negative battery terminal cable keeps coming loose 2002 XLT 4.6L 4WD

[LMHmedchem]

Hello,

For some reason the negative terminal battery cable connector will not stay on and keeps popping off. Yesterday I just bumped the cable with my arm and that was enough for the cable to come off. The bolt is as tight as I can get it and the connector looks as closed as it can go. I have some dielectric grease on both the terminal and connector to keep to corrosion down, but I have always done this on every battery I have ever had and it has never caused an issue.

The battery is fairly new, so the terminal should not be worn down or anything like that.

Are there any suggestions on what to do? The connector doesn't seem to be easily replaceable like some I have had before.

LMHmedchem

 

[BKennedy]

Notch the terminal so it can clamp tighter on the post

 

[LMHmedchem]

Notch the terminal so it can clamp tighter on the post

Sorry for being obtuse but I can't exactly visualize what you mean.

What you suggest sounds about right but where would I cut a notch and how big? How would that help when the metal is already touching at the point where the loop closes and the bolt goes through? I can't see anywhere where cutting it would make it tighter. The style of connector that is on there is the kind with the thin metal ring, not the heavy style bale with a bolt through it.

Mine looks sort of like this,

Duralast Top Post Battery Terminal DL01045

where the bolt is threaded in as far as possible. The ends of the metal ring between the bolt and nut are already touching. Where could I cut this to make it fit tighter? I thought about wrapping the post in copper wire or something like that but that seems a bit iffy.


LMHmedchem

 

[BKennedy]

Sorry, if it looks like the link, you need to replace it. Sounds like it was overtightened and stretched out. The thick traditional terminals, you can widen the space that collapses as you tighten the bolt. I also have never heard of someone putting dielectric grease on the battery lugs themselves. I have seen people coat then after the terminal is tightened. Don't see how it would stay attached.

 

[boominXplorer]

If the terminal is still good you can remove it and squeeze the center with vice grips and oval it out. Then when it goes back on it will bend tighter around the post.

They also make caps you can put ontop of a worn out post to tighten it up.

 

[Number4]

They make battery post shims.

 

[Bazz270]

Ive replaced mine with Mil spec Humvee ones..strongly recommended.

 

[LMHmedchem]

I also have never heard of someone putting dielectric grease on the battery lugs themselves. I have seen people coat then after the terminal is tightened. Don't see how it would stay attached.

I have always done it this way. That doesn't mean that it a correct procedure by any means but I just got tired of all the corrosion. It does really help in that regard. I haven't replaced dozens of batteries, but more than a few. I put a dab of grease on the post and smear it around and also a dab on the inside of the terminal ring. I put the felt ring on and smear some grease on that. Finally, I attach the terminal and then smear grease over the whole thing. Admittedly, the layer on the post is very thin. There is quite a bit more over the top at the end.

Corrosion tends to happen more at the positive terminal but I put grease on both. This is the first time I have ever had an issue.

Sounds like it was overtightened and stretched out.

I think that this is likely the answer. I have had the negative off over and over again doing repairs and I probably wasn't careful enough putting it back on. The battery is less than a year old, so there is no chance that the post has worn or corroded.

They make battery post shims.

I was thinking of making something like this with a piece of copper pipe but for a few dollars I think this is the quickest solution.

Ive replaced mine with Mil spec Humvee ones..strongly recommended.

My problem at the moment is that it was 7 degrees out yesterday with a wind chill of -15. Today it is a balmy 17 degrees but still a wind chill below 0. The terminals on my battery cables don't disconnect with a bolt like some do. They seem to be pressed and then covered with heavy heat shrink. I don't think it will be a quick job to replace them and I don't feel like trying something outside that I can't do wearing gloves and will take more than a few minutes. I almost had to get back in the truck in the middle of getting gas yesterday. You would think that I would be used to this by now but I tend to go into hibernation mode when it gets below 10 degrees. Number4's suggestion of post shims is a bit more appealing under the current conditions.

Do you have a link for the terminals you used?

