How reliable are these cars?

[Number Twelve]

I know this is a site to discuss problems, but I never imagined so many things could go wrong with a car. Forgets its PATS codes, quits responding to the throttle, goes into limp-home mode for a wheel speed sensor, quits shifting the transmission into gear...all about microprocessor controlled functions.

I can understand wheel bearings, ball joints, and EGR valves, but wow! Can I expect to be F.O.R.D (found on road dead) every year or two with this 2005 Explorer?

And what about planned obsolescence? Do I just throw this in the bin like a Windows XP computer when the Dealership quits, "supporting" the software?

 

[lincolnshibuya]

IMO this generation is way reliable than the current ones, why? "planned obsolescence" because of how everything is packed now with computers/modules that require dealership programming/tools to work on. The cost of the new modules+programming (if they are bad, toss them and re-program the new one) is now the DIY killer for newer cars.

Try owning Audi,BMW and Mercedes... sometimes you're glad to own a late model Ford.

 

[Number Twelve]

That's an appropriate phrase, "DIY Killer".
They are trying to herd me into the Stealership!
(It isn't paranoia if they're really out to get you.)

I shall investigate how to get the ability to program replacement modules.
Probably something about a subscription to the Ford website.

Then I will still be at the mercy of the day they quit supporting the software, or I will download every part of what my Exploder might eventually need.

Pretty smart move by Ford. Use the Microsoft planned obsolescence model. Disposable, two hundred dollar computers, but with a $36,000 car wrapped around them.

I hope to hear from other people on this subject.

 

[Harpua216]

That's an appropriate phrase, "DIY Killer".

i just got a 4.0 a few weeks ago and its got some issues and this was what i was trying to define.

 

[Number Twelve]

Try owning Audi,BMW and Mercedes... sometimes you're glad to own a late model Ford.

Right now, I'm glad I didn't sell the Aerostar!

 

[TheCaptain]

Well I would say that for every person in here with a problem, there are many more who say how much they love their vehicle or simply don't post anything at all since there is nothing wrong. I would also suggest that you look around at all the other vehicles on the road as you leave work today. There are loads of explorers out there which means that the are probably not as bad as you are fearing. If they were truly awful then resale would be terrible as well.

This thread is sounding a bit like a tin-foil hat convention at the moment!

 

[lincolnshibuya]

Well I would say that for every person in here with a problem, there are many more who say how much they love their vehicle or simply don't post anything at all since there is nothing wrong. I would also suggest that you look around at all the other vehicles on the road as you leave work today. There are loads of explorers out there which means that the are probably not as bad as you are fearing. If they were truly awful then resale would be terrible as well.

This thread is sounding a bit like a tin-foil hat convention at the moment!

resale is actually bad on these vehicles (especially if you have a 4.0 and 2WD) that's why DIY guys like to snag these out of the heap.

 

[Number Twelve]

Well I would say that for every person in here with a problem, there are many more who say how much they love their vehicle or simply don't post anything at all since there is nothing wrong. I would also suggest that you look around at all the other vehicles on the road as you leave work today. There are loads of explorers out there which means that the are probably not as bad as you are fearing. If they were truly awful then resale would be terrible as well.

This thread is sounding a bit like a tin-foil hat convention at the moment!

All good points except the part about leaving work. I'm 65 and I don't have, "modern" cash flow. I have only been in a dealership once, and that was enough to convince me that I don't want to pay their prices for work I can do for myself. The concept of forcing a car to be dependent on the Dealership is foreign to me. The concept of turning a $5 microprocessor chip into a $500 repair charge is repugnant to me.

I'm an electronics nerd. I know what the chips cost. I also know that using, "proprietary" software is a cash flow scam. It's just a way to hold your car hostage and mortgage it back to you by installing systems that can't be repaired by anybody except a dealership. The, "captive parts" scam could be circumvented by going to the junk yard. Now that scam has been enhanced by requiring the parts to be "programmed" into each vehicle. I just want to get the Dealership probe out of my cavity so I don't have to choose between discarding the vehicle or applying for a loan when it needs a $5 computer chip.

 

[Michowski]

How reliable it is depends very much on how well YOU maintain it and take care of it. Could be 500k miles or could be 50k. It's all up to you.

 

[Number Twelve]

How reliable it is depends very much on how well YOU maintain it and take care of it. Could be 500k miles or could be 50k. It's all up to you.

That's great! If I just change the oil and air filter regularly, keep the tires at the right pressure, and replace bearings that start to howl, I will never put my groceries in the rear and then find out it forgot its PATS codes.

(I don't believe you.)

The main question here is, "How bad is it that these cars have computer failures completely unrelated to experiencing regular and proper mechanical maintenance." I understand that you believe they don't. I can hope you're right, but I doubt it.

Or am I missing a great large piece of information? Am I supposed to replace the Vehicle Security Module and the (Engine) Power Control Module at regular intervals, because that's called maintenance? Because they wear out? Because I can do that without going to the Dealership to have them programmed?

Actually, those modules have to be programmed to match the rest of the car. So, how often will I have to pay a Dealership to replace things like that? You say, "never" and I say, "I sure hope so!"

 

[gtyates]

We have an '04 4x4 and it has actually been very reliable. Only major repair was the badly designed rear wheel bearings, but honestly it has 116k and is still going strong. We maintain it like crazy, but that maintenance has added to an excellent experience. Everything works on ours as it is supposed to and we still use it as our travel vehicle.

Honestly, ALL vehicles are computer controlled and do force you to visit a dealership on occasion. Compared to the cost to maintain a Mercedes, BMW, Audi, etc.. I will gladly drive my "lowly" Ford and keep on trucking.

 

[Number Twelve]

We have an '04 4x4 and it has actually been very reliable.
Honestly, ALL vehicles are computer controlled and do force you to visit a dealership on occasion. Compared to the cost to maintain a Mercedes, BMW, Audi, etc.. I will gladly drive my "lowly" Ford and keep on trucking.

Thanks for the reply. Glad to hear that some people never need to replace (essential) microprocessors.

The thing that got me all worried is that the car I bought had failures in the moon roof controller, the air conditioning controller, the tire pressure monitors, the radio, the windows, the door locking system, the key fob, the Cruise Control, the interior lighting...basically every microprocessor except the engine and transmission controllers. If that ain't enough to make you wonder what's next, I don't know what is.

 

[Michowski]

120k and other then regular items such as brakes, bearings, fluids, no issues.

 

[RangerX]

I hear you, Number Twelve. I'm close to your age, and grew up with cars being strictly mechanical. Threads like this and others in the gen4 and gen5 sections make me determined to never own a vehicle built in this century! No offense to those of you who do, but it's just too much unnecessary tech for me. Power windows and door locks is my modern convenience line in the sand, along with my OBD-1 OHV engine.

 

[Number Twelve]

I hear you, Number Twelve. I'm close to your age, and grew up with cars being strictly mechanical.

Swear to Dog, if I could install a distributor and a C4 transmission driving a 9 inch Ford rear out of an E-150, I would.

 

[Harpua216]

How reliable it is depends very much on how well YOU maintain it and take care of it. Could be 500k miles or could be 50k. It's all up to you.

tell that to the guy that designed our timing chains (which they realistically put a 100K life on)

so it really isnt up to me. and the fact that they changed the design pretty fast tells me they knew it was a crap design. really, right down to the vac lines and fuel lines blocking suspension bolts. i mean comn... Honda we are not.