Need help with mounting motor to tranny

[Daisywheels]

I'm about an inch from flush. I do no know what is blocking a flush connection.

I am basically the helper with a backyard mechanic doing most of the work. He first tried to mount them together with the torque converter mounted on while on the hoist. I do not have a cherry picker, just a hoist.

I advised him that was not a good idea based on the threads I've read here (premounting the torque converter). So he took off the torque converter and started over. While trying to mount the motor and tranny again, he again used the torque converter nuts I guess to try to balance things for a flush fit. He was really struggling even before that. Something is blocking a flush connection, or we did something wrong (obviously).

The only idea I can come up with is to move the tranny away, and just mount the motor. Then mount the tranny. But I am not thrilled with that plan.

Any thoughts? Ideas? helpful advice? Thanks - DW

 

[C420sailor]

You're not using a load leveler, right? Just a chain?

Assuming you have the chain set up to have the engine angle matching the transmission, it should be relatively straight forward. I ever so slowly lower the engine and move it aft until the alignment dowels are an inch or two away from their respective holes---then I slowly slide the engine aft until I meet resistance---then rotate the engine with a large ratchet while pushing aft in order to get the torque converter studs to engage their holes. That usually results in the two mating up. Do the bellhousing bolts first.

The first two times I tried putting the engine in, I got stuck 1" away---the f'n load leveler was hitting the top of the firewall. Those things are junk.

Also, you don't have the engine mount plates bolted to the block right? Get the engine mated to the tranny, then jimmy the mount plates into place. I didn't do this at first and hated myself for it later.

 

[Daisywheels]

You're not using a load leveler, right? Just a chain?

Hi C420sailor - correct, just a chain

Assuming you have the chain set up to have the engine angle matching the transmission, it should be relatively straight forward. I ever so slowly lower the engine and move it aft until the alignment dowels are an inch or two away from their respective holes---then I slowly slide the engine aft until I meet resistance---then rotate the engine with a large ratchet while pushing aft in order to get the torque converter studs to engage their holes. That usually results in the two mating up. Do the bellhousing bolts first.

We tried everything you mentioned, and I think it may be just an angle problem since I'm using a hoist. I also am concerned why he won't bolt down the torque converter as the last step. Is that something to worry about?

The first two times I tried putting the engine in, I got stuck 1" away---the f'n load leveler was hitting the top of the firewall. Those things are junk.

Well since I don't know what a load leveler is, I'm certain we didn't use one.

Also, you don't have the engine mount plates bolted to the block right? Get the engine mated to the tranny, then jimmy the mount plates into place. I didn't do this at first and hated myself for it later.

He had the left side mount plates on (not the right side), but they were not bolted down. I'll tell him to get rid of mounting plate since they are sitting on their studs.

My thinking right now is to completely remove the transmission far away from the motor, then mount the motor, and do the tranny mount last. Good/bad idea? Thanks - DW

 

[ranger7ltr]

My thoughts...

Are that the torque convertor is sitting too far out of the tranny and stopping the engine from mating with the tranny...

I won't ever try to mount a torque convertor onto the engine and then try to mate the engine to the transmission...Too many variables especially the torque convertor must index and line up inside the front pump... If it doesn't go ALL THE WAY INSIDE THE PUMP and the engine is rotated, prepare to replace the front pump and maybe more...

From what I am understanding here, the trans is out of the truck as is the engine right? If that is the case there are two ways to handle this;
1. Remove the trans, mount the torque convertor completely inside the trans, then mate the two together and then install both as one unit...or
2. Again remove the torque convertor and mount the torque convertor completely inside the trans then mount the trans into the truck and while supporting the front of the trans with a jack install the engine...

I have no preference but you MUST verify that the nose of the torque convertor is actually below the surface of the trans face or it is not completely installed...

 

[Daisywheels]

Are that the torque convertor is sitting too far out of the tranny and stopping the engine from mating with the tranny...

I won't ever try to mount a torque convertor onto the engine and then try to mate the engine to the transmission...Too many variables especially the torque convertor must index and line up inside the front pump... If it doesn't go ALL THE WAY INSIDE THE PUMP and the engine is rotated, prepare to replace the front pump and maybe more...

