Sweet front suspension options

[Josh S.]

Yo-I have been soing a lot of thinking/asking around about various options that I have to make my suspension awesome. Here they are, let me know what you guys think:

1. This is probly the easiest/maybe least expensive...First is to get the d35 cut and turned and widened. This would get rid of my crap superlift dd brackets and widen my track a bit. In addition to this, throw on some bilstein 9100 coilovers or kings, w/ air bumpstops, extended radius arms. This would be excellent for desert running, and good for rockcrawling, but not as strong as it could be, due to the d35.

2. This would be to do the same as above, but instead of the widened d35 axle, It would be turned d44 beams out of a f150. This would be a lot stronger than a d35, and would be kick ass for desert stuff, as well as rockcrawling, so I've heard. This option would be ideally coupled with coilover setup with sexy radius arms and the like ORrrr, the cheaper(but still hell ass expensive) go with the autofab d44 beams, and a triple shock setup on each side in the front. This would be normal shocks and eibach coils, but it could still take a pretty hard beating.

3. This option is of course the infamous straight axle conversion. This is tempting. It would be real strong which is great, good for crawling I guess, but what about desert running? The ttb is better for this yes? I enjoy going fast in the desert, but am extremely limited in what I can do now, because of my current setup. I have a cracked, rewelded, cracked again axle-pivot drop down bracket that I have to baby, and all the other stuff isn't so hot either.

I of course can't do all this stuff at once, but I want to get a better idea of the pros/cons of each method, what each is good for, cost factor(again) and also any other recomendations that others may have. Thanks

 

[410Fortune]

The D44 cut and turned beams are a great way to go, however dont forget you will now have a 5 on 4.5 bolt circle in the back and a 5 on 5.5 up front, so you need to get custom rear axles for your 8.8

1 question: What do you want to use the truck for?
2 question: what size tires do you want to run

These two questions will give you your answer.
I am sticking with the D35 TTB, going to run 2.5 cut and turn WITH my duff 3" drop brackets, some 8" lift coils and some nice resevoir shocks, with a custom shock hoop/coil bucket. I am sticking with a 2.5" turned beam because I run an ARB up front and anything over 3" with teh ARB = trouble. Also I plan to only run 33's off road, so the D35 can handle it, 31's on the street.

Keeping it simple in the rear with some good leafs, my BII is spring over already, I may run some shackles back there to match the articulation I get in the front, also possibly runthe shocks through the floor of the BII with a custom shock hoop.

I already have a Duff 3"VR lift with Skyjacker extended arms and x member, running the F-150 spring seats for an approx 5" lift, with ad a leafs and a 3" block int eh rear. this weekend I will be installing my Skyjacker 4" leafs so I can ditch the block. Also installing Autofab front glass to clear the 33's (BII needs like 8" lift to clear 33's w/o trimming up front)

Me = 90% daily driver
9% rocks
1% dessert

at least for now....when shes a trailer queen she'll get a d44 for the rocks......

 

[CoryL]

To make one of 410's questions more specific...

If you could assign percentages to the kinds of wheeling you do, what would they be?

50% Rocks
50% Desert

80% Rocks
20% Desert

Where do you fall?

Makes a big differece.

 

[Xplodor]

Yeah for rocks I'd go I'd go Solid Axle, and skys the limit on what you can do, plus I think you can do it for alittle less then the alternative.

For Desert Mobbing, TTB will be best, but the cost will be more, and you're limited on a few things. If you decide to do the TTB try to go with the better axle so you're happy at the end and not having/wanting to redo it down the road.

I watched my friend spend 2 months and $6,000.00 on his YJ buying and then customizing the ProComp Coil conversion trying to make it as nice as the Warn Black Diamond conversion. 4 months after it was finished (did not do what he wanted to do) he went back to a leafspring/buggyspring setup and is finally happy with it. It articulates way more then that ProComp kit and drives way better to. Moral of the story:

"Think before you unbolt, that way you only do it once."

 

[Josh S.]

