Exploder Not Starting

[MatthewAlan8]

1997 Ford Explorer SOHC

Left friend's house last night and car wouldn't start. Turned key and got one click. Friend then jumpstarted my car and I drove home.

Woke up this morning to go to work, turned the key and got nothing. Maybe one click and then gone. Had a friend attempt to give me a jump start and couldn't get any further than the one click.

Battery purchased at Auto Zone 5 months ago, so brand new (Duralast Gold) and it has a 2 year warranty on it.

Could this be the battery? My guess was that something is loose. There is absolutely nothing left on in the car to drain the battery, and all doors were closed.

I had to get a ride to work this morning so I haven't had a chance to really look it over, but my brother in law says he thinks it's the starter. My brother thinks that it could be the ground wire being loose and draining the battery. Neither have looked at it in person.

Too many things wrong with this vehicle and I can't keep up...any thoughts?

 

[Macgiobuin]

'ground wire being loose and draining the battery' No. Ground wire being loose will NOT drain the battery. geez. Ground wire being loose could cause the starter to get insufficient voltage/amperage. Starter could be bad, but it is about 4th on the list.
1st: battery cables are clogged with acid/lead corrosion salt or are loose.
2nd: your battery can't hold a charge; it is bad. (probably not this if only 5 months old; charge it up to be sure)
3rd: your alternator stopped generating current. (quick test: with engine running, disconnect the negative side of the battery. engine dies? means that your alternator is not working)
4th: your starter is bad.

 

[rhauf]

let's diagnose this... it didn't start on it's own battery power, but started when a friend jumped it (bypassing battery "connection")

it's dirty battery connections.

i am 100% sure of this.

i bet if you turn on the headlights, they will go off when you try to start the car (and it just clicks) also you're clock and stuff probably got reset.

 

[MatthewAlan8]

Thanks for the help. Will have my first chance messing with it tomorrow morning. Wasn't thinking right earlier when I made the thread because I was at work and just wanted some community input before I took a look at it, but by "loose ground wire" I also was meaning loose connecting cables. I figured there was a bad connection and it was causing the battery to lose its charge.

 

[MatthewAlan8]

NOT THE BATTERY!

After having a friend turn the ignition and with my ear to the engine, the clicking was coming from the solonoid. I removed it, tightened everything up and it started right up.

Went to Auto Zone and picked up a replacement solonoid just in case mine was going bad (cheap part). Drove it throughout the day and then went to the grocery store. Went back out to my car and it happened again.

Tried doing what I did earlier, then I replaced the solonoid with the new one and still got nothing.

Started thinking that my ignition could be going bad so I used some plyers while the key was in the on position and it was sparking and clicking so it wasn't the ignition.

Then I went underneath to take a look at the starter. Tried pounding on the starter while a friend turned the key and wasn't getting anywhere. Took the starter out, but could not get to the bolt that connected the battery cable to the starter.

Turned the key with the starter hanging down and it sparked etc. I manually turned the crank inside the starter with my fingers and then just bolted the starter back into the transmition (or whatever it's actually attached to), turned the key and it started right up.

My thinking is that my starter is freezing up so now I have two questions.

1. Does it appear that I will need to replace the starter?

2. How can I get to that damn bolt that is holding the battery cable to the starter? Can't seem to get enough room to operate and also can't quite find anything to really fit. Tried metric and US, but it could also be because I can't find an angle to get a wrench up there.

 

[rhauf]

did you do the headlight test i said to try??? this test would be helpful in diagnosing the problem

i still think it is a poor connection.. not the starter itself.

headlight test: turn on the headlights, see if they stay on while you try to crank. if they do, battery connections are good. they will go off if there is a battery connection issue.

if the battery connections are good, then it's either the connection to the starter itself, or the starter is having a problem internally.. usually the starter will "click" the gear out, but won't spin when it has this problem... so if thats what it's doing then the starter needs to be replaced (or fixed).

if you want to fix the starter, take it apart, and that thing on the side (Which pops the gear out) has a metal contact inside, which as the gear move out, makes contact, this is what powers the "spin" motor in the starter. clean those connections if it's popping out but not spinning.

 

[MatthewAlan8]

Thanks for the response. No I didn't try your suggestion yet, I'll definitely give that a try in the morning. Something that was happening while I was trying to crank it however was every 3 or so cranks, the power locks would lock. Not sure if that means anything but that's what was happening.

