Swaybar kits for 92 stock Explorer - Addco or Hellwig?

[pkn]

Swaybar kits for 92 stock Explorer - Addco or Hellwig? Reducing body roll

For couple of years my 92 XLT was taking rest on the driveway, and I kinda forgot how willingly it rolls on turns and bumps. However, this summer it became my daily driver again - and will stay so for some foreseeable future.

Occasionally I also drive '05 XLT Explorer which is my wife's daily driver... and, comparing the ride quality of the two I sorta grew jealous. I want to improve the 92's handling.

Infinite collective wisdom of this great site taught me that the best thing I can do is to install aftermarket sway bars - for both front and rear.

Further research revealed that inexpensive sway bars kit from Explorer Express (p/n ZD5620) unfortunately is not available anymore. So my options are: kits from Addco (front Addco 521 and rear Addco 659) of from Hellwig (front Hellwig 7574 and rear Hellwig 7569).

Price difference is close to negligible, sway bars diameters are the same for both manufacturers, the only noticeable difference I found is that Addco bars are "made from high-carbon steel and is hardened and stress-relieved", and Hellwig bars are "made from heat-treated 4140 chromoly spring steel". I have no idea if high-carbon steel is better (or worse) than chrome-molybden in spring application.

So I'm asking for opinions: Addco or Hellwig?

Or something else?

The car is 92 XLT 2WD Explorer, auto, stock. Driving pattern is 75% city local, 25% highway, no offroad to speak of.

 

[Jason94sport]

Upgrade your shocks & replace any worn out bushings. Those will improve the handling.
Sway bars are useless if everything else is shot.

Keep in mind it's a 92 TTB setup. Completely different then that 05. It will never ride close to that.

 

[pkn]

Upgrade your shocks & replace any worn out bushings. Those will improve the handling.
Sway bars are useless if everything else is shot.

Shocks are all Bilsteins installed some 4 years ago - and for 3 out of this 4 years the Explorer was sitting on driveway. I have new front Motorcraft OEM shocks, though, and am planning to try them out anyways, since it's fast and easy swap. Most of front bushings were replaced this spring, including radius arms bushings. Rears were checked and seems solid. In general the whole suspension currently seems as tight as I can get it.

Can't remember the Bilsteins model numbers, they are blue-yellow. Do you think there are some much better shock absorbers, for city rides, out there?

Keep in mind it's a 92 TTB setup. Completely different then that 05. It will never ride close to that.

Oh no... Well, I understand that. I'm just hoping to make it a little better.

 

[arco777]

I have the Edelbrock IAS shocks on my 2-door. Very firm ride. Will stiffen up the handling almost as much as upgraded swaybars. But it can be crashy over bumps. Really stiff! But I like them for cornering, and they were cheap. Worked fine off road too.

Currently using the Monroe Reflex shocks on my 4-door. Quite happy with them. Firmer ride than stock but handles bumps well. Recommend these if you want a quality set to cut down on body roll. I've heard the Monroe Sensa-Trac will provide a softer ride but more body roll.

Currently I have EE swaybars. Between Addco and Hellwig probably no noticeable difference but check reviews for overall company product quality. Anyways, most swaybars should come with the bushings for the bar itself. Add a set of Moog polyurethane swaybar link bushings and you'll be set. Removing the old link bushings wasn't fun but the new bushings improved the sway bar function a lot. Also use high strength link bolts. I broke a few.

 

[Jason94sport]

Currently using the Monroe Reflex shocks

I have them on mine too. I can throw my X around corners pretty good. Within it's limits anyway. I don't see any difference in either set of sways. Buy whatever is cheaper.

 

[swshawaii]

Add a set of Moog polyurethane swaybar link bushings and you'll be set.

Good post arco777. Only correction is that the blue Moog bushings are thermoplastic rubber, not polyurethane.
http://www.moogproblemsolver.com/_pdf_En/MOOG_PS_Bulletin_25471_K7275_En.pdf

Energy Suspension poly grommets with the Moog hardware was the best cheap upgrade I've ever done. Bulletproof.
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3018342&postcount=13
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2791778&postcount=10

 

[arco777]

Good post arco777. Only correction is that the blue Moog bushings are thermoplastic rubber, not polyurethane.

