E15 Fuel in our future?

[jrmexplorer]

E15 Fuel and the Explorer

All,
Just noticed that the EPA has approved E15 (15% ethanol) fuel for sale. http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121130/AUTO01/211300415

While this doesn't mean that you will see it at your gas station in the future, it may show up, depending on your state.

I know the 2012's and maybe the 2013's are approved for E85 (I believe?), I know the manual for the 2011 Explorer states that only E10 is approved (10% ethanol).

I was hoping to get a statement here by Ford as to whether or not E15 is approved for the 2011+ Explorers or not. My guess is yes for 2012 and 2013 (based on them being able to run E85) and NO for 2011 Explorers (based on the manual).

Furthermore, the post is intended as a heads up to 2011 drivers about the appearance of E15 and potential warranty issues should you use it and should Ford not approve it for use in the 2011 Explorer.

 

[Bill #5 Explorer]

Alcohol is great for drinking. Not for driving. And never for drinking & driving.

 

[182RG]

"Corn advocates" translates to farm subsidies courtesy of our collective wallets..... More food for fuel...

 

[peterk9]

All,
Just noticed that the EPA has approved E15 (15% ethanol) fuel for sale. http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121130/AUTO01/211300415

While this doesn't mean that you will see it at your gas station in the future, it may show up, depending on your state.

I know the 2012's and maybe the 2013's are approved for E85 (I believe?), I know the manual for the 2011 Explorer states that only E10 is approved (10% ethanol).

I was hoping to get a statement here by Ford as to whether or not E15 is approved for the 2011+ Explorers or not. My guess is yes for 2012 and 2013 (based on them being able to run E85) and NO for 2011 Explorers (based on the manual).

Furthermore, the post is intended as a heads up to 2011 drivers about the appearance of E15 and potential warranty issues should you use it and should Ford not approve it for use in the 2011 Explorer.

I don't think that all 2012's are approved for E85. There was some discussion about that on this Forum quite a while ago because some had the Flex Fuel emblem on the tailgate while others did not.
Anyway, using E15 will only serve to further reduce your gas mileage more than E10 has already done over the use of straight gas.

You may want to check out the following link (for what it's worth) re possible engine damage;

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/e15-gasoline-may-damage-vehicles-110000538.html

Peter

 

[1995E]

I don't think that all 2012's are approved for E85. There was some discussion about that on this Forum quite a while ago because some had the Flex Fuel emblem on the tailgate while others did not.
Anyway, using E15 will only serve to further reduce your gas mileage more than E10 has already done over the use of straight gas.

You may want to check out the following link (for what it's worth) re possible engine damage;

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/e15-gasoline-may-damage-vehicles-110000538.html

Peter

The problem is, since they approved E15, if it starts showing up in gas stations, then you are forced to use it. In MD, there is absolutely no 100% gasoline being sold anymore. It's all E10. My fuel economy is 13 MPG and I am pretty sure the E10 + winter blend gasoline just eating up the fuel efficiency. When we are forced to use E15, what do we do? Ford won't cover warranty claims on fuel related problems. Is there a way to convert the vehicles to E85? Is it different fuel system? ETC?

 

[blichy]

I don't think that all 2012's are approved for E85. There was some discussion about that on this Forum quite a while ago because some had the Flex Fuel emblem on the tailgate while others did not.
Anyway, using E15 will only serve to further reduce your gas mileage more than E10 has already done over the use of straight gas.

You may want to check out the following link (for what it's worth) re possible engine damage;

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/e15-gasoline-may-damage-vehicles-110000538.html

Peter

And the 2013 Sports are also not approved for E85 either.

I specifically look for stations not using E15 around me for my 911, as the engine and fuel system weren't designed to run with any ethanol.

 

[tazcubed]

I don't think that all 2012's are approved for E85. There was some discussion about that on this Forum quite a while ago because some had the Flex Fuel emblem on the tailgate while others did not.
Anyway, using E15 will only serve to further reduce your gas mileage more than E10 has already done over the use of straight gas.

You may want to check out the following link (for what it's worth) re possible engine damage;

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/e15-gasoline-may-damage-vehicles-110000538.html

Peter

What exactly do we get in Canada? I had lots of fuel system related problems with my previous BMW which they only indicated after the 3rd round of injectors (ethanol eats away at the ceramic coatings on the parts). From what was said, it depends on the manufacturer - Shell seems to avoid ethanol unlike the others. I don't know how true that statement is.

