Dismiss Notice



Register Today It's free! This box will disappear once registered!

6" lift w/TTB = LOTS of negative camber

Discussion in 'Modified 1991-1994 Explorers' started by Cameron Romans, February 8, 2018.

  • Searches ExplorerForum.com
    1. Cameron Romans

      Cameron Romans New Member

      Joined:
      February 8, 2018
      Messages:
      3
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      1
      City, State:
      Dallas
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1994, Explorer, limited
      I'm somewhat new to working on vehicles, and talking about it on forums, so cut me some slack please.

      To begin with, I bought a 94 explorer 4x4 with a few things messed up on it.(blown Head Gasket, windows wont roll up/down, a/c-heater are out, tires have bad negative camber, gets the "death wobble" over 50mph, and it needs some exhaust work).

      Anyways majority of it is fairly simple, the only thing that stumps me is the negative camber and all of the front suspension stuff.

      The truck came with a 6" lift and 35" tires (from what ive read, big lifts+TTB=no bueno). I bought a chilton manual and repaired the H.G successfully, so now it runs perfect.

      I'm just stumped on this next obstacle, the TTB suspension. The tires are entirely bald on the inside edge, and they tilt /--\. and Whenever I turn it, the tires tilt outwards in the direction im steering \--/. Also whenever i rock the Explorer back and forth it makes a loud clicking/clanking noise somewhere in the front suspension, the shocks also have alot of play in them, im sure the springs need to be replaced too. I know the radius arm bushings are worn out, but i have a feeling that isn't the only issue. You can also see in one of the pictures below that there is a tow strap connecting the radius arms, don't ask me why it's there, the previous owner did it.

      So before i go all rambo on my front suspension id like a few pointers, maybe some of you explorer veterans can shed some light on my issues. A list of possible solutions to my camber issue would be great. I also don't want to hear how difficult something might be for a beginner blah blah blah. I have common sense, and know how to read a workshop manual, so ill be good. IMG_4107.JPG IMG_4186.JPG IMG_4194.jpg
       
    2. Support EF

      Join the Elite Explorers for $20

      Explorer Forum has probably saved you that much already, and will continue to save you money as you learn how to diagnose fix problems yourself, and learn which modifications work without having to experiment on your own. Elite Explorer members see practically no ads, can add their own profile photo, upload photo attachments in all forums, and Media Gallery, create more private Conversations, and more. Join Today. Your support is greatly appreciated.


      to hide adverts.
    3. Rick

      Rick Pumpkin Pilot Staff Member Admin Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      February 8, 1999
      Messages:
      30,407
      Media:
      40
      Albums:
      4
      Likes Received:
      354
      Trophy Points:
      113
      City, State:
      Wayoutin, Aridzona
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      '93 XL Pumpkin Edition
      Callsign:
      AB7FH
      The right side radius arm is wandering around because that plastic bushing seat is practically gone. It will not hold an alignment until that is fixed. Look for bent or cracked brackets or any cracks at the frame mounting points. Also check the play in your wheel bearings ASAP since they are known to loosen up with big tires. No telling what kind of shape they are in right now.
       
    4. kristinandq

      kristinandq Member

      Joined:
      March 11, 2015
      Messages:
      62
      Likes Received:
      20
      Trophy Points:
      18
      City, State:
      West Valley City Utah
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1991 explorer
      My front end was clicking when shaking side to side or up and down. Changed my sway bar bushings and it went away. I also had a Navajo that was neglected and the radius arm mounting holes were egg shaped. Previous owner had strap mounted similar to hide it. so that it did not sound and feel like someone was pounding on it from under your seat.
       
    5. Rhett

      Rhett Let Them Eat Cake Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      May 13, 2000
      Messages:
      4,602
      Likes Received:
      62
      Trophy Points:
      68
      City, State:
      Cape Girardeau, MO
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      94 Sport 4x4
      Looks really sketch. Can you post a pic of the other end of the radius arms?
       
    6. Cameron Romans

      Cameron Romans New Member

      Joined:
      February 8, 2018
      Messages:
      3
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      1
      City, State:
      Dallas
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1994, Explorer, limited
      What do you mean by other end? Like where the radius arms connect with the mounting bracket? where the retainer is?
       