 

[Macgiobuin]

The power locks locking means that the system is losing all voltage to the starter when it is attempting to start. That is your passive auto theft system (PATS) rebooting when the voltage recovers to a minimum. If you are using a wrench (or ratchet/socket) to loosen the positive cable to the starter, be sure to take off the negative cable on the battery. You can short the battery with the wrench; you should be using a socket though, because the starter connection is recessed and is designed for a socket not a wrench.

 

[MatthewAlan8]

The first part of what you said, the starter is losing all voltage. Is that an indication that the starter is bad? Or would it be the connection? Thanks for the tips, I really appreciate it.

 

[rhauf]

The first part of what you said, the starter is losing all voltage. Is that an indication that the starter is bad? Or would it be the connection? Thanks for the tips, I really appreciate it.

obviously you haven't done the headlight test yet.... the headlight test will show you that "all voltage" is lost (eg, the headlights will go out when you try to crank the engine)

it's battery terminals (or battery cables) i am still 100% sure of this.

i've told you what the problem is 3 times... why don't you just humor me a little and take my advice?

 

[Macgiobuin]

Is that an indication that the starter is bad?
It is an indication that option 1 or 4 above is the likely problem.

 

[MatthewAlan8]

obviously you haven't done the headlight test yet.... the headlight test will show you that "all voltage" is lost (eg, the headlights will go out when you try to crank the engine)

it's battery terminals (or battery cables) i am still 100% sure of this.

i've told you what the problem is 3 times... why don't you just humor me a little and take my advice?

Yes, actually I did your headlight test and it wasn't the issue. I appreciate your feedback but I don't appreciate the arrogant attitude. And no, that wasn't the problem.

It was the starter. I removed it, took it to get tested and it nearly blew up in the machine. Also, there were pieces of loose metal or debris inside that you could hear when it was shaken.

Purchased a new starter, installed it and the Explorer started right up.

Now, I'm pretty new to repairing my own vehicle and replacing the starter is no easy task; mainly because it's very difficult to reach all of the bolts and the cables...if those weren't in the way then it would be a 20 minute job. Me, being new...this job took me like 8 hours because I was trying to figure everything out as I went. The time spent on the job included going to the parts store and taking some breaks...

I had a "spade" starter and apparently those are no longer made because of corrosion, but the adapter the new starters have are pretty easy to deal with...just splice the wires together.

Anyways, thank you all for the feedback and giving me things to try. It ultimately led me to the starter.

 

[rhauf]

Yes, actually I did your headlight test and it wasn't the issue. I appreciate your feedback but I don't appreciate the arrogant attitude. And no, that wasn't the problem.

It was the starter. I removed it, took it to get tested and it nearly blew up in the machine. Also, there were pieces of loose metal or debris inside that you could hear when it was shaken.

Purchased a new starter, installed it and the Explorer started right up.

Now, I'm pretty new to repairing my own vehicle and replacing the starter is no easy task; mainly because it's very difficult to reach all of the bolts and the cables...if those weren't in the way then it would be a 20 minute job. Me, being new...this job took me like 8 hours because I was trying to figure everything out as I went. The time spent on the job included going to the parts store and taking some breaks...

I had a "spade" starter and apparently those are no longer made because of corrosion, but the adapter the new starters have are pretty easy to deal with...just splice the wires together.

Anyways, thank you all for the feedback and giving me things to try. It ultimately led me to the starter.

Fair enough, it just gets frustrating sometimes when people won't listen (which obviously you were anyhow, but you hadn't mentioned it)

glad you got it worked out. 8 hours.. i bet if you had to do it again it'd take far less time. its good practice and a good starter job anyhow

 

[MatthewAlan8]

Yeah sorry for not mentioning the fact that I ran the test. I actually hadn't begun working on it that morning when I typed that first response about the starter etc so I hadn't run your test until I got out there. Was just looking at all possibilities before I went out there.

Yes definitely it would take less time. I actually got a cable mixed up on the starter at first and that caused a puff of smoke from the solenoid when I tried starting it...so technically I removed it and put it back in twice! Haha...very good practice, especially for a beginner but I'm happy that I didn't pay someone else to do it. It definitely feels good doing these things yourself.

Thanks for the help.