05 F150 shifting woes - 4R75E w/70,000 mi.

I have a 05 F150 with 70k. For the last few days I have been having issues with the 1-2 shift and when using the OD off button. Both issues only seem to happen when the trans is warm. When I take off from a stop I get going and when the truck shifts from 1-2 I get a "neutral" like feel for a moment and then it slams into 2nd. It will continue to shift into OD with out any other problems. During the same trip I was playing with the OD selector button to see if there are any other issues, and come to find out there is one. While I have the OD selector switch off the trans will "hunt" from drive to OD. Now this could be torque converter lock up and but the RPM's drop 400 RPM's or so. At times when I merge onto the highway it almost seems like the engine is running like a raped ape, but I am not moving as fast as the engine would seem.

What it sounds to me is some place I am loosing pressure and the trans is having a hard time holding the gear. I have looked at the dipstick and the oil is full and red. Ford doesn't recommend changing the fluid until 150k, for me this seems waaaaaaaaaay to long.

Any help or comments would be most grateful.

Eric

A bit of an update. I lost all forward gears, but still have reverse. Is this the same style trans that is in the Explorer? I was thinking of using the rebuild threads in this forum.

Sorry to hear about your problems on such a low mileage trans.

Yes the 4R75E is a slightly beefier (planetary got beefed up) 4R70W , with a different gearing than the W - but for rebuild pusposes it is the same one in the rebuild thread.

Your symptoms certainly sound like a pressure issue to me. Put a gauge on the line pressure tap and find out what you get...

While pressure issues can be related to a clogged filter (unlikely it seems given your description of the fluid) Given your history I am more leaning towards a valve body issue... or a blown gasket ...

The first step is to investigate your pressures and go from there. Don't be in too big a hurry for a rebuild quite yet.

So I did a line pressure test.

Idle 50 Spec 30-65
Drive 120 Spec 50-110
Reverse 150 Spec 80-150

I tested this in the am when it was cold and I noticed it did move under it own power in D but it had a shudder a major shudder.

I have heard of some bad luck with F-150 Trans. Which dosn't make me happy to here, sense I tow with mine I guess I should make sure the Explorer is set up to tow, so in worse case sanario, I could swap spots, to get somewhere I don't think my supercrew is going to fit on my 14' trailer though

That stinks...I know 4 people with newer-style F150's, 2 with almost 200K on the odometer and not one of them have had a trans issue, or really any issue to speak of. GREAT trucks.

I wonder how much $$$ this site has kept away from incompetent or crooked tranny shops who are quick to say REBUILD before ever really diagnosing the problem, for instance VALVE BODIES.

For me, 250$ to Central Valve Bodies instantly remedied my tranny woes, and I sure had more than one.

Well for me I have been inside transmissions and have rebuilt a few. Some good luck and some bad. In this case I think something inside come loose like a one way clutch. I assume if I had good pressure and a shudder still something in side is not holding the way it should. I think I am going to remove the trans and tear into it and see what I can find. Maybe order a Trans Go shift improver and install it too. I have read where the shift improver kit helps with fluid pressure lose and firms up the shift and makes them snappy. This trans did shift good, but I like a firm shift not a slushy shift. I am going to wait till Glacier chimes in again but I think my assumptions are correct.

Eric

This am I dropped the pan to see what I can find. I found some burnt fluid and some bright sparkly stuff, also some brass looking stuffs too. I am in the process of pulling the trans and should have it out in an hour. I was pinned under the tcase for a min.. almost shat myself. lol

Eric

Well the trans is out. What a PITA. I wish a Ford Engineer was with me when I pulled it. They routed the exhaust behind the trans but before the tcase. Great idea right? NOT. I need bout 2 more inches to get it out. From what I can tell they want you to remove the right side exhaust pipe that runs from the manifold, over to the drivers side and then back to the back of the truck. I think even a well placed dent in the pipe would have helped.

So now I will remove the valve body and then start on the insides of the trans. I will try to take some pictures as I go. I am not very good at stopping at key points and taking a snap shot, but for the sake of this thread I will.

Eric

Today to started to disect the transmission. I removed the valve body, the accumulator pistions that are in the case. Pulled the pump out and that is where things got interesting. There is a big snap ring that is supposed to hold the front clutch pack together.


Then I continued to remove the rest of the internal components. Next problem I found was a sun gear that was smoked and the clutch pack that was seated against it was burnt up too.


Now on to the rest of the trans. I was pulling the rest of the componets out of the trans and came to a spot that I had a hard time getting out. The ears of this gear are supposed to be meshed with the case. They where but one of them bent causing it the lodge its self in the case. I had a hell of a time getting it out of the case.

Hello Eric, I see that you are well along at having it all apart. I agree that any valve body kit would help, and may have been an answer. That front locking ring though does sound like an issue that I've read about. That is there is an aftermarket locking pieces(s) which are to prevent the premature failure of that OEM snap ring. I think that it's the same part as I've read of in the TCCOA articles.

I am about to begin assembling mine, and that snap ring may be wise for us to buy to finish things. Look over all of your case bushings and bearings. Take and post lots of pictures, it will help me and others. I hope to get deep into mine this week. I bought a high performance rebuild kit that has Raybestos reds, and Kolene steels. There are a lot of opinions, and I have not decided yet about the wavy plate either. You have the thickest wavy plate in yours. Some people choose to use that, and others choose to use none, adding an extra friction/steel without it.

