HELP!!! Crazy electrical problem. It starts when it wants to!

[schock1]

Hey guys, I need some help, I'm a pretty good mechanic & pretty good at tracing electrical problems (I do this for a living, only not on cars) I am at wits ends trying to find a solution to my problem. My 93' X when starting it, is a guessing game as to wether or not it's going to start. I'm pretty sure there is a short somewhere causing it. I will get in to turn it over & ALL power will drop out, then if I'm lucky it will come back on, if not I will have to mess with a bunch of stuff trying to get it to come back on. I can usually sit there & pump the brakes over & over & eventually it will come on. I thought I had it narrowed down to this but, I have no way to effectively prove it. Sometimes I can push on the brake switch on the pedal & it will start other times it wont. I read a short in the alternator the first time I though I had it fixed so i replaced it & it worked for a few weeks. Now it's doing it again. However, this is where it gets confusing, it had been cooler outside for the past few weeks, now that it has gotten hot & humid it's doing it again. It will generally start in the morning then once it has sat in my work parking place I will have to pump the brakes to get the power to kick back in. I've also did a continuity test on the brake switch & it reads good when activated. Could there be something in the braking system causing this? I'm thinking it's one of the following things: brake system short, starter short or possibly temp sensor but, I do not think it's the temp sensor because it functions correctly when running. It really confuses me that it's worse when it's hot outside. Maybe starter windings shorting out? I've got an appt. with the dreaded dealership on Thursday. I hate using these guys cuz, most of them know less than me about cars & the few times I have tried to use them to diagnose a problem they have been wrong in the conclusion. They wanted to charge me like $2000 for some kinda break job, bleeding the ABS control with a special tool & such. Well I went home & flushed the entire breaking system w/about 1/2 gal of break fluid & took care of that issue. I'm hoping thsi has happened to someone on here, otherwise I doubt that anyone will know the answer due to the fact that it's not constant. When it does this it tries to drain my battery. The dash wont hardly light up, the dome & under hood lights are very dim & the stereo wont come on. Pleeeease help!!! Thanx, Steve

 

[ajevenson]

I cant say for sure what's going on but it could be your ignition switch (under your steering column). This happended to both my thunderbird and my X. When you put the key in, the dash lights and acc come on, then as soon as you turn the key everything goes dead. It then takes a certain amount of giggling and moving the key around to get the ignition switch to make contact again. Might be something to look at as its only a $20 part, and sooner or later it will have to be replaced.

 

[schock1]

Well I have known that my ignition is worn as far as the key goes for quite some time. I can start it then pull the key which is kinda nice in teh winter. Is that from Ford or can you get it from a parts store? I will have to carry an extra key correct? or is it matched to your current ignition? Thanx

Hmmmm, that could also make sence of the heat factor since it gets really hot on the interior when the temp outside gets up there. I believe I'll go get an ignition tonight & hopefully be able to cancel my appt w/ford.

 

[EliteConcept]

have u checked on the battery?

 

[schock1]

Originally posted by EliteConcept
have u checked on the battery?

The battery is fine when the short is showing up. When it does start there is no hesitation, it starts right up w/no probs. It continues to run when everything is running also i.e. bright lights, stereo, brakes applied & heater or AC on. I have not had the battery tested, thinking that so long as it's starting it is fine. I would think that there'd be hesitation if it were the battery or it would not start period.

 

[ajevenson]

If you can pull the key out of the cylinder that means the lock cylinder is pretty worn and the contact pin to the ignition switch is most likely worn too. You can buy the ignition switch and lock cylinder at any parts store. Be very careful that you dont mess around with the lock cylinder once you pullit out of the steering column. Once you pull it out just leave it, dont turn it cus there are some really small parts and springs that will fall out.

P.S The ignition switch requires a security star screwdriver (or a drill bit). Just to let you know in advance.

 

[ajevenson]

BTW, I like the security of having two different keys for my vehicles. I dont like the design of one key for the doors and ignition. One for the door and one for the ignition means someone wont be able to steal my truck as easy if they find my spare.

 

[schock1]

I've got a set of security star tips for a driver just so long as it can get to it I should be o.k. Thanx, for the help, I'm going to give this a try before I let them look at my Ex & hope this works. I'll keep you guys posted. I wish I had found this board a long time ago. Very very helpful information.

 

[Broccoli1]

Igntion Switch-

All of the problems you listed are exactly the same ones my friend had with his 93 Cherokee; it was the ignition switch that sits up under the steering column.
A PTA because you have to lower the steering column and then squeeze between the floor, seat, dash, blah blah blah all the while upside down.
I'm sure ya'll been there.

Good Luck
Ed

 

[schock1]

Seems that I have fixed the problem by replacing the ignition switch. Thanks to all of you for your help. I didn't even have to crawl under my dash (thank god cuz I'm 6'5 250lbs) I simply took all the dash hardware off underneath the sterring column & then uncrewed the two bolts holding it up & let it hang as far as it would naturally, reached under the back of the dash & could see what I was doing. Took me about 45min total.