From what I am understanding here, the trans is out of the truck as is the engine right? If that is the case there are two ways to handle this;
1. Remove the trans, mount the torque convertor completely inside the trans, then mate the two together and then install both as one unit...or
2. Again remove the torque convertor and mount the torque convertor completely inside the trans then mount the trans into the truck and while supporting the front of the trans with a jack install the engine...

I have no preference but you MUST verify that the nose of the torque convertor is actually below the surface of the trans face or it is not completely installed...

Hey Ranger7, currently the new motor is "somewhat mounted to the transmission. There is about a 1 inch gap before being flush. We can't figure out what is holding it back, or what is blocking it from mating up properly. I do remember him saying the torque converter is not tightened - he just put on the nuts for a reason of which I do not know. I kept telling him I can tighten the nuts through the starter gap. Thanks for your comments - Good info! -DW

 

[koda2000]

STOP. You cannot mount the TC to the engine first. That's a great way to ruin your trans pump. The TC has to be correctly inserted into the trans pump first. This involves placing the TC into the trans and spinning it and pushing it until it seats all the way into the pump, which happens in 2 distinct steps. When the TC is fully inserted in the pump you will barely be able to get your fingers behind it. When you achieve this you should have very little problem mating the engine and transmission.

 

[Mike65]

Are that the torque convertor is sitting too far out of the tranny and stopping the engine from mating with the tranny...

I won't ever try to mount a torque convertor onto the engine and then try to mate the engine to the transmission...Too many variables especially the torque convertor must index and line up inside the front pump... If it doesn't go ALL THE WAY INSIDE THE PUMP and the engine is rotated, prepare to replace the front pump and maybe more...

From what I am understanding here, the trans is out of the truck as is the engine right? If that is the case there are two ways to handle this;
1. Remove the trans, mount the torque convertor completely inside the trans, then mate the two together and then install both as one unit...or
2. Again remove the torque convertor and mount the torque convertor completely inside the trans then mount the trans into the truck and while supporting the front of the trans with a jack install the engine...

I have no preference but you MUST verify that the nose of the torque convertor is actually below the surface of the trans face or it is not completely installed...

X2, if you can not get the trans & engine to mate up flush the torque converter is NOT seated all the way into the trans. The way the trans guy at the dealerships I used to work at did it was to lift up a little on the center of the torque converter while spinning it & it will take a few times to get it all the way in. Put a straight edge across the front of the trans bell housing & make sure that the converter is not sticking out of the trans.

 

[Tech By Trade]

If you haven't destroyed the pump in your transmission you are lucky. You should have a half inch of space between the torque converter and the flex plate with the transmission installed. Pull the engine, make damn sure you have the torque converter installed right and then install the block. Odds are your tranny is ker####ed if you have put too much force on it already.

 

[C420sailor]

Yeah man. If you're able to get some of the TC nuts spun on with 1" gap between the bellhousing and engine block, that TC is NOT seated in the trans. Agree with all stated above.

Those nuts (replacing them with new ones is good headwork) should be the last thing you do. Bellhousing bolts, engine mounts, then spin those on and tighten them down.

 

[Daisywheels]

Tq

Thanks everyone. We still do not have it mated. I'm curious about what Koda suggested using a "2 step process." We spun the TC, and it did seat back a bit. I put my hand behind it, but can't really judge if it was seated all the way properly.

Do I spin the TQ again to see if it moves even further in? Is that the 2nd step process Koda was referring to? Because we only did it once, and my mechanic said that was enough disregarding my objections. Some people just have their own way of doing things, even if wrong, and are too stubborn to listen to what I hear here from all of you. Thanks again! -DW

 

[funfool]

Yes koda is correct, you will put the tc on the trans shaft and spin the tc until it slides i on the shaft, then keep turning it some more until it drops in further.
On my ford truck I had to spin the tc 3 times to get it fully installed.

But keep spinning it until you can put a straight edge across the bell housing and see the tc is not sticking out past the bell housing.

 

[Daisywheels]

Timing chain guides in oil pan

Well, I went to get back at this morning, decided to clean up the residual oil in the oil pan from taking the filter off, and this is is what I find. Anybody care to guess what is? No need, they are timing chain guides in oil pan. This is the second motor this damn company sent me. There is no need to go further now.

This time I will mention the company name so people stay away from them. They are G&R Auto out of Oregon. I;m currently disputing the charge via my credit card, since G&R Auto says they will not ship another motor, "that motor has been tested and runs perfectly." My *ss. -DW