Solved Anyone ever experience vibration that fades in and out

[alex212]

03 Ford Explorer V8 I bought new and now has 145K miles. The engine and tranny run fine, burns no oil and no slipping. Last year I replaced all 4 hubs, all 4 axle shafts / CV Joints, Springs / Shocks, 4 new wheels / Tires (Factory OEM wheels refinished), Plugs and wires, trans service, transfer case service, front and rear diff service, steering rack and pump. Tie rod ends and ball joints were Not replaced cause they were good at the time.

Lately I'm noticing a vibration at highway speeds, 65 mph and over. The strange part is the vibration comes and goes even with the speed constant. I put the cruise on at 72mph and you'll feel the vibration for a while, then goes away for a bit, then comes back, it does this constantly. I've rotated and rebalanced tires and it's not from something in the road. I'm thinking it has to be something in the front suspension or steering cause I only feel the vibration in the steering wheel not on the dash or floor.

I'm thinking maybe ball joints or tie rod ends. Anyone ever experience this, what do you think?

 

[Bookworm370]

Any correlation to maybe any side loads, turns, etc? If no noise straight and level but noise if side G forces, might be a wheel bearing.

 

[alex212]

Any correlation to maybe any side loads, turns, etc? If no noise straight and level but noise if side G forces, might be a wheel bearing.

Well I don't hear any noise. I've had bad bearings and know what that sounds like. That was why I did all 4 hubs last year because of a bad front and a bad rear bearing. I did use moog parts which I believe are quality parts.

When traveling down the highway and going into a curve I do notice that if it's vibrating, the vibration will fade out or if not vibrating it will start to fade in. But then again it does that on a straight away too. So you can't tell if it's because of the curve in the road or just because it's going to do it anyway.

 

[CallMeSyd]

90 percent of the time vibration is caused by a bump or irregularity in the roundness of a tire. It is always the very first thing I check. Spin each wheel off the ground and look for the slightest high spot in the tread. Sometimes it can be hard to see. The vibration caused by this will vary depending on speed and sometimes turning.

 

[alex212]

90 percent of the time vibration is caused by a bump or irregularity in the roundness of a tire. It is always the very first thing I check. Spin each wheel off the ground and look for the slightest high spot in the tread. Sometimes it can be hard to see. The vibration caused by this will vary depending on speed and sometimes turning.

Ok thanks, I guess a tire can go out of round after a while, I'll check them but they are barely a year old with 5k miles on them. Cooper Evolution HT.
And would that cause vibration to fade in and out while at the same constant speed?

 

[Turdle]

It's resonating from uneven tire wear. Is it possible there are mixed branded tires? If not how many miles on current set. Was it replaced as a set of 4?

Edit, you posted while I typed. Disregard mixed brand question

 

[CallMeSyd]

Ok thanks, I guess a tire can go out of round after a while, I'll check them but they are barely a year old with 5k miles on them. Cooper Evolution HT.
And would that cause vibration to fade in and out while at the same constant speed?

Yes. Depending on the road surface and whether you are veering slightly right or left, which we all do even on a straight, or the lane is sloped to one side or the other will cause it to fade in and out. Also, unfortunately, I've seen tires less than 2 weeks old have this issue.

 

[leadfootdriver]

Driveshaft could be whipping like a jump Rope..
U Joints probably not helping.
New Driveshafts are expensive! I got a rusty crusty one from the bone yard for $50 years ago and it's been great..

 

[alex212]

Driveshaft could be whipping like a jump Rope..
U Joints probably not helping.
New Driveshafts are expensive! I got a rusty crusty one from the bone yard for $50 years ago and it's been great..

If it was a drive shaft I would think I would feel it in the floor, dash and everywhere. But I'm only feeling it in the steering wheel. I think it's more front end issue.

 

[alex212]

Yes. Depending on the road surface and whether you are veering slightly right or left, which we all do even on a straight, or the lane is sloped to one side or the other will cause it to fade in and out. Also, unfortunately, I've seen tires less than 2 weeks old have this issue.

Ok that could be. Is this something that could develop over time or is most likely they out of round when I bought them. Now that I think about it, I recently rotated them for the first time since I bought them and may have started to feel it after. I did do a road force balance but it didn't help.
So first step is to rotate them back to the rear and see what happens.

 

[CallMeSyd]

Ok that could be. Is this something that could develop over time or is most likely they out of round when I bought them. Now that I think about it, I recently rotated them for the first time since I bought them and may have started to feel it after. I did do a road force balance but it didn't help.
So first step is to rotate them back to the rear and see what happens.

I've never seen new tires like that. It's always after they've been driven on. Usually caused by loss of internal integrity. The internal structure (wires and synthetic strands) that is meant to maintain the shape of the tire fails and it loses its shape. Sometimes it will be a large and very noticeable bulge or sometimes a very slight deformity that you may not even be able to detect visually. If you have a tire shop spin them on a balancer they will be able to visually inspect it as they are turning, or you can jack up both front or both back wheels and spin them individually by hand and visually inspect them. If you are only noticing the vibration at higher speeds, then it is likely the deformity will be very slight. However, this is only the most likely cause of the vibration. There is a chance it could be something else entirely.

