far (since you guys say it's a big deal if I don't get it off before taking the cover off) I pulled the bolt I believe to be the fill bolt, does it look like it to you? This was on the drivers side toward the front of the diff, right behind the ABS sensor.....

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 06:12 PM

Hehe no thats I believe the bolt that secures the ABS sensor.. look a bit more forward (relative to the vehicle) and lower on the axle. The fill plug takes a 3/8" socket driver (not an actual socket, but the handle of the socket), so it has a square indentation like this:

dummy · 02-04-2008, 07:09 PM

Holy shit - thank god for extensions and breaker bars lol

Well, I got it all apart.....not good news for me.

Here are the pics of the chunks missing off the diff -

And in case you can't see the chunks missing - here's what I pulled out with a quick sweep of the bottom of the pan:

So - I have never messed with a rear end before when it goes out (only to swap in a bigger rear end for my car), so I'm looking for more suggestions....

Since it's pretty obvious that I need a new diff, where do you guys get them from? How difficult is it (and is there a write up) to get this one off and a new one in?

I really appreciate all of the help guys, this forum has become a great resource for me already.....

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 07:17 PM

Wow so the ring gear and probably the pinion gear are done for.

My suggestion for now, and probably the most cost effective depending on where you live, would be to get an axle from a junk yard and just swap that in since thats an easy bolt ins that shouldn't take you more than a few hours -- or if you're lucky enough, you might actually find one on E-bay.

What you're looking for is any Explorer rear axle from 1995-2001 but it must be the same gear ratio as yours. You can not use axles from 91-94 because those came with drum brakes (and what you have are disc brakes). And the 2002 and up axles are not mono-beam or not "solid".

Now how you tell which gear ratio can be done in one of several ways but the easiest is to go to the driver's door, and there is a sticker there with a tiny section labeled "AXLE" and a number under that. In your situation, the code's format will be "DX" where X is any number and the letter D indicates that you have a limited slip rear differential (as indicated by the center "S" preload spring in the differential's carrier unit).

You can try PM-ing the user "kbabiak" -- he is a vendor on the forum and often has a few Explorers for part-out. You can also check out http://car-part.com and find a local salvage or "junk" yard around you with the axle you need.

And BTW, I like the sticker on your gas tank

"GAS" -- I've never seen that before.

*Willard* · 02-04-2008, 07:23 PM

Holy Crap

I kind of wonder how that one happened.

dummy · 02-04-2008, 07:27 PM

Thanks for the help dude, I will likely dig into the phone book tomorrow and find a local one to pick up.

As for the sticker....I know I wouldn't have a clue that was the gas tank unless that sticker was there

Are there any write ups on removing the rear end, or can you tell me what I'm looking at? I like to have a pretty good idea of what I'm doing before I jump under the truck and get to work.....

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 07:29 PM

If you want, go ahead and remove the carrier cap bolts (two per side of the carrier) and pull the carrier out for further inspection. Not that this matters at this point but I'm interested to see what the extent of the damage is.

As for a writeup of removing the rear axle, click on this AutoZone "how to":
http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us...rInfoPages.htm

dummy · 02-04-2008, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devilboy222

Holy Crap

I kind of wonder how that one happened.

I'm curious as to how it happened as well....all of my miles have been highway miles and the truck is never beat on. Such is life, though

I'll get it out and apart tomorrow once I find a replacement. I'm curious to see how much damage is in there, too.

dummy · 02-04-2008, 07:48 PM

One last question:

My axle is a D4 - when I call the junk yard I will tell them that I need a D4 Diff? Just curious if they will understand that, or if I need to use D4 to get the actual gear size of my truck for when I call.

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 08:04 PM

Look over this really quick:
http://www.explorerforum.com/ntrprize/Axle.htm

In your situation:

The "D" means you have a limited slip differential (as I mentioned in an earlier post I think)
the 4 means the gear ratio is 3.73:1 (or just 3.73 for simplicity).

So when you call up a junk yard, it would be ideal if you are able to get a hold of a D4. But if all you can find is a 3.73 axle that isnt limited slip (code 46 in that chart), then that will work too. So when you call up a junk yard, what you're asking for is an axle that is 3.73 ratio from a 95-01 Explorer (doesn't matter which engine or transmission). If its a Limited Slip (some people call it a "posi", and about 20 other names), then thats even better.