Aha! I got the attention of some people that know a lot! Anyways, the type of wheeling I do would be narrowed down to about
33%desert
33%rocks
33%dirt/rock trails

About an equal ratio of those. I like to go to the rocks and the desert more, but its too far to go to all the time, so I'll do some trails in the local hills or mountains. So basically, I want something that is versatile. I want to be able to articulate and crawl over medium sized rock and washes and stuff, but still be able to go out to the desert and jump off dunes and speed over whoops...ya know? Daily driver ability is still a must cuz I don't want to buy another truck so I can have this thing as a designated trail vehicle.

410-Thanks, I realized that the bolt pattern will be different. In this case, I will probly just get the d44 converted back to a 5 on 4.5, for simplicity's sake(basically so I don't have to buy new rims). I know it won't be as strong or whatever, but does it really make a hell of a difference? I don't have plans for bigger than my current 33's. I could eventually go for 35's, but its just too much hassle, so I'll stay where I'm at. They're great for now. So I guess that means, that unless I'm going solid axle, I should just stay w/ the 35 right? I wish I could get sirhk100 on here cuz he has the cut and turned 35 on his. Hmmmm...

 

[Byrd91]

I don't think you can convert a D44 to 5 on 4.5 because it won't clear the hub....Not sure if this is right, but I've heard it somewhere. Just thought I'd let you know.

 

[punkbek3886]

how much does it cost to convert to solid axle? including labor becuase im only 16 and i dont know how to weld (yet).

 

[CoryL]

You wouldn't want to convert a D44 to a 5 on 4.5 because of the hub. It won't clear the wheel and downsizing the hub would be counterproductive.

As for the cost of a SAS, punkbek3886, it all depends.

What year Explorer?
Leafs, coils, or coilovers ?
Which axle?
Full width or cut down to Explorer width?
Rebuild/Regear/Lock axle?
Who will be doing the work?

Also depends on what you can pick up the axles and parts for.

Since it is custom, it will vary shop to shop.

If you weren't so far away, I could do the work for you for a reasonable cost.

 

[sirhk100]

Josh,
Which bracket did you end up braking? The brand new one or one of my old used ones?

You rode in mine that night... What did you think of that? I can crawl with it too with my set up. All I have to do is bleed the pressure outta the bumpstops up front so the suspension can compress all the way with out them limiting it. I've got probably 20 trips on that front end and have had no problems. Although there are things that I would do different now but it's a little too late. With what I've done to mine I wish that I'd had someone put Uniballs in the end of my beams instead of the rubber bushings. Allows for more flex which would be needed if I were to start over because of my next statement. I wouldn't have done the buckets and external 9100 reservoirs. I wouldn't think twice about going coilovers now. Don't get me wrong, mine kicks ass in the high speed whoops and jumping arena and on the rocks but dual rate coilovers would be that much better. Unfortunately I don't have the ambition to buy new shocks and cut the buckets off my frame so I'll live with what I've done.

If it were me, I'd go with your 1st or 2nd option depending on the money you can toss into it. Heck you saw that canyon that I accidentally took you down, my tires never left the ground and there was some serious off camber stuff there. Now that you got some bigger tires we'll have to go out again soon. Also, make sure to get out to the Truckhaven run after the 1st of the year. Then you can see mine flex as well as other more insane setups like "ricks" and "paul b. (if his is ready)"

Khris

 

[Josh S.]

Well, I broke that brand new one. Its holding up pretty good right now, there's a small crack down the right side, but I've been pushin it lately out in adelanto and stuff with no problems. Just gotta slow way down in the 4 foot whoop sections. Anyways, yah its a pos.

I would rather stay with ttb, especially how good yours did that one night, but I don't know much about getting a hold of some. How'd you get yours? You send them in to get fixed up or what? Are they strong enough for what you wanna do? I could go with the 44's, but it would just end up costing a lot more for all this hub crap, and it would take more imagination to mount this crap to my truck.

 

[punkbek3886]

well, this is pretty complicated.
if i didnt get the axle cut down to explorer size (91 sport) then i would get a new rear axle to make the two match. as for leaf/coil/coilover, i would probably go with the cheapest. i think leaf would leave the most options as far as lifting. what do reverse cut dana 44s usually go for?

 

[sirhk100]

Josh, check your email...