 

[leadfootdriver]

Since you pretty much replaced everything else, maybe give it a look. Here are my posts from back in the day..

Heavy vibration at highway speeds.

Yup. This just started to happen, but a little back story.. I went on a driving trip this summer, and put about 500 miles n the truck. During that time I kinda' noticed a slight rumbly sound when slowing down on the highway off ramp. But then last night I had about a hour drive, and once I hit...

www.explorerforum.com

That "rumble strip" feeling

I was getting a huge vibration at highway speeds. It turned out to be my rear Driveshaft. Since it's 4x4, there no slip yoke on the transmission side like on a regular rear wheel drive car because 4x4's have a Transfer Case. Instead, this DS has an expandable joint in the center that will go...

www.explorerforum.com

 

[94Eddie]

03 Ford Explorer V8 I bought new and now has 145K miles. The engine and tranny run fine, burns no oil and no slipping. Last year I replaced all 4 hubs, all 4 axle shafts / CV Joints, Springs / Shocks, 4 new wheels / Tires (Factory OEM wheels refinished), Plugs and wires, trans service, transfer case service, front and rear diff service, steering rack and pump. Tie rod ends and ball joints were Not replaced cause they were good at the time.

Lately I'm noticing a vibration at highway speeds, 65 mph and over. The strange part is the vibration comes and goes even with the speed constant. I put the cruise on at 72mph and you'll feel the vibration for a while, then goes away for a bit, then comes back, it does this constantly. I've rotated and rebalanced tires and it's not from something in the road. I'm thinking it has to be something in the front suspension or steering cause I only feel the vibration in the steering wheel not on the dash or floor.

I'm thinking maybe ball joints or tie rod ends. Anyone ever experience this, what do you think?

I had a vibration that would occur from around 65 mph and above and then went away above 80 mph. Checked out everything mechanical and found nothing. I tried road force balancing the tires and it solved the problem. It turned out one tire/rim combination was the main problem and the tire was balanced properly through strategically rotating the tire on the rim so the tire and rim imbalances negated each other. Without the rotation of the tire a normal balance procedure could not work properly. My Mountaineer rides smooth ever since the road force balance was done.

In case you have never heard of road force balancing it involves putting the tire under a load when it is spun that simulates actual driving conditions. While being spun precise measurements are taken of the rim in two axis as well as detecting imperfections in the tire that can cause vibrations. The tire is then spun on the rim a certain amount based on the readings obtained. Then the tire/rim is spun again and new readings are taken. If the readings indicate an imbalance is still occurring then the tire is spun again but usually less than it was the first time. A new reading is taken and this will usually zero out the imbalance. Sometimes the rim and/or tire is so out of spec that they can't achieve a balance. The good thing about road force balancing is it will tell precisely if a tire and/or rim is bad and needs replaced. The cost to do this in my area isn't too high and runs about $125 to do all four tires. A small price to pay to save me from losing my mind trying to figure out the cause of the vibration or to rule out the tires and/or rims as being the cause of the problem.

 

[CallMeSyd]

If they have been balanced and you cannot find any roundness inconsistencies, the next thing I would guess would be uneven wear or alignment. Uneven wear can happen even if all 4 are the same and same age. Differences in suspension component conditions or tire pressure, or the fact that the passenger tires take slightly more abuse can cause this, and it would make sense if you noticed it after rotation.

 

[RangerNutt]

Welcome to "reciprocating unbalance." When perceived vibration fades in and out steadily, that means you have not one source but two, and their RPMs are slightly different.

Two sirens in the distance, or two fans, or...pretty much any two frequency sources in proximity to each other that are slightly out-of-sync will do the same thing.

If only one tire were at fault, one might never notice. When two interact, it can be annoying, or maybe put you to sleep.

This new information is, of course, completely worthless in helping your find the vibration sources. Please do share what fixed it.

 

[alex212]

Sorry it took a while to get back to you guys, but wanted to let you know that I found the problem. It was the tires!
Which kind of confirmed RangerNutt's "reciprocating unbalance" post, among others. We looked at the front suspension since doing all that work and concluding there were no issues there, everything was still tight and good to go.

When looking at the tires and spinning them we did notice a slight side to side wobble on one and other slight out of round issues with others. When we rotated the fronts back to the rear, the fading vibration went away but now I had a different vibration, not as bad, but constant.

Well that confirmed it for me. So I went down to Firestone and bought 4 new Bridgestone Alenza Ultra's and now it rides smooth as silk.

Moral of the story, never buy tires off eBay, chances are your getting rejects. I've had Coopers before with no issues, but I guess I got screwed on these. I've read that even places online like Tirerack has sold blem's or rejects to people. Best bet is to just go to a reputable tire store and be done with it.
Live and learn.

Thanks all for your input!

 

[CallMeSyd]

Lol glad you figured it out.

 

[RangerNutt]

Thanks for posting the results.

Too late to help here but if the vehicle is to be kept for many years and not driven a lot, I've had amazing results with Hankook tires. Nearly 10 years parked outside and not a single check or crack, still look almost new. The Michelins didn't go nearly that long.