Question, Chris mentioned a different gear ratio for the 4R75W planetary. Did I misread that because I thought that they were the same 2.84:1 ratio?

CDW6212R said:

Hello Eric, I see that you are well along at having it all apart. I agree that any valve body kit would help, and may have been an answer. That front locking ring though does sound like an issue that I've read about. That is there is an aftermarket locking pieces(s) which are to prevent the premature failure of that OEM snap ring. I think that it's the same part as I've read of in the TCCOA articles.

I am about to begin assembling mine, and that snap ring may be wise for us to buy to finish things. Look over all of your case bushings and bearings. Take and post lots of pictures, it will help me and others. I hope to get deep into mine this week. I bought a high performance rebuild kit that has Raybestos reds, and Kolene steels. There are a lot of opinions, and I have not decided yet about the wavy plate either. You have the thickest wavy plate in yours. Some people choose to use that, and others choose to use none, adding an extra friction/steel without it.

Question, Chris mentioned a different gear ratio for the 4R75W planetary. Did I misread that because I thought that they were the same 2.84:1 ratio?

Click to expand...

To be honest I have not gotten into any of the specs of this trans as far as ratios and such. I wasent planning on even rebuilding this trans, but it took a dump on me so I really have no choice. I am still trying to find parts that I know will work and be reliable. I sent Glacier a pm, maybe he can chime in and shed some light on some of the gray areas we are unsure about.

The locking snap ring does seem to be a big issue with this trans from what I have read. I for sure will be upgrading that along with other items too.

Eric, I ran across this Sonnax kit while looking for that special intermediate snap ring. It is evidently part of the kit, which I did buy with all of my other parts. I'd recommend almost any Sonnax part, this kit likely has the main items, and many places carry it. Night,

http://www.sonnax.com/announcements/SC-AODE-96.pdf

Good find on the snap ring.

This is a supplier I found. http://www.transmissioncenter.net/aode.htm#Torque Converters

This seems to be a good supplier of trans parts. I have no clue about there service. Maybe someone else can chime in and suggest a good supplier for parts.

Oh, about the snap ring. I have seen a few variations of it. Also kinda curious about this to see what is the "best" design.


Eric

Yes, I found a version of that intermediate snap ring by Sonnax, Alto, and one unnamed on eBay.

That supplier is one of the best, I bought my reverse drum and $160 intermediate shaft. They are fast at getting parts shipped out. I got most of my stuff from Edge where I got the torque converter, and Ford or eBay depending on prices.

Look over the case and hard parts first, those take the longest to deal with. Regards,

I highly recommend that "mechanical diode" locking ring....as with most things Sonnax. It is covered in the 4R70W rebuild diary in the "reverse clutch" portion of the Diary. The intermediate clutch does not use anything like that, though the mechanical diode forms the splines the intermediate plates ride on.

I think you misunderstood Don.... the 4R75W planetary did not, to my knowledge, have any different gearing, was just a little more robust and that is where the 70 be came a 75. You CAN drop a new 75 planetary into an old 70 and take advantage of it, at a price of about $475 from FORD. It IS reverse compatible....if the extra 50 foot lbs is worth that to you.

This thread is proof positive of the value of the spiral locking ring on that mechanical diode. (I Hate that term btw - and I get it....)

Glacier...

ps. I gave BLOOD for that spiral ring..... first time I used one... be careful thay can be sharp.

Thanks Chris, I just read someone here recently use the word ratio about the 4R75W planetary. Okay so the term for the part is mechanical diode locking ring.

FYI, the 4R75W and the matching sun gear and shell went up at Ford, almost doubled. I got the planetary off of eBay For $200, about what Ford used to charge. Regards,

CDW6212R said:

Thanks Chris, I just read someone here recently use the word ratio about the 4R75W planetary. Okay so the term for the part is mechanical diode locking ring.

FYI, the 4R75W and the matching sun gear and shell went up at Ford, almost doubled. I got the planetary off of eBay For $200, about what Ford used to charge. Regards,

Click to expand...

CDW I think this is what you are refering to:

AOD / AODE to 4R70W Close Ratio Conversion Kit. This kit will convert your first gear ratio from 2.40 (AOD) to 2.84 (4R70W). This kit also makes it possible to use the wider 4R70W overdrive band. Cost $316.00

It was somewhere else that a member used the term wider ratio with the 4R75W trans, compared to a 4R70W. It's no big deal at all, Ford just makes it interesting.

How are you coming there? Have you got it all apart, and what other damage did you find besides the mechanical diode? I got that reverse drum with it for about $135 on eBay.

CDW6212R said:

It was somewhere else that a member used the term wider ratio with the 4R75W trans, compared to a 4R70W. It's no big deal at all, Ford just makes it interesting.

How are you coming there? Have you got it all apart, and what other damage did you find besides the mechanical diode? I got that reverse drum with it for about $135 on eBay.

Click to expand...

I have had it all torn down sense Sunday. I don't feel I burnt any clutch packs and I am in the process of locating the hard parts I need inside. Only concerns I have is getting some of the clutch packs apart and back together again with out a problem. I don't have the seal protectors or any of the special tools used to compress the springs. I do have a shop press that I am sure I can figure out something to get to work. Also I don't have the tools used to install the bushings. I was thinking of ordering a repair manual for the trans to aid in the assembly.The only carnage I have is what I have posted in this thread. When I get it installed I plan on using a spin on oil filter kit installed in the return line to catch any debris that flushing might miss.