Why I’m NOT running E85 in my 2020 Explorer ST

[LurchII]

This is a follow-up from a post I made yesterday called “Drag Strip, Actual Numbers. I was doing some homework on running E85 in my 2020 Explorer ST. There is certain criteria the vehicle must meet before you can run E85. Also the vehicle will have certain markings, (see below). Most modern vehicles are also marked “flex-fuel”, and there is no marking on my vehicle.

The 8th character of the vehicle VIN (vehicle identification number) indicates that a vehicle is E85 compatible. Mine is “C” NOT flex-fuel.

FUEL QUALITY - E85
Choosing the Right Fuel - Flex Fuel
Vehicles
Flex fuel vehicles have one of the following identifiers:
• Yellow fuel filler cap.
• Yellow bezel around the fuel filler inlet.
• Yellow fuel filler housing.
• Yellow E85 label on the fuel tank filler door.
Owner’s manual, electronic version page 179
See Pictures

In doing my research this was the general consensus I found:

E85 fuel is a mixture of ethanol (up to 85%) and gasoline. It is designed primarily for flex-fuel vehicles (FFV) although it is not mandatory FFVs use E85 fuel. A non-FFV will run and drive with E85 but it will experience a loss of power and fuel economy because E85 has less energy-density than regular gasoline.

The hazard associated with E85 in a non-FFV is the corrosive action of ethanol on certain components of the fuel-system, specifically any exposed magnesium, aluminum, or rubber. One exposure of E85 will not "instantly" melt all the magnesium, aluminum, or rubber it comes in contact with but over time, it can erode those surfaces and the resulting residue will be processed through the fuel system.

E85 in a non-FFV may also cause a check-engine light because the O2 sensors might detect less emissions and interpret it as a "lean" condition and attempt to adjust the fuel-air mixture.

This was not meant to draw controversy, but to start conversations. Do your own homework and make your own decisions. My decision is to not run E85 part because of my extended warranty, part because long term damage to my fuel system. Not being designed to run E85.

I’m looking for the most out of my vehicle, I’m not willing to damage my vehicle to do it!!!

Jeff

 

[Mbrooks420]

Was there a recommendation you do? Unless your vehicle is specifically made for it, e85 isn’t really an option.

 

[GalenaST]

Who told you to run e85? Some tunes allow a diluted mixture such as e30, whether that's advisable or not is another story.

 

[ST Bob]

The 2020 ST is not a flexfuel vehicle. Do not use E85 in it.

 

[peterk9]

The 2020 ST is not a flex fuel vehicle. Do not use E85 in it.

Welcome to the Forum Bob.

Peter

 

[hbalek]

So on my last fillup I bought 93 octane at Exxon for 50 cents more per gallon. I want to say I'm getting better performance but not sure yet. Has anyone else observed a difference in efficiency or performance? The total extra cost on the purchase was $8 or so. Not too bad.

 

[peterk9]

50 cents more than 87? I haven't filled up for 2 months and will likely have enough for at least another month so I don't know what the difference is here right now except it's much more than 50 cents from 87 to 94. My station doesn't have 93 octane. I have been using 91 octane and figured the extra mileage/performance doesn't really warrant the extra cost but I keep using it though because it is probably better for the engine in the long run plus I get a great discount using my gas card.

Peter

 

[hbalek]

50 cents more than 87? I haven't filled up for 2 months and will likely have enough for at least another month so I don't know what the difference is here right now except it's much more than 50 cents from 87 to 94. My station doesn't have 93 octane. I have been using 91 octane and figured the extra mileage/performance doesn't really warrant the extra cost but I keep using it though because it is probably better for the engine in the long run plus I get a great discount using my gas card.

Peter

Yeah I paid 2.30 instead of 1.80 per gallon at ExxonMobil with my Safeway loyalty 10 cents off.

 

[peterk9]

Yeah I paid 2.30 instead of 1.80 per gallon at ExxonMobil with my Safeway loyalty 10 cents off.

That doesn't look right.

 

[Mbrooks420]

Premium gas is no better for your motor. The car detunes on 87 so that’s likely best for it.

 

[peterk9]

The 91 octane has a higher cleaning concentartion (Tactrol/Techron) and may or may not be ethanol free. I've read different statements on that. Will have to try and figure that one out.

Peter

 

[Mbrooks420]

The ethanol content typically varies. More cleaners doesn’t necessarily mean better. Using 87 I’ve never had issues with “dirty” fuel injection parts in the 200,000 mile life cycles my cars go through.

 

[hbalek]

That doesn't look right.

Seeing is believing! From Google today. This is why I decided to try it. Most other gas stations charge about 80 cents to a dollar more per gallon of 93 octane.

 

[peterk9]

What I meant by "doesn't look right" is that according to your post you paid $2.30 instead of $1.80 with your 10 cents off card. Why would you pay more? Am I missing something?