Derp. It's late and I'm sick, sorry. Been a while since I put them in but I do remember them being rubber
Even being softer than poly, they were still a huge improvement over my worn out old rubber ones.

 

[Anime]

The Bilsteins are the BEST performance shocks you can buy, hands down. They have a lifetime warranty to back up their performance, too. The only downside is they are probably a little too firm/harsh for some people.

You can also improve the handling with a polyurethane bushing upgrade. The soft factory rubber bushings are way past their design life at this point and even if they weren't, poly bushings all around are an upgrade even from new factory rubber. Again, the only downside is the firmness, poly bushings are a little too firm for some people.
Energy Suspension makes a Hyper-Flex kit for just over $100 that replaces all the bushings on the Explorer. The kit is made for a 4WD so some parts like the pivot bushings for the front I-beams won't be correct, but the bushings for the radius arms and sway bars and leaf springs would be the same. You can get the bushings for each system (front sway bar, rear sway bar, radius arms, etc.) seperately, but generally the kit costs less than buying a few sets.

You can install the rear sway bar from a 95-98 Explorer and get the factory rear brackets and associated poly bushings, but some who have done this report it makes no difference.

You could always just get the poly bushings for the front and rear sway bars and see if that gets the handling like you want.

The thicker sway bars would certainly help cornering but they are a big expense for the improvement you get vs. poly bushings. If you want to just go for it, the Hellwigs would be the way to go. I do not like Addco products, their sway bars (at least the old ones) were third-rate products and the ends were very poorly finished, making for a poor fit and a poor driving experience, always knowing you have sway bars that aren't on there quite right. Maybe they've updated the designs and have better quality control, but they seem to just throw a design together and stick with it, hoping people lose the receipt or just don't bother returning it.

Other than that, tires. You should already be aware of the whole Firestone tire fiasco and that the tire pressure shouldn't be just 26 psi but something more like 30-32 psi. You can also inflate the rear a little less than the front when unloaded due to the heavier front end.

With Bilstein shocks, poly bushings, and good properly inflated tires, the Explorer corners pretty decent. About the only other improvement could be lowering it an inch or two to reduce the center of gravity, but doing so tends to compromise the ride quality due to the greatly reduced suspension travel.

 

[arco777]

From what I have read and experienced, upgrading the rear sway bar doesn't net that noticeable of an improvement. The upgraded front sway bar alone will make a huge improvement in cornering.

Another thing you might consider doing is replacing your front coil springs. I have the Moog replacements on both my Explorers and they helped a lot. Not very expensive either, though you may need an alignment afterwards if your Explorer was aligned with the saggy old springs.

 

[mr cribb]

This is something I would like to address on mine.

I don't understand how NOT upgrading to larger swaybars wouldn't help. When I get all new suspension parts this will be part of it. I need to do bushings, replace all wear out items, shocks etc. I plan on coils and new leaf springs just do it all.

Everything is original on mine and was built 12-17-91 (shocks have a date code of 11-91) add 225k miles on top of that and it is a shame I'm so stinking broke to fix it all.

 

[arco777]

I don't understand how NOT upgrading to larger swaybars wouldn't help. .

Triple negative hurts my brain

 

[mr cribb]

Triple negative hurts my brain

Sorry I slept in English class. And my last English class was in 1998.

 

[Jason94sport]

I don't understand how NOT upgrading to larger swaybars wouldn't help

My performance car has big azz sways on it. Helps it to corner flatter but it adds zero in the grip department. On a 1st gen I don't really see the benefit unless you have the means to actually increase corning grip it's not designed to have.

 

[Anime]

You can increase the cornering grip it's not supposed to have with the right tires.

Even just the right all-seasons with enough pressure will give a first gen so much cornering grip it will hold and then roll up on two wheels rather than just slide like less grippy all-terrains. Add higher rate springs and it will go up on two wheels even quicker.

This is, of course, why you DON'T want to modify the cornering ability beyond what the vehicle is capable of, or at least what the driver is capable of dealing with, because otherwise you can lose control of it quicker than you can react.

Part of the reason Ford spec'd ONLY all-terrain tires and even has a warning label that grippy performance tires are NOT to be used, along with warning against suspension mods and lift kits, is because all that stuff changes the handling in a way that may not telegraph the vehicle's new propensity to roll over to a driver that has no idea what it even feels like for a vehicle to be about to roll over.