And just so I dont have to say "told you so", when you have the vehicle supported by jackstands on the frame, be very careful (your life depends on it!) and before you get under the vehicle after setting it on jackstands, shake it a little to make sure the chassis is not just on the verge of crashing down onto the floor. Put the tires you removed (including the spare tire) under the vehicle and anything else that might help catch the vehicle in case it falls

*Willard* · 02-04-2008, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dummy

I'm curious as to how it happened as well....all of my miles have been highway miles and the truck is never beat on. Such is life, though

I'll get it out and apart tomorrow once I find a replacement. I'm curious to see how much damage is in there, too.

I'm wondering if there was a manufacturing defect or something. Not very many 8.8's break for no reason.

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 08:35 PM

My guess is:

The pinion gear was loose (bearing worn, etc..) and was not taken care of. You can kind of see that most of the break is on the outer edge of the ring gear, which means the pinion had an improper depth (as in it was loose) -- so the when he stepped on the infamous pedal of doom (gas pedal), the pinion might have "walked" the ring gear and then snapped a tooth or just snapped a tooth w/o even "walking". And after a tooth breaks, everything just goes wack from there.

dummy · 02-04-2008, 08:40 PM

How would I know that the bearings were going out? I'm curious so that I can avoid this in the future......

Oh - as for the possibility that I hit it hard on a snowbank....very unlikely. If I am in any form of snow I drop it in 4wd and get out slowly.....you would think I was a grandma the way I drive honestly. We did get quite a bit of snow so far this year, but I haven't driven the truck since we got it (I have another car and only use the Explorer on occasions now)

Either way, I would definitely be game for finding out how to avoid this next time lol

**IZwack** · 02-04-2008, 08:44 PM

A loose pinion kind of sounds like a small marble rattling in a tin can when you let off of the gas after accelerating and the vehicle coasts. I'm not sure you'll attribute this sound to something mechanically wrong with the vehicle because if you're running on snowy roads (good ol "windy city"), you'll probably think its just road debris hitting the underside of the vehicle or something.

Glacier991 · 02-04-2008, 09:00 PM

IZWACK is my CO-Moderator. Holy crap that guy really knows his stuff. One of the most helpful replies I have seen on this board. A big hand for my CO-Mod (Who has had to carry the load here all alone for a few months!) Great pics.

Dummy ... welcome to the board... that advice was priceless, hope you might consider joining us as a member, we'd love to have you.

02-04-2008, 05:02 PM	#1
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	Real problem...truck won't move in 2WD, just grinds I'm about to go crawl under my truck (2001 explorer sport V6) and check the driveshaft and joints, but thought I would post here first and come check the responses later. I have had zero issues with my explorer, 100k miles and going....until yesterday that is. While driving home from the store I all of a sudden had a loud noise coming from the rear of the car, seemed like a wheel bearing whine. ABS light came on and my truck would pull slightly to the passenger side as well making me think that my caliper locked up. Today I decided to drive it around the block one last time before picking up a caliper just to be sure of what I was feeling down there. Well, 2 blocks from my house my truck REALLY started to grind bad. I parked and walked around the truck looking at the rotors hoping it was just that locked up caliper.....but none of my rotors have any ground out areas (at least the outside, I am going to check the inside here soon). Now is where things get really bad. I turned around not wanting to get too far from home....and all of a sudden the truck will not move and I hear a terrible grind from the rear end (I'm in 2WD at this point). I put it in park right away and the grind stops, but as soon as I put it in gear it comes back. Hoping I wouldn't be stuck I put it in 4hi and luckilly my truck got a moving but with a griiiiind..no grind..griiiiind..no grind type of noise. I made it home and jumped on here to search...but no one really has posted about my issue (or I am not able to find it with the right search words). I don't think it's my drive shaft, wheel bearings, or caliper now....my worst fear is that it's the transfer case. Just looking for advice on what to look for...and if you have had this problem let me know. Thanks. EDIT: I should say that I have zero fluids leaking from the truck anywhere. After checking the truck, there is a little bit of play in the rear driveshaft and absolutely zero in the front one. The front rear driveshaft also has zero play. The boot between the front rear and the rear driveshaft has no holes, seems to be in pretty good shape for a truck this age. Last edited by dummy; 02-04-2008 at 05:16 PM.

