2000 Explorer blows #26 fuse HELP!!!!

[budwich]

Thar ya go.... great

 

[malawiman79]

Awsome R146Rick you got it figured out!!! I'm going back at it today, took a few days off to work on other stuff, and realized I can work on electronics, put in a remote start for a buddy!!! I think I can I think I can

 

[malawiman79]

Unplugged GEM and windows quit working whether key is on or not. Battery goes dead after sitting a few hours. There has to be a wiring or relay problem and I jsut can't find it Gonna start checking the back side of the relay box again, something is being left triggered for the windows and blower motor to keep working with no key!!

 

[budwich]

OK... so you are getting somewhere.... maybe. You know that pulling the GEM stops the windows from working with key out... good.... sorry about the battery issue. Now you need to continue slowly along. Put the GEM back in. Hopefully, the windows remain dead... right??? They should.... if not, this symptom is the source of another issue probably relating to the dead battery.

 

[R146Rick]

malawiman79
Don't know if this will help, but I took 2 (one big & one small) old relays cut the top off and soldered about 20 inches of wire to each pin, tagged wire with pin # to make test plugs for the relay module box.
It made it easier for me to test the wiring for the different circuits off the relay module.
R146rick

 

[R146Rick]

malawiman79,

From what I understand from the power windows diagrams, the Accessory Delay Relay control the power to the windows.
Pin 86 from the Battery relay Pin #3 (Fuse #26 source to energize ACC Delay Relay)
Pin 85 From the GEM Pin #17 (Control of the Accessory Relay)
Pin 87 from Battery fuse #4 30A ( Power source to window switches & one touch down relay thru pin #30)
Pin 30 to window switch & One Touch Down Relay pin #2.

If #26 fuse is blown and windows still work check One Touch Down Relay & it's wiring.
Pulling the GEM will stop the One Touch Down Relay From Working also .

If # 26 fuse is blown (One Touch Down Relay) Pin #2 & # 5 should have no power.
(Acc Delay Relay) Pin #86 should have no power.
(Acc Delay Relay) Pin #87 Hot at all times
(Acc Delay Relay) Pin #30 should only have power when Pin # 86 is Hot.

Budwich, 2000StreetRod did I have it right? Hope so ,correct me if I am wrong, You sure did help me with all your posts.
R146rick

 

[2000StreetRod]

Remains energized

I've been busy elsewhere and haven't kept up recently but the Accessory Delay Relay remains energized for a period after ignition is turned off or until a door is opened. Have you tried waiting a while to see if the windows continue to work with the key removed? The delay time could be excessive for some reason. Or, try opening the door and see if the windows keep working.

I'll review the recent posts to try and catch up to see if I can help.

 

[2000StreetRod]

Stuck accessory delay relay

Even if fuse 26 is blown the windows could still operate if the accessory delay relay is stuck in the energized position. I suggest pulling the accessory delay relay and measuring the resistance between pin 87 and pin 30. If it's open then the relay is not stuck in the energized position. If it's a short, then the relay is bad. But even if the relay is bad, that doesn't explain why fuse 26 blows. For some reason more current is flowing thru fuse 26 than normal. The energizing coil in either the battery saver relay or the accessory delay relay could be internally shorted. You can check that by measuring the resistance from pin 1 to pin 2 of the battery saver relay. Also measure the resistance from pin 86 to pin 85 of the accesory delay relay. I expect the values would be comparable.

 

[dlh4x4]

Possible short

Hi, I hope I can help. I'm a Ford tech for the last 17 years. I've found several problems or wires shorting under the drivers seat. Depending on the seat motor position the wires can chafe on the seat motor screw. When the short is consistant, try wiggling or moving the wires under the drivers seat. There used to be a SSM on this concern. Good luck.

 

[malawiman79]

Thanks for all the help guys, here is the latest..... GEM out = no windows at all. Fuse 26 blows as soon as the shift control module is plugged in. If I leave it unplugged everything works but battery goes down, windows and blower motor work with key off even after doors are opened. Checking relays... If I read the diagram correct the GEM sends a ground signal to the acc and batt saver relay. If this is true they are grounded at all times on mine and should not be???

 

[2000StreetRod]

correct

That's correct and that is what's so puzzling. Since the GEM grounds the two relay solenoids anyway then a short in the GEM shouldn't result in excess current flow. You're also correct that there should not be a continuous drain. The GEM timing control should de-energize the accessory delay relay at time out or door open. I suspect the battery drain and excess current is due to one of the battery saver relay controlled devices (courtesy lamps, dimmer module, etc).