Larger sway bars do help cornering, but they also limit suspension travel, and can actually help the inside wheels lift up off the ground MORE than the smaller stock sway bars because of this. While the larger sway bars do make it corner flatter, even at low speeds, they can also add unpredictability at higher speeds, and depending on the tire/suspension combo, they could cause a rollover when a driver doesn't feel the center of gravity getting away from them until it's too late. Adding the thicker sway bars, or even the poly bushings, reduces the body roll, which is good for handling, but may make a driver who doesn't know better think they now have more control in a corner just because they can't feel the body rolling as much as before, and not realize the vehicle will just now suddenly roll over at the limit, rather than the gradual body roll like before.

Whatever mods you do, go slow, learn the vehicle's new abilities, limits, and handling characteristics in a safe place away from other drivers.

 

[mr cribb]

Ok point made. I had thought of replacing all worn items with new and doing a sway bar upgrade combined with 255/70's on 15 or 17" wheels (depends if I buy new wheels).

However if I replaced my existing sway end links I might be surprised how it handles.

Enough highjacking by me, lets get back to the OP.

 

[Anime]

the only noticeable difference I found is that Addco bars are "made from high-carbon steel and is hardened and stress-relieved", and Hellwig bars are "made from heat-treated 4140 chromoly spring steel". I have no idea if high-carbon steel is better (or worse) than chrome-molybden in spring application.

4140 chromoly is space- and aircraft-grade steel. "High-carbon steel" usually means some lower grade (like 1020 hi-tensile steel) that is decent, but not nearly as strong, and also not as strong for the amount of steel used. You can use less 4140 steel and have a stronger item than a bigger item made from 1020 steel.

I'm not for sure that it makes a gigantic difference in a sway-bar application, as the majority of factory sway bars are obviously super-cheap high-carbon steel, but you can be sure that the best of the best sway bars on ultra-high performance vehicles are 4140 chromoly. I would say the 4140 bar would not just be stronger but would also be stiffer, and so be slightly more effective as a sway bar.

For about the same price, obviously I'd take the Hellwig. Usually Addco competes on price because their sway bars are 50-75% of what the competition charges for the same application, and they make a lot of sway bars for applications nobody else does, sometimes even for vehicles that never came from the factory with sway bars.

 

[pkn]

4140 chromoly is space- and aircraft-grade steel. "High-carbon steel" usually means some lower grade (like 1020 hi-tensile steel) that is decent, but not nearly as strong ...

My impression was that 1020 and alike are not considered "high-carbon", but I did not find exact numbers for what carbon percent is "high". Another consideration was "stress-relieved" which, AFAIK, is usually done by hammering, and hammering is a very good thing for application like this...

anyways. It's all are just speculations on my part since I have ordered the Hellwigs already. "SD Track Springs" has the best prices at this moment, and 10% coupon to boot, if someone is interested.

 

[pkn]

Many thanks to everyone who contributed. As always on this forum, very educative discussion.

I'll have to re-check my bushings. Radius arms bushings are three months old blue Moogs, and I don't want to touch them, sway bar bushings are blue Moogs, too, but I will take a look at them and others once again.

I don't really care about high-speed cornering, I just don't do that - because of the tires, I ride those "more plastic than rubber" Michelins, which are virtually everlasting, but have really, really crappy traction, especially on wet... I actually wish I was not so thrifty when I was choosing them, but it's too late now and I simply can not throw away tires with half of life on them, even if they are these Michelins crap... so I just have to be cautious. And I am.

My goal is to decrease the body roll, and it seems, poly bushings and Hellwig sway bars are the way to go.

 

[Anime]

Michelins are actually very good tires, expecially the older LTX M/S. The LTX M/S2 and some others aren't as great, but compared to lots of the all-terrains, it's like riding on rails. The Michelins also seem to do a good job of making enough noise to let you know when they're starting to lose grip, compared to other tires that either squeal and let go or those that just break traction without warning.

Michelins also ride nice too.

 

[arco777]

My old Michelin LTX A/T tires were amazing. Incredible grip and tread life. Wish I had kept them.