02-04-2008, 05:21 PM	#2
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	Yeah could be the transfer case or the rear differential is destroyed. I'm leaning more towards the latter because you said the ABS blinked (theres a sensor at the rear in the differential housing) and the vehicle pulled to the right. For now, get someone to drive you to the local parts store and pick up 3 quarts of gear oil for the rear axle (80 or 90 weight will work, you're in cold climate) and one tube (at least 2 ounces) of RTV sealant. Then remove the rear axle's cover (put an oil pan under it before you remove the bolts) and inspect the carrier and gears. If its not already obvious that something is definitely wrong with the rear axle's internals after you remove the cover, take a pic and upload it. Oh and as soon as you remove the differential cover, look at the oil as it flows out. Watch for any metal parts in the oil. If you must move your vehicle in order to remove the rear differential cover (like into a garage or driveway), remove the rear drive shaft completely from the vehicle and drive the vehicle in 4HI (just go slowly). The rear driveshaft can be removed by a 12-mm 12-point (not 6-poiint) socket. Gear oil looks like this: RTV looks like this: 12 point (on the left) versus 6 point (on the right) socket: Here is the axle cover you want to remove: What the axle looks like internally: __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there?

02-04-2008, 06:12 PM	#7
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	Hehe no thats I believe the bolt that secures the ABS sensor.. look a bit more forward (relative to the vehicle) and lower on the axle. The fill plug takes a 3/8" socket driver (not an actual socket, but the handle of the socket), so it has a square indentation like this: __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there?

02-04-2008, 07:17 PM	#9
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	Wow so the ring gear and probably the pinion gear are done for. My suggestion for now, and probably the most cost effective depending on where you live, would be to get an axle from a junk yard and just swap that in since thats an easy bolt ins that shouldn't take you more than a few hours -- or if you're lucky enough, you might actually find one on E-bay. What you're looking for is any Explorer rear axle from 1995-2001 but it must be the same gear ratio as yours. You can not use axles from 91-94 because those came with drum brakes (and what you have are disc brakes). And the 2002 and up axles are not mono-beam or not "solid". Now how you tell which gear ratio can be done in one of several ways but the easiest is to go to the driver's door, and there is a sticker there with a tiny section labeled "AXLE" and a number under that. In your situation, the code's format will be "DX" where X is any number and the letter D indicates that you have a limited slip rear differential (as indicated by the center "S" preload spring in the differential's carrier unit). You can try PM-ing the user "kbabiak" -- he is a vendor on the forum and often has a few Explorers for part-out. You can also check out http://car-part.com and find a local salvage or "junk" yard around you with the axle you need. And BTW, I like the sticker on your gas tank "GAS" -- I've never seen that before. __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there?

02-04-2008, 07:23 PM	#10
Willard Elite tree-smasher Bloomington, Indiana 04 Ranger Edge Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 3,291 Vehicle Specs	Holy Crap I kind of wonder how that one happened. __________________ Jesse '94 Eddie Bauer DD/Beater "Old Faithful" RIP '04 Ranger Edge DD "Black Knight" You want to see my face?

02-04-2008, 05:33 PM	#4
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	Thanks, I'll get to it and get back here with pics in a bit. Truck is already in the garage and up on stands, so no worries there....I pulled it right in when I got it home. This truck has never been off-road....just a commuter truck. And of course...this is my first issue lol damn.....

02-04-2008, 06:00 PM	#6
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	Before I get too far (since you guys say it's a big deal if I don't get it off before taking the cover off) I pulled the bolt I believe to be the fill bolt, does it look like it to you? This was on the drivers side toward the front of the diff, right behind the ABS sensor.....

02-04-2008, 07:09 PM	#8
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	Holy shit - thank god for extensions and breaker bars lol Well, I got it all apart.....not good news for me. Here are the pics of the chunks missing off the diff - And in case you can't see the chunks missing - here's what I pulled out with a quick sweep of the bottom of the pan: So - I have never messed with a rear end before when it goes out (only to swap in a bigger rear end for my car), so I'm looking for more suggestions.... Since it's pretty obvious that I need a new diff, where do you guys get them from? How difficult is it (and is there a write up) to get this one off and a new one in? I really appreciate all of the help guys, this forum has become a great resource for me already.....