I do, however, feel if that ethanol is a problem then if the dealer and manufacturer doesn't proactively include such information on purchase or thereafter they should be held responsible or fix it. Ethanol has been around long enough that it should be a part of manufacturer's testing.

 

[peterk9]

What exactly do we get in Canada? I had lots of fuel system related problems with my previous BMW which they only indicated after the 3rd round of injectors (ethanol eats away at the ceramic coatings on the parts). From what was said, it depends on the manufacturer - Shell seems to avoid ethanol unlike the others. I don't know how true that statement is.

I do, however, feel if that ethanol is a problem then if the dealer and manufacturer doesn't proactively include such information on purchase or thereafter they should be held responsible or fix it. Ethanol has been around long enough that it should be a part of manufacturer's testing.

I believe most if not all brands have 10% ethanol added to the gasoline. I use Petro Canada gas now because when Sunoco and PetroCan merged, the station changed to PetroCan. Both gasolines have 10% ethanol and Sunoco had it for as long as I can remember.
I checked the Shell website and it mentions its gas is now nitrogen enriched. There is no mention of ethanol. There are no Shell stations anywhere near my place to check this out.
I did find that the Federal Government has regulated that motor gasoline sold in Canada after Sept. 1, 2010 must contain an annual pool average of 5% ethanol. Different provincial mandates also exist, some with higher ethanol pool requirements.
Happy New Year!

Peter

 

[CajunFordEx]

Not in La.

Here in Louisiana there are numerous stations that boldly have signs stating "No Ethanol". Most of these stations are Conoco. There are a few Shell stations that have no ethanol also. I gladly pay the 5 cents more per gallon for ethanol free fuel so I can get the 2 extra miles per gallon. It's not so pronounced in my 2011 Ex as it is in my 05 F150 as it only gets 15 mpg with 10% ethanol fuel. Ex gets 22 - 24 mpg all the time. I also use only ethanol free fuel in my lawn mowers,weed eaters,chain saws,generators,outboard motor and motorcycle. I have personally seen and had to deal with what ethanol does to an engine's fuel system. It gets expensive rebuilding fuel systems because of this stuff.

 

[BobbyMarks]

Guys,

I think this report summarizes everything, althogh I have seen E10 in my area and have not used it, I will not venture myself to use it. :thumbdwn:

Check this out: http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/2000862202001/

Bobby

 

[peterk9]

Guys,

I think this report summarizes everything, althogh I have seen E10 in my area and have not used it, I will not venture myself to use it. :thumbdwn:

Check this out: http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/2000862202001/

Bobby

Some states have mandated the use of E10 so be careful where you fill up. Here in Canada I'm guessing I have been using it for the past 10 years or so. I was using Sunoco exclusively until they merged with Petro Canada a couple of years ago and the station I use switched to PetroCan. The only indication of the E10 mixture was a small statement on the pump itself. It was not identified on any grade selection button. I also have never had a problem with using it except slightly reduce mileage figures.

Peter

 

[BobbyMarks]

Some states have mandated the use of E10 so be careful where you fill up. Here in Canada I'm guessing I have been using it for the past 10 years or so. I was using Sunoco exclusively until they merged with Petro Canada a couple of years ago and the station I use switched to PetroCan. The only indication of the E10 mixture was a small statement on the pump itself. It was not identified on any grade selection button. I also have never had a problem with using it except slightly reduce mileage figures.

Peter

Hi Peter,

I agree on your notes. I must add that most of the fuels produced in the US and overseas mostly meets standard specifications (i.e.: Colonial Pipeline grades) for standard blends, also producers are putting out in the market low octane fuel blends, 84 octane (R+M/2) and are blended in the pump to produce the 90/10 blend and boost the octane to minimum requirements for regular unleaded gasoline. The same applies to premium to meet the minimum requirements.
With the energy crisis a few years back and the increase in crude oil prices, DOE wanted to increase the alcohol level in the gasolines thus lowering emissions, bla, bla, bla.
The problem is when you blend gasoline and alcohol and is used in engines designed exclusively for gasoline include lowered fuel mileage, metal corrosion, deterioration of plastic and rubber fuel system components, clogged fuel systems, fuel injectors, and carburetors, delamination of composite fuel tanks, varnish buildup on engine parts, damaged or destroyed internal engine components, water absorption, fuel phase separation, and shortened fuel storage life.
Bobby