    7. Rick

      Rick Pumpkin Pilot Staff Member Admin Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      February 8, 1999
      Messages:
      30,407
      Media:
      40
      Albums:
      4
      Likes Received:
      354
      Trophy Points:
      113
      City, State:
      Wayoutin, Aridzona
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      '93 XL Pumpkin Edition
      Callsign:
      AB7FH
      The other side of the radius arm bushing. The side you can't see from the view you posted.

      At least I think that's what he wanted a picture of.
       
    8. Rhett

      Rhett Let Them Eat Cake Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      May 13, 2000
      Messages:
      4,602
      Likes Received:
      62
      Trophy Points:
      68
      City, State:
      Cape Girardeau, MO
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      94 Sport 4x4
      Actually, I was a little turned around. I wanted to see the radius arm bracket area where it bolts (rivets, if stock) to the frame.

      I'm shocked that those look like stock brackets! Curious if they have been modded to drop them. No wonder you are having alignment issues.

      The swaybar brackets are bent way back, too! Someone put a much larger bolt / bracket there.
       
    9. corkey

      corkey Moderator Emeritus Moderator Emeritus

      Joined:
      January 3, 2008
      Messages:
      5,960
      Likes Received:
      12
      Trophy Points:
      58
      Location:
      Sioux Narrows Canada
      City, State:
      Elite Canuck,multiple ifs offender,, and musky maniac,, i wheel and i fish,,
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      99 xls,96 xl,91,08 Ranger
      there is no drop on the bushing mount,, look at the angle of the arms in the one pic,, radius arms should be almost flat if the back end was dropped too,,
       
    10. RangerX

      RangerX Elite Ranger Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      July 14, 1999
      Messages:
      9,247
      Likes Received:
      83
      Trophy Points:
      68
      City, State:
      Omao, Kauai
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      '93 Ranger XLT 4X4
      A lifted TTB needs to have the radius parallel to the ground to function well. Meaning however much the front axle is dropped (lifted), the rear end of the radius arms need to be dropped the same amount. You can get away with 1"-2" difference, but not more.
      It appears you have a large lift in front, and stock location in the rear, i.e. no lift. You'll never have correct alignment or a safe driving vehicle with the current setup.

      I suggest you first try to identify what brand lift you have, which can tell you how much lift you actually have. Try scratching the black paint and see what color is underneath, yellow, red, etc. Did you get the 6" number from the previous owner, or is it just an estimation?

      Also, it would help us more if you could post some more pics. Try to get the whole radius arm in one pic from the side.
       
    11. 5spdman

      5spdman Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      December 2, 2009
      Messages:
      731
      Likes Received:
      65
      Trophy Points:
      28
      City, State:
      Stryker, OH
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      91 Explorer XLT
      I'm on the train that part of the problem is that the back of your radius arms are still in the stock position and not dropped down, which is my guess as to the reason you're getting death wobble; your beams are twisted forward which messes with not just your camber, but your caster as well...

      One option is to get drop brackets to move the RA mounts down, or if you want the more involved route (which is what I did, but gained me wheel travel) you make new mounts for the frame, extend the radius arms and put joints on them...

      I'm also curious about those shackles on your rear springs.........
       
    12. corkey

      corkey Moderator Emeritus Moderator Emeritus

      Joined:
      January 3, 2008
      Messages:
      5,960
      Likes Received:
      12
      Trophy Points:
      58
      Location:
      Sioux Narrows Canada
      City, State:
      Elite Canuck,multiple ifs offender,, and musky maniac,, i wheel and i fish,,
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      99 xls,96 xl,91,08 Ranger
      i agree , it looks like the springs on the back are backwards,, or did they drop both ends ??
      cause shackles on both ends is not very good,,
       
    13. stephen93Eddie

      stephen93Eddie New Member

      Joined:
      December 8, 2016
      Messages:
      33
      Likes Received:
      8
      Trophy Points:
      8
      City, State:
      Hamilton MT
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1994 Ford explorer sport
      needs a longer pitman arm too, or a centerlink style steering. the angles are super wonky.
       
