Glacier - Back from two weeks away...

[Glacier991]

I've been gone a couple weeks, and am now back. I will attempt to answer all my emails, PM's and get back in the swing of answering threads on here which might still need more answers. Looks like others did a great job in my absence.

If you were looking for a reply and haven't gotten it, be patient. If by Sunday you haven't gotten one, PM meand I will try and get back to you.


Glacier (Chris)

 

[BrooklynBay]

Welcome back Glacier! Everybody here sure missed you. How was the vacation? I sent you a PM a couple of weeks ago about an idea I had which is related to valve body bolts. I hope it doesn't get lost among the hundreds of PM people have been sending.

 

[Glacier991]

Hi BB, thanks, and yes it was a nice time away from it all.

I did get your PM... and have been pondering it. I think you ask a good Q about using locknuts on VB bolts... but I am thinking that at the low torque values, a classic locknut may throw off the torque reading to a potentially significant degree. A better Q might be "why not use blue locktite"?.

Meanwhile, I'm thinking if there was a better mousetrap in this situation, the automakers, or one of them, woulda started using it.

 

[BrooklynBay]

The locktite idea was also in that PM. Is there a way to test the torque value of the bolt with a lock washer (maybe with a dial style torque wrench) to see if the bolt is still the same torque if it didn't have the lock washer? I would assume a pound is still a pound regardless if it has a washer pushing against it. The locktite doesn't create any pressure differential, so maybe that would be a better option? I was thinking about using both lock washers, and locktite. If one of these things works, maybe Ford could use it as a TSB to prevent the VB gaskets from going bad as often as they do!

 

[Wrench]

Just thinking outloud here- could it be that the gasket failure problem is more associated with poor gasket material and not being able to handle the heat rather than the torque applied to VB bolts that secure the gasket. When I took the VB off my 5R55E trans all the bolts were tight yet the gasket was blown out in all the usual places. Could be that a better quality gasket material is needed but glueing the new gaskets to the seperator plate looks like a solution.

 

[mikephotos]

Welcome Back Glacier! Hope you went somewhere fun!
No rush but inbetween your 300 PMs if you could take a peek at this thread (http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164055) and give your thoughts I'd be very grateful.

Mike

 

[BrooklynBay]

That link is the 5R55W solenoid block replacement thread. Maybe Glacier might make it a sticky.

 

[cknorw]

I apologize in advance for the lenghty post and the fact I do not own an Explorer. I own a 99 Crown Vic with the 4R70W. This is my first tranny rebuild. Thought I would give a shot before I had a shop look at it. I took it out of the car July 2nd and as of now 8/20, its still in pieces on my bench. It seems like I come to an understanding of one thing and move on then hit another snag. I think I'm down to one issue, but first a little background.

This tranny has 187K, 70% of which is Hwy milage (company car). It has been driven the last 80K with BLACK trans fluid. I did a tranny service when I first bought the car and found metal shavings and half of a metal ring in the pan. It was also making a brief grinding noise when the torque converter would lock and unlock. Decided to break it down.

From reading the posts here, I expected to find at a minimum the direct clutch burnt. No. It looked in excellent shape. The frictions only have .001" - .002" wear, best I could tell. In fact all the frictions looked really good to my untrained eye. What I did find was the #9 bearing destroyed. That must have been what I found in the pan (the rest of it was in the extention housing). In addition, the last metal ring on the output shaft (nearest to the extension housing) had broke. Only half the ring was still there. That half ring carved a groove in the case bore. I also found the 1-2 acumulator spring broke, damaging the bore. I think maybe with the #9 bearing gone the excess thrusting caused the center support snap ring to come loose as the shell and center support rubbed leaving blue heat trace evidence on the shell. I saw additional heat evidence on the tabs of the intermediate steels, and the tip of the output shaft (inside the direct clutch). All the gear elements look to be in excellect shape. I don't know how. I broke the valve body down and couldn't find any wear.

I have replaced the steels and frictions, seals, servo's and forward clutch hub (this hub looked to be almost stripped where it splines on the sun gear). I did replace the case with a used one. I put an update kit in during the valve body rebuild. The output shaft had scarf cut seals on it on disassembly and my kit also had them to go back with. I see its recommended to go with one piece seals. I do not intend to use the vehicle for anything but leasure travel so I am hoping the scarf seals will do. Any additional advice on this?

Question, is there anything I should look at give the experience of those of you who post here and based on what I have described? More specific, (last snag, I think) the direct clutch looks to have wear in the snout, which I think may be allowing the stub shaft to drop a little further into the direct clutch. I have clearance between the end of the stub shaft and the output shaft, maybe .010 - .015. Is this acceptable? Will the oil pressure keep the stub shaft pushed into the forward clutch drum against the input shaft making this a mute point? Also, should the bleed hole for the pump be at 12 or 2 o'clock?

Please advise any and all comments. Thanks for your patience reading this. Again, this is my first tranny experience. I hope when I hit reverse, the car goes backwards.

Cary

 

[Glacier991]

First off, welcome to the site. I trust you had the opportunity to read the 4R70W rebuild Diary to the point it's at (I will finish it when it cools down and i can work in my garage after work... too hot this summer plus vacation, etc.).

Let's start with the scarf cut seals on the output shaft. Millions of vehicles have done just fine with them. They are not AS good as solids, but you are NOT making a HORRENDOUS error by using them. I try and include ALL upgrades in the Diaries so people can see what is out there. Make sure there are not any burrs or anything in the grooves for them.

The stub shaft interconnect between the direct and forward. This goes pretty deep into the forward, so relax there. Spline damage is mostly what you are looking for. Into the Direct the thing you are looking for is slop... if you are suspecting the direct drum you MIGHT want to consider replacing it with new.... about $70

The two holes in the output shaft... one is plugged and was a machining hole. The other is a feed for lubrication, and has a plug lower on the shaft bored to about .050. Not much oil pressure coming though there.

I don;t have a direct drum easily accessible (in the garage rafters and it is HOT) but even if the stub rested on the output I do not think it would be a problem.

It sounds like you have done well, and identified problem areas. Those steel sealing rings are a problem child. Speaking of which do you want to sell your old damaged case? I can resleeve the output shaft bore.

Anyway You are doing well grasshopper. Let us know how the rest of it goes! If you have any more questions, why not start a new thread where more people will see it? Or post here: http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=161450

As in many things, there are more and more "subject matter" experts on here as more and more people delve into their own auto trannies!

ps. I am willing to put solid seals on that output shaft for ya... via round trip mail.