LMHmedchem

 

[Bazz270]

Sure.Ive overtighten and broken my previous terminal set cause of seized battery positive terminal ( and i have no way to find any kind of battery shim here in local hardware shops)

But those are really heavy duty ones.also could be found in the armored F550 trucks.


Amazon product ASIN B07JJKVHD1

 

[BKennedy]

Anything "milspec" just means the lowest bidder that met the lowest qualifying parameters. You can get terminals that look identical to those at Wal-Mart for about $5.

 

[Tsani]

I have always done it this way. That doesn't mean that it a correct procedure by any means but I just got tired of all the corrosion. It does really help in that regard. I haven't replaced dozens of batteries, but more than a few. I put a dab of grease on the post and smear it around and also a dab on the inside of the terminal ring. I put the felt ring on and smear some grease on that. Finally, I attach the terminal and then smear grease over the whole thing. Admittedly, the layer on the post is very thin. There is quite a bit more over the top at the end.

Corrosion tends to happen more at the positive terminal but I put grease on both. This is the first time I have ever had an issue.


I think that this is likely the answer. I have had the negative off over and over again doing repairs and I probably wasn't careful enough putting it back on. The battery is less than a year old, so there is no chance that the post has worn or corroded.


I was thinking of making something like this with a piece of copper pipe but for a few dollars I think this is the quickest solution.


My problem at the moment is that it was 7 degrees out yesterday with a wind chill of -15. Today it is a balmy 17 degrees but still a wind chill below 0. The terminals on my battery cables don't disconnect with a bolt like some do. They seem to be pressed and then covered with heavy heat shrink. I don't think it will be a quick job to replace them and I don't feel like trying something outside that I can't do wearing gloves and will take more than a few minutes. I almost had to get back in the truck in the middle of getting gas yesterday. You would think that I would be used to this by now but I tend to go into hibernation mode when it gets below 10 degrees. Number4's suggestion of post shims is a bit more appealing under the current conditions.

Do you have a link for the terminals you used?

LMHmedchem

While It may be a newish battery but that does not mean the post is not undersized. Secondly, the type of clamp shown in your photo is well known to develop this issue due to stretching of the metal. Keep in mind thay you should never completely close the gap at the bolt side as you need some to help with keeping the connection tight. Quality of that type of clamp varies widely.
Can’t tell you how many of this type connector I have seen done this way and was able to just pull the connection off by hand.

I would suggest you change the clamp and/or use the terminal sleeve.

Applying the paste/gel the way you do should not be a problem. It is a mechanical problem. As an electrician, we do a lot of connections this way, even on diesel generators. We use a paste that promotes conductivity as well as protect from oxidation. I use it (called coppersheild btw) on my vehicle battery connections and have never had an issue. The typical auto battery connection clean bright metal to metal and then seal with anti oxidant. Either method should be fine provided the mechanical connection is solid. Another thing we do is to use two spring type lock washers, one below the bolt head and one at the nut side. This applies constant tension on the nut and bolt and keeps it from creeping loose. Of course this can also be solved with a locking nut.

 

[Bazz270]

Anything "milspec" just means the lowest bidder that met the lowest qualifying parameters. You can get terminals that look identical to those at Wal-Mart for about $5.

No idea what kind of terminals sold in Walmart cause we dont have one here in Israel.

Maybe they are really the same.Only sharing my personal experience.

You guys free to purchase whatever you want.

 

[Mbrooks420]

As a quick fix, strip a short piece of wire and clamp that in there to take up space. I prefer audio style terminals, but popular opinion is that they are terrible.

 

[RangerNutt]

Nobody mentioned this sooo...

First, confirming that's the OEM terminal design; a cheap, thin ring that stretches and eventually breaks. For permanent replacement, I'd go with the heavy, traditional cable end that lasts forever.

To instead keep the thin ring, and this may sound jicky but it works, a fix is to measure and cut a piece of plumber's tape, then wrap it around (over) the terminal, securing with the same hardware except possibly adding a washer or two on the outside if needed for tension.

Discovered this trick upon needing to make an emergency repair in winter. (The ring was completely severed.) Planned to 'do it right' when summer came, but forgot. Then lost track of how many years went by with no problems. Finally got disturbed at the third-world appearance so did the replacement, but it was still working fine at that time.