    14. 5spdman

      5spdman Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      December 2, 2009
      Messages:
      731
      Likes Received:
      65
      Trophy Points:
      28
      City, State:
      Stryker, OH
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      91 Explorer XLT
      That is a good point...is it death wobble or bump steer that you're getting? Cause with that setup, you've got to be getting some crazy bump steer...
       
      • Like Like x 1
    15. corkey

      corkey Moderator Emeritus Moderator Emeritus

      Joined:
      January 3, 2008
      Messages:
      5,960
      Likes Received:
      12
      Trophy Points:
      58
      Location:
      Sioux Narrows Canada
      City, State:
      Elite Canuck,multiple ifs offender,, and musky maniac,, i wheel and i fish,,
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      99 xls,96 xl,91,08 Ranger
      yeah the bumpsteer will kill ya,, if the badly executed lift kit, the rear springs mounted wrong,the radius arms held on by a ratchet strap, and the radius arms not even tightened in place mean nothing,,,
      i wouldn't move it around my yard in that condition let alone drive it to the corner store to find out it had bumpsteer,,
      there's you laundry list,, clean it up, it may be drivable after that,,
       
    16. 96EXXLTinCO

      96EXXLTinCO Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      November 14, 2014
      Messages:
      448
      Likes Received:
      48
      Trophy Points:
      38
      Location:
      Colorado
      City, State:
      Colorado Springs
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1996 Explorer XLT
      Everybody hit everything I noticed, except (and maybe I missed it) how it appears the front driveshaft either is, or will contact the radius arm bracket (another reason it needs radius arm drop brackets, or long arms). It does appear to be a 6" lift, minus radius arm drop brackets and dropped pitman arm. I've experienced some bump steer with the same size lift steering angles that were off. Our angles were no where near that far off, and hitting bumps in town would make you feel like you had no control whatsoever, so I cant imagine what kind of rodeo this must be. When we mention steering angles, we mean the tie rods that go outward and connect to the knuckles, should be at the same angles as your axle beams. With the the much steeper angles like you have here, when you go through a dip we'll say, as the beams come up as the suspension compresses, the tie rods are going to push both tires outward, as in major toe out. At this point its anyone'e guess as to which tire has the most influence and takes the truck it's direction. Looks like the only things somebody got their hands on was the axle pivot drop brackets, sway bar drop brackets, and taller springs, and either didn't get, or didn't install, radius arm drop brackets and dropped pitman arm.

      Those shackles at the front of the rear springs are definitely concerning. If there's shackles at both ends, without some type of a ladder bars type set up, seems to me like that axle could move back and forth at will. On a 6" lift, I think just about every explorer I've seen goes spring over, a.k.a. relocates the leaf spring from under the axle, to the top. That alone is good for 5.5"-6" of lift. I'd be might curious to see how the leaf springs are attached at the rear if you could get a pic of that.

      Are you screwed? No. Is it fixable? Yes. It's going to take some time and parts though.
       
    17. BKennedy

      BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      November 29, 2000
      Messages:
      5,732
      Likes Received:
      279
      Trophy Points:
      103
      Location:
      Location, Location
      City, State:
      San Diego, PRofK
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1994 XLT
      If rear leaf springs had shackles at both ends the springs would be resting on the frame. The shackles go on the rear leaf spring mounts, not the front. I would be tempted to tear the entire suspension, and everything the previous owner touched, and start over.
       
    18. 96EXXLTinCO

      96EXXLTinCO Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      November 14, 2014
      Messages:
      448
      Likes Received:
      48
      Trophy Points:
      38
      Location:
      Colorado
      City, State:
      Colorado Springs
      Year, Model & Trim Level:
      1996 Explorer XLT
      I'd just about have to agree. I mean the pivot drop brackets look good....................that's about it. I sure hope the seller didn't know what he was even selling. That's screaming for karma to come whoop the snot out of him if he did. I would really like to see just what's going on with the rear leaf..............mount I guess?.........where the shackles would normally be?
       

    Share This Page







    We Support Our Troops!