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Project "Twisted Sister" SAS Front Dana 44, Rear Ford 9"

Hey guys,

So I started a SAS thread almost 2 years ago. Lots have changed since then. But I am finally ready to start my SAS! Originally i wanted to go with a custom 3 link set up but after reading Stic-O's tread and realizing that he has the same axle as me and was going through the same issue as me with the cast on wedges. so even though i really want a 3 link im going to go with the radius arms. think it will be the easiest to do and fairly cheap too.

Current Truck Spec:
2000 Mercury Mountaineer AWD V8 174k miles.
24edmb9.jpg


Current idea
Dana 44 front on custom wristed arms with coils
http://www.broncoii4x4.com/wristed-arm/wristed-arm.php
Stock 8.8 SOA regeared with wheel adapters
37" tires on beadlock rims

This will be my trail rig/ rock rig, plan to still drive it to and from will NOT be a trailer queen (yet)

Donor vehicle is a 1978 Ford F150 SuperCab. im getting the Dana 44/ 9" and all linkage etc.