02-04-2008, 07:27 PM	#11
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	Thanks for the help dude, I will likely dig into the phone book tomorrow and find a local one to pick up. As for the sticker....I know I wouldn't have a clue that was the gas tank unless that sticker was there Are there any write ups on removing the rear end, or can you tell me what I'm looking at? I like to have a pretty good idea of what I'm doing before I jump under the truck and get to work.....

02-04-2008, 07:29 PM	#12
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	If you want, go ahead and remove the carrier cap bolts (two per side of the carrier) and pull the carrier out for further inspection. Not that this matters at this point but I'm interested to see what the extent of the damage is. As for a writeup of removing the rear axle, click on this AutoZone "how to": http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us...rInfoPages.htm __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there?

02-04-2008, 07:48 PM	#14
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	One last question: My axle is a D4 - when I call the junk yard I will tell them that I need a D4 Diff? Just curious if they will understand that, or if I need to use D4 to get the actual gear size of my truck for when I call.

02-04-2008, 08:04 PM	#15
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	Look over this really quick: http://www.explorerforum.com/ntrprize/Axle.htm In your situation: The "D" means you have a limited slip differential (as I mentioned in an earlier post I think) the 4 means the gear ratio is 3.73:1 (or just 3.73 for simplicity). So when you call up a junk yard, it would be ideal if you are able to get a hold of a D4. But if all you can find is a 3.73 axle that isnt limited slip (code 46 in that chart), then that will work too. So when you call up a junk yard, what you're asking for is an axle that is 3.73 ratio from a 95-01 Explorer (doesn't matter which engine or transmission). If its a Limited Slip (some people call it a "posi", and about 20 other names), then thats even better. And just so I dont have to say "told you so", when you have the vehicle supported by jackstands on the frame, be very careful (your life depends on it!) and before you get under the vehicle after setting it on jackstands, shake it a little to make sure the chassis is not just on the verge of crashing down onto the floor. Put the tires you removed (including the spare tire) under the vehicle and anything else that might help catch the vehicle in case it falls __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there? Last edited by IZwack; 02-04-2008 at 09:08 PM.

02-04-2008, 08:35 PM	#17
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	My guess is: The pinion gear was loose (bearing worn, etc..) and was not taken care of. You can kind of see that most of the break is on the outer edge of the ring gear, which means the pinion had an improper depth (as in it was loose) -- so the when he stepped on the infamous pedal of doom (gas pedal), the pinion might have "walked" the ring gear and then snapped a tooth or just snapped a tooth w/o even "walking". And after a tooth breaks, everything just goes wack from there. __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there?

02-04-2008, 08:40 PM	#18
dummy Wannabe Elite Explorer Chicago 2001 Explorer Sport Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 23 Vehicle Specs (Original Poster)	How would I know that the bearings were going out? I'm curious so that I can avoid this in the future...... Oh - as for the possibility that I hit it hard on a snowbank....very unlikely. If I am in any form of snow I drop it in 4wd and get out slowly.....you would think I was a grandma the way I drive honestly. We did get quite a bit of snow so far this year, but I haven't driven the truck since we got it (I have another car and only use the Explorer on occasions now) Either way, I would definitely be game for finding out how to avoid this next time lol

02-04-2008, 08:44 PM	#19
IZwack Germantown, MD Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 22,381 Vehicle Specs	A loose pinion kind of sounds like a small marble rattling in a tin can when you let off of the gas after accelerating and the vehicle coasts. I'm not sure you'll attribute this sound to something mechanically wrong with the vehicle because if you're running on snowy roads (good ol "windy city"), you'll probably think its just road debris hitting the underside of the vehicle or something. __________________ »»»»»...how'd the moon get there, how'd the moon get there? Last edited by IZwack; 02-04-2008 at 08:56 PM.

02-04-2008, 09:00 PM	#20
Glacier991 EF Tranny Guru Sacramento, CA 95827 1992 XLT Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 9,823 Vehicle Specs	IZWACK is my CO-Moderator. Holy crap that guy really knows his stuff. One of the most helpful replies I have seen on this board. A big hand for my CO-Mod (Who has had to carry the load here all alone for a few months!) Great pics. Dummy ... welcome to the board... that advice was priceless, hope you might consider joining us as a member, we'd love to have you.