Peter

 

[hbalek]

What I meant by "doesn't look right" is that according to your post you paid $2.30 instead of $1.80 with your 10 cents off card. Why would you pay more? Am I missing something?

Peter

10 cents off per gallon regardless of grade. 1.80 (87 octane) and 2.30 (93 octane)) instead of 1.90 and 2.40. Get it?

 

[peterk9]

10 cents off per gallon regardless of grade. 1.80 (87 octane) and 2.30 (93 octane)) instead of 1.90 and 2.40. Get it?

Got it. Didn't realize you were comparing to different grades.

Peter

 

[mjlkwolfe@gmail.]

This is a follow-up from a post I made yesterday called “Drag Strip, Actual Numbers. I was doing some homework on running E85 in my 2020 Explorer ST. There is certain criteria the vehicle must meet before you can run E85. Also the vehicle will have certain markings, (see below). Most modern vehicles are also marked “flex-fuel”, and there is no marking on my vehicle.

The 8th character of the vehicle VIN (vehicle identification number) indicates that a vehicle is E85 compatible. Mine is “C” NOT flex-fuel.

FUEL QUALITY - E85
Choosing the Right Fuel - Flex Fuel
Vehicles
Flex fuel vehicles have one of the following identifiers:
• Yellow fuel filler cap.
• Yellow bezel around the fuel filler inlet.
• Yellow fuel filler housing.
• Yellow E85 label on the fuel tank filler door.
Owner’s manual, electronic version page 179
See Pictures

In doing my research this was the general consensus I found:

E85 fuel is a mixture of ethanol (up to 85%) and gasoline. It is designed primarily for flex-fuel vehicles (FFV) although it is not mandatory FFVs use E85 fuel. A non-FFV will run and drive with E85 but it will experience a loss of power and fuel economy because E85 has less energy-density than regular gasoline.

The hazard associated with E85 in a non-FFV is the corrosive action of ethanol on certain components of the fuel-system, specifically any exposed magnesium, aluminum, or rubber. One exposure of E85 will not "instantly" melt all the magnesium, aluminum, or rubber it comes in contact with but over time, it can erode those surfaces and the resulting residue will be processed through the fuel system.

E85 in a non-FFV may also cause a check-engine light because the O2 sensors might detect less emissions and interpret it as a "lean" condition and attempt to adjust the fuel-air mixture.

This was not meant to draw controversy, but to start conversations. Do your own homework and make your own decisions. My decision is to not run E85 part because of my extended warranty, part because long term damage to my fuel system. Not being designed to run E85.

I’m looking for the most out of my vehicle, I’m not willing to damage my vehicle to do it!!!

Jeff

All fuels contain at least 10% ethanol & has for many years now
Therefore all of the vehicles designed to run on 10% ethanol blend gasoline must have the same fuel system components as those designed to run E85
E85 is 108 octane fuel
However the injectors on the ST do not have adequate flow to support straight E85
The injectors however are designed exactly the same with the same components as higher flow GDI injectors designed for E85
However most tuning houses offer E30 & E50 calibrations
E50 blends are approximately 100 octane
Therefore those calibrations produce significantly more torque & hp than those designed for E10 93 octane fuels
Ethanol is a carbon neutral fuel
Ethanol is produced from plants & when consumed in an engine the carbon released is equal to the carbon consumed from the air for the plants grown to produce it
Even though ethanol has less energy per gallon, the cost to produce it is lower & the price at the pump is usually lower
If the Price of ethanol is 80% or less than premium gasoline then the fuel cost per mile is lower with ethanol

 

[peterk9]

Not all fuels contain 10% ethanol. According to this site, there are over 15,000 stations, including 26 in your state of Arizona, that sell ethanol free gasoline. Shell and Esso are some of the major brands that sell ethanol free gas in some of their octane levels. Ethanol-free gas stations in the U.S. and Canada

Peter

 

[Mbrooks420]

Agreed. Not all fuels have any ethanol, and many things actually require the use of entirely ethanol free fuels. Regular gas has a MAXIMUM of 10%, not at least.

There’s a huge difference between up to 10% and up to 83% Ethanol content. All vehicles are certainly not fine with E85.

Ethanol is also NOT carbon neutral. It *might* be if you didn’t have to expend ENORMOUS amounts of energy to produce it.

 

[MrQ]

Premium gas is no better for your motor. The car detunes on 87 so that’s likely best for it.

On older vehicles designed for 87, then yes. But if the vehicle is designed to run with 89 or even 91 octane it will adjust timing accordingly, you could even start knocking if you ran too low of an octane for the engine (though I think most manufacturers account for that). However it will take a while for the computer to re-adjust to a new octane so it may take 2 or 3 fill-ups before you notice a difference.

My Ram was rated for 89 but could do 87. Only time I ran 89 was if I was towing and there was a power difference and it was also not rated for E85.