 

[2000StreetRod]

Eliminate possible causes

I would concentrate on testing the readily accessible devices first.

Disconnect the electric shift control module and test for shorts in the energizer coils. Measure the resistance from pin 5 to pin 9 and from pin 5 to pin 8. The resistances should be approximately the same and not shorted.

Disconnect the interior lamp relay and then see if fuse 26 still blows. If not, then the problem is either in the relay or what it controls. Do you have the overhead console with the compass/outside air temperature module?

 

[2000StreetRod]

Test relay source for shorts

Anytime you have a relay/module disconnected for short testing also remove fuse 26 and measure the resistance of the relay/module source wire to ground. You have to determine if the short is in the relay/module, the source to the relay/module or past the relay/module if not grounded as in the case of the GEM.

 

[budwich]

Thanks for all the help guys, here is the latest..... GEM out = no windows at all. Fuse 26 blows as soon as the shift control module is plugged in. If I leave it unplugged everything works but battery goes down, windows and blower motor work with key off even after doors are opened. Checking relays... If I read the diagram correct the GEM sends a ground signal to the acc and batt saver relay. If this is true they are grounded at all times on mine and should not be???

This pretty good testing. It tells you that the GEM is likely not the source of your problem(s).... but it is trying to tell you something. Of course, by not plugging in the shift motor, you eliminate the fuse blowing problem... so that's one issue (if I recall, you indicated that the module was "scared" with "smoke" to indicate a problem... did you check out its circuit by testing between pins as suggested in recent post by others).

When you say "if I leave it unplugged, the battery dies"... I assume this means the GEM is plugged in while the shift module isn't. Well that makes sense, as you have tested / found that the GEM has some grounds that are being "held up" which ultimately result in the "aforementioned" relays being held up... which will drain your battery... I guess that's why they call one of the "battery saver".... I guess it ain't doing its job... not funny I guess after 4 pages...

Anyways, if I am not mistaken and likely the reason for the GEM grounds is that the GEM is "seeing" a condition called "key in on" otherwise known as "hot in run"..... maybe..... OR perhaps you have a "bad GEM"... I don't recall but did you indicate a while back that you tried another GEM, when you were blowing fuses... which we know now isn't a GEM issue... I think. Do you have another GEM? Having said that, check the "hot in run" wiring to see if that condition is existing ... just in case (pin 6 and 15 on my 96 drawings).

 

[malawiman79]

I didn't think about the GEM getting the signal to tell eveything to ground I was just thinking that the GEM is JUNK and sending out a ground signal, i.e. causing my problems. Yes I tried a different GEM but found out to not be exactly the same 4x4 system and caused my wipers to come on by themselves LOL. I will check out the "power up" to the GEM and see whats going on. And yes everything blew even with the shift motor unhooked.

 

[budwich]

Probably... actually what you are going to find is that your coil on your shift module is shorted / burnt (bins 5-9) and that you have an ignition switch problem...

 

[budwich]

I didn't think about the GEM getting the signal to tell eveything to ground I was just thinking that the GEM is JUNK and sending out a ground signal, i.e. causing my problems. Yes I tried a different GEM but found out to not be exactly the same 4x4 system and caused my wipers to come on by themselves LOL. I will check out the "power up" to the GEM and see whats going on. And yes everything blew even with the shift motor unhooked.

yes but that was because you had another issue of melted wires going to the relay module. Remember you have multiple "onion skins" here and your "peeling" is just continuing.... just go slow.... you will get to the "soup".

BUT.... when you did the GEM "replacement".... how long ago was this "attempt" in the trouble shooting ... ie. when you thought you had ground problems only... or after you fixed the melted wires????

 

[malawiman79]

GEM swap was after melted wires were repaired I believe. I still have the GEM and will hang onto it untill done then EBAY. If I remember correct the pins that were burnt on the shift module were 6 and 10. They were burnt off between the board and the pin connector where the plug in goes. I owe you guys all steak dinner and a beverage if you are ever my way

 

[jremington59]

I hate to throw this iron into the fire, but could the battery drain issue be seperate from the fuse blowing issue?

 

[budwich]

well yes and no... because there are multiple issues here and it depends on where or when you are referring to..... but that was the point I was making... the fuse blows with shift module "insertion" while the battery drain occurs when there is no module plugged in..... basically cause the module blows the fuse that is likely the "source" of power for the drain issue..... so yes the current "conditions" are unrelated.