Also, I think our front end is fine for moderate use. (my opinion) I mean it's not bending or anything and trust me, I've had about 4' of air a couple times and 2' of air is normal on a typical weekend. I've done some wheeling with the front end and the axles are still in one piece. Doesn't mean they won't let go though. I'm sure some of the more hardcore crawlers can answer teh strength question in that arena but as far as prerunning goes mine seems to be holding up so far. I'll let you know if things change though.

BTW, too big isn't a problem though and it would be piece of mind!!! I'm honestly most paranoid about my balljoints breaking or steering letting go on a jump or when slamming through whoops then anything else.

Khris

 

[Josh S.]

Yah, I think I'll just stick w/ the 35 for now, and if something huge breaks, just replace it s/ the 44 later. Its just too much cash. I was looking on the camburg website and they have some pretty sweet packages with the 8" widened uniball beams, extended heimed rad. arms, and swayaway coilovers. It would add up to about 5500 installed? What do you think? I think camburg has a good reputation, and if I got them to install it and everything, then it would be pretty sick. Later

 

[CoryL]

Camburg is an excellent company. I used their products on my 2wd Ranger pre-runner when I was building it.

Jerry Zaiden, the owner, and I have talked extensively on the phone and they have answered questions for me even when I had no intentions of buying anything. They also suggested other routes and plans that didn't include them that would save me money.

Now that I have my own business, I contacted them to become a dealer of theirs because I believe their desert related products are superior.

I would go to them without hesitation for any of that kind of work.

 

[sirhk100]

I second the camburg stuff. Verry good company, excellent fab work and on and on.... If you got the money don't think twice about them.

Khris

 

[BonesDT]

hey im confused. isnt the d44 a solid axle, or it can go both ways? what comes factory in the rear, d44?

 

[Josh S.]

Yah the d44 is a solid axle, but was also applied to the ttb style in the f-150's. I believe it was used in 4x4 f150s from somewhere in the mid-late 80s to like 95 or something. I read that in petersens 4wheelandoffroad.

I'm not sure if this applies to all explorers, but at least most if not all came factory w/ the ford 8.8" rear end.

 

[punkbek3886]

CoreyL, i finally made up my mind on what i want to do. could i weld spring buckets on a d44 from the front of a cherokee and use my factory springs? then i could get a lift for an explorer and just throw out the drop brackets. do the driveshafts line up correctly? what would be involved in hooking up the steering?

 

[CoryL]

Originally posted by punkbek3886
CoreyL, i finally made up my mind on what i want to do. could i weld spring buckets on a d44 from the front of a cherokee and use my factory springs? then i could get a lift for an explorer and just throw out the drop brackets. do the driveshafts line up correctly? what would be involved in hooking up the steering?

The Early Bronco D44 already has lower spring mounts that attach to the radius arm.

Don't use TTB lift coils. They suck. Get some Wild Horses Rockcrawler 3.5" coils. Work out to 6" of lift.

Driveshafts may need to be modified.

Steering on a 1st gen is easy. 2nd gen is more complicated.

 

[prerunnersvo]

Hey, I know I'm jumping in a little late here, but in case anyone is still reading this, I've seen more than a few people break Camburg's components. I did A LOT of researche before buying my front end kit & I did a lot of asking around. In the end, I found that most of Camburgs stuff was built for looks & not necessarily maximum performance. That's not to say that it won't hold up fine for most people, but if you really plan on pounding on your truck hard, find people who have owned it & broken it. Also, try to find some one that's broken an Autofab kit. I only know of one, & the only reason I found out about him was that John, the owner, told me. John's been in the business for years & knows what it takes to make a truck last in the roughest terrain. So far, in my Explorer, with stock rear leaves, I've been able to fly through long 2-3 foot tall whoop sections at 55-65mph without feeling like I'm driving the truck to it's limit. when it leaves the ground, it lands super-smoothly & it feels completely under contol & soakes up all the bumps.....if that's not the limit with stock leaves, imagine what it could do with the rear leaf & 2-link kit from autofab.
Anyway, I hope I don't offend anyone, that's not my point here, I just figured you'd want to hear from someone that's bought & really used a kit....by the way, I drive my explorer daily & beat on it really hard for an entire day at least twice a month....