exploree
New Member
- Joined
- March 23, 2011
- Messages
- 3
- Reaction score
- 0
- City, State
- Los Angeles
- Year, Model & Trim Level
- '93 Sport 4x4
Hi,
I'm running into a Check Engine light issue once again after many years of no issues. It all came about after I took my truck into a shop and the mechanic repaired a water leak that required removing the intake manifold. I came to the shop by a recommendation, but the mechanic wasn't working their anymore. So, I opted for the guy that took his place.
That mechanic created a larger problem as I found after the repair. The CE light and an extremely rough idle were brand new problems. Worse, he or none of his fellow mechanics had the ability to figure out what the trouble codes were. The repair job was the start of these new issues. A CE and a rough idle that was intermittently dropping down to about 550/600 rpm every few minutes. Sometimes, the engine would almost die. The owner saw the problem and knew his hired gun had made an error and did not have the ability to fix the problem. I got my money back yet with another headache. This was not a good feeling after knowing the work he'd done.
Meanwhile, coincidentally enough, I needed to get the truck smog tested. I took the car in to another shop who said they would see if it passed smog and, pull the codes at the same time.
My hydrocarbons did not pass the 25 mph test with a reading of 149. Also, the codes they came up with were: 172, 173 and 336. They did their test with KOEO. However, they quoted me Right and "Left" O2 sensors and, EGR repair. Although, they did not specify what they would repair would be with the EGR. They just quoted me $400.
I know that O2 sensors can be a common repair item for these emission issues, yet I was a bit reluctant since this Check Engine and rough idle happened immediately following the removal and replacement of the intake manifold. Also, years ago I had a bad experience with a mechanic who tried to troubleshoot a similar rough idle I was having at that time. The issue eventually was resolved with a Mass Air Flow sensor. But that was painful as the initial mechanic unsuccessfully replaced EGR, TPS, L & R O2 sensors which never changed the idle problem. Mass Air Flow with a vacuum line was the answer and the dealer was involved at that point.
With a few scrapes, I decided to take the forum's tips and check for myself what is going on. I wanted to know about all the idiosyncrasies of what might be occurring and not just throw parts at this. Thank you to MrShorty's Code Pulling tips and all the other great people in here who contribute so much of their knowledge and experience. With just a little forum feedback, I know I'll get the proper advice on how to proceed. Hey, maybe this will help someone else as well.
First, I reset and cleared the codes as prescribed after the shop checked them. I want to see what I could muster up with a fresh start. Then, I drove over ten miles to get the codes activated again. The CE light comes on again intermittently as usual.
Connected my jumper wire from Pin 2 of the wire harness to the test connector. Got into the vehicle and turned the key on and proceeded with KOEO test.
KOEO: 111
CM: 172, 173 (Right O2 sensor indicates Lean...indicates Rich)
KOER: 538 (insufficient RPM during KOER Dynamic Response Test)
*Note: That seems appropriate as the RPM's were dropping. That's the one issue I have. The test did not continue any further.
I did not get the 336 code (Pressure feedback EGR Circuit voltage higher than expected) as the mechanic at the smog place did earlier. Tested it over again several times to make sure.
Btw, when the rough idle is occurring, removing each of the 3 plugs that are on the injector coil on the right side does not cause the engine to run any rougher. Only these three, when removed, do not change idle performance when it is already running poor. And, spark is still occurring on them. It seems as there is a connection with these cylinders. Maybe being rich, and flooding intermittently or, ???
Does this still seem related to replacing the Right bank O2 sensor?
Or, is that just an emissions issue and different from the rough idle?
The mechanical coincidence that set this check engine light off with the rough idle is one that I thought might save time when assessing the problem.
Still, I'm wondering...was the work that was done on the intake manifold capable of setting off these codes and causing a rough idle?
The other mechanic ran some brake cleaner around the manifold to check for vacuum leaks. No leak detected.
Also, if this is an O2 sensor, should I replace both O2 sensors as a precautionary step?
Thanks,
I'm running into a Check Engine light issue once again after many years of no issues. It all came about after I took my truck into a shop and the mechanic repaired a water leak that required removing the intake manifold. I came to the shop by a recommendation, but the mechanic wasn't working their anymore. So, I opted for the guy that took his place.
That mechanic created a larger problem as I found after the repair. The CE light and an extremely rough idle were brand new problems. Worse, he or none of his fellow mechanics had the ability to figure out what the trouble codes were. The repair job was the start of these new issues. A CE and a rough idle that was intermittently dropping down to about 550/600 rpm every few minutes. Sometimes, the engine would almost die. The owner saw the problem and knew his hired gun had made an error and did not have the ability to fix the problem. I got my money back yet with another headache. This was not a good feeling after knowing the work he'd done.
Meanwhile, coincidentally enough, I needed to get the truck smog tested. I took the car in to another shop who said they would see if it passed smog and, pull the codes at the same time.
My hydrocarbons did not pass the 25 mph test with a reading of 149. Also, the codes they came up with were: 172, 173 and 336. They did their test with KOEO. However, they quoted me Right and "Left" O2 sensors and, EGR repair. Although, they did not specify what they would repair would be with the EGR. They just quoted me $400.
I know that O2 sensors can be a common repair item for these emission issues, yet I was a bit reluctant since this Check Engine and rough idle happened immediately following the removal and replacement of the intake manifold. Also, years ago I had a bad experience with a mechanic who tried to troubleshoot a similar rough idle I was having at that time. The issue eventually was resolved with a Mass Air Flow sensor. But that was painful as the initial mechanic unsuccessfully replaced EGR, TPS, L & R O2 sensors which never changed the idle problem. Mass Air Flow with a vacuum line was the answer and the dealer was involved at that point.
With a few scrapes, I decided to take the forum's tips and check for myself what is going on. I wanted to know about all the idiosyncrasies of what might be occurring and not just throw parts at this. Thank you to MrShorty's Code Pulling tips and all the other great people in here who contribute so much of their knowledge and experience. With just a little forum feedback, I know I'll get the proper advice on how to proceed. Hey, maybe this will help someone else as well.
First, I reset and cleared the codes as prescribed after the shop checked them. I want to see what I could muster up with a fresh start. Then, I drove over ten miles to get the codes activated again. The CE light comes on again intermittently as usual.
Connected my jumper wire from Pin 2 of the wire harness to the test connector. Got into the vehicle and turned the key on and proceeded with KOEO test.
KOEO: 111
CM: 172, 173 (Right O2 sensor indicates Lean...indicates Rich)
KOER: 538 (insufficient RPM during KOER Dynamic Response Test)
*Note: That seems appropriate as the RPM's were dropping. That's the one issue I have. The test did not continue any further.
I did not get the 336 code (Pressure feedback EGR Circuit voltage higher than expected) as the mechanic at the smog place did earlier. Tested it over again several times to make sure.
Btw, when the rough idle is occurring, removing each of the 3 plugs that are on the injector coil on the right side does not cause the engine to run any rougher. Only these three, when removed, do not change idle performance when it is already running poor. And, spark is still occurring on them. It seems as there is a connection with these cylinders. Maybe being rich, and flooding intermittently or, ???
Does this still seem related to replacing the Right bank O2 sensor?
Or, is that just an emissions issue and different from the rough idle?
The mechanical coincidence that set this check engine light off with the rough idle is one that I thought might save time when assessing the problem.
Still, I'm wondering...was the work that was done on the intake manifold capable of setting off these codes and causing a rough idle?
The other mechanic ran some brake cleaner around the manifold to check for vacuum leaks. No leak detected.
Also, if this is an O2 sensor, should I replace both O2 sensors as a precautionary step?
Thanks,