 

[Tbars4]

Guys,

I think this report summarizes everything, althogh I have seen E10 in my area and have not used it, I will not venture myself to use it. :thumbdwn:

Check this out: http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/2000862202001/

Bobby

...One of my customers sent me that link along with this one too..
http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/e15.asp

 

[horses2]

While the EPA has approved the use of E15, here in MD several major retailers like WAWA have stated they will not sell it unless mandated. The key is that the E15 blend is very corrosive and will require its own dedicated pump such as E85 requires. The cost for a retailer to install yet another tank, pump, piping etc, isnt worth the cost. In addition, E15 is NOT approved for use in any vehicle prior to 2001 as well as motorcycles and small engines(lawn mowers etc). this requires the pumps to be labeled as such. Now, we all know no one will read the label and will blame the retailer when they put E15 in their motorcycle then try to sue the retailer. So, retailers dont want the hassle.
here is one for you. when gas is put into the tanker trucks, it is all 100 gasoline. Ethanol is then added to create the E10 blend. EPA allows a leeway in the actual Ethanol blend. Right now, the blend could be as high as 15% and in my line of work we have seen fuel complaints where the ethonal blend is as high as 22%.
While manufacturers are equipping vehicles for fuel blends, unless your vehicle is listed as a flex fuel vehicle, it is not fully equiiped to handle greater than E10.

 

[Tar Heel Sport]

Here in Louisiana there are numerous stations that boldly have signs stating "No Ethanol". Most of these stations are Conoco. There are a few Shell stations that have no ethanol also. I gladly pay the 5 cents more per gallon for ethanol free fuel so I can get the 2 extra miles per gallon. It's not so pronounced in my 2011 Ex as it is in my 05 F150 as it only gets 15 mpg with 10% ethanol fuel. Ex gets 22 - 24 mpg all the time. I also use only ethanol free fuel in my lawn mowers,weed eaters,chain saws,generators,outboard motor and motorcycle. I have personally seen and had to deal with what ethanol does to an engine's fuel system. It gets expensive rebuilding fuel systems because of this stuff.

I'm going to try Ethanol Free gas in my new Sport to see how it does. I found a great site that shows all the service stations that offer Ethanol Free gas:

http://pure-gas.org/

 

[TheGTkid]

Alcohol is great for drinking. Not for driving. And never for drinking & driving.

uncle steve always says that
gotta love that guy
just curious, i have the vin K for flex, what kind of gas can I use for that?
I just pump regular in, but I know there is another option... havent looked for it though

 

[rmp301]

There is much talk about federal standards that will increase ethanol in fuel to a new grade of fuel called E15, a blend of 15 percent ethanol and 85 percent gasoline. Proponents say E15 fuel will help Americans by reducing gas prices and fostering energy independence. But there's also a debate raging over whether any savings at the pump would be offset by more frequent — and costly — engine and fuel system repairs. Much talk about it voiding warranties from many auto manufacturers including Ford. What is your take on this change?

 

[JohnBoyToo]

Even if ethanol WORKED
i.e. NOT killing power and mpg such that the losses outweigh any POTENTIAL gains,
and not costing more and more with subsidies and just outright price fixing...

it's been suggested that older cars especially will be devasted by anything above 10%.

can u tell that's a hot button for me ?!? Use up our ever decreasing FOOD farmland for ethanol ?!?

another dumb idea from the gooberment = like mtbe, and global warming, and taxes, and

 

[peterk9]

There is much talk about federal standards that will increase ethanol in fuel to a new grade of fuel called E15, a blend of 15 percent ethanol and 85 percent gasoline. Proponents say E15 fuel will help Americans by reducing gas prices and fostering energy independence. But there's also a debate raging over whether any savings at the pump would be offset by more frequent — and costly — engine and fuel system repairs. Much talk about it voiding warranties from many auto manufacturers including Ford. What is your take on this change?

The following thread on E15 was posted back in January.

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=376575&highlight=E15

Peter

 

[Ryan327]

I thought ethanol fuel had the ability to have a much high octane rating thus more power actually, but at the cost of much less MPG as there is less total energy per unit volume?

Obviously working with the restraints of factory tunes though, because many engines can't up the timing and or boost enough to make real use of the higher octane rating.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this as this can be a learning experience for everyone!