Lastly, what @Tsani said about the conductive paste. Personally, I do conductive on the entire battery terminal and inside the cable terminal, non-conductive on the outside, but don't think it matters. After some minor problems with dielectric grease (which is non-conductive), I would never use it again on battery terminals or inside mating surfaces.

So a few more choices for you.

 

[mountaineer2004]

Just get the battery post shim and be done with it. You're really overthinking this.

 

[BKennedy]

If you do a search on eBay, there are hundreds of shims listed.

 

[LMHmedchem]

Just get the battery post shim and be done with it. You're really overthinking this.

Though I often have this tendency, it is not so in this case. I got the post shims several days ago but just have not had time to install them or reply here. They cost $3 at NAPA so that is what I went with.

No idea what kind of terminals sold in Walmart cause we don't have one here in Israel. Maybe they are really the same.Only sharing my personal experience. You guys free to purchase whatever you want.

I will replace these at some point. My general perspective is that everything on a 20 year old truck will need to be replaced at some point, it's just a matter of the order based on necessity and convenience. It doesn't look like there is any easy way to get the old terminal off, meaning it isn't held on with a bolt like some are. It looks like a large crimp covered with heat shrink. I will have to replace that with a new fitting which probably means some soldering. I will do that in a few months when the weather starts to be more reasonable.

Personally, I do conductive on the entire battery terminal and inside the cable terminal, non-conductive on the outside, but don't think it matters. After some minor problems with dielectric grease (which is non-conductive), I would never use it again on battery terminals or inside mating surfaces.

Even though dielectric grease is not conductive, it is not particularly resistive either. There are studies that show that resistance across the connection is not increased by dielectric grease. I would probably qualify this by saying that such studies involve relatively high voltage/high amperage power sources with large surface area connections. I believe that they also applied only a very thin layer on the connecting surfaces. For something like a car battery, a small amount of resistance is negligible. You will probably get worse resistance from the accumulation of corrosion. I am much more careful when applying dielectric grease to a small connection fitting like the ABS sensor cables. There is a very small amount of signal in those lines so resistance relative to signal is more of a concern. In those cases, I am careful to keep the grease off of the actual connectors. It just goes at the edge of the plastic housing where it seals. I would use a conductive paste for the battery terminals if I had some, but I probably won't go out and buy it for this.

I always use a wire brush wheel on a drill (or some Emory paper) to clean up the post and a straight wire brush to hone the inside of the connector and get it nice and bright. I think that helps with the connection but it may have also contributed to it loosening over time.

The wind chill has been -15 to -20 the last two days. It's warmer today by there is a monsoon going on at the moment. Hopefully I will be able to do a little work tomorrow.

LMHmedchem

 

[Tsani]

Another thing to watch for, especially since you mentioned soldering, is corrosion in the conductor strands. Plays heck with soldering. And if bad enough, you may need to cut back on the cable and if there is not enough slack, then it’s cable changing fun times.

 

[Tsani]

Oh, and I don’t have an issue with using dielectric grease. Works ok but I find purpose made conductive paste to be even better. But my mechanic buddy hates it. The stuff is like anti seize and gets every where. lol.

 

[LMHmedchem]

I did manage to get the post shims installed yesterday after it stopped raining. I had to take the battery out to get at the ABS lines so it seemed like a good time. Both terminals seem very tight now so it looks like the shims will work, at least until the terminals brake.

I will replace the terminals when the weather warms up.

The heavier style connectors that have been posted here seem to require a ring terminal connector to go around the bolt on the terminal. Something like,

AWG-3/8" Heavy Duty Copper Crimp Ring Terminals with Heat Shrink Tubing ($11)

Can anyone recommend something for this, preferably that doesn't come only in a 10 pack? Is copper the preferred material?

This is what I would crimp and then solder onto the battery cables (which I think are gauge 6).

This kit looks alright and seems to have everything,

Ampper Military Spec Battery Terminal Top Post Kit ($20.97)

This is a bit pricey for some battery terminals but I would expect it would be at least half that for decent terminals and the connectors.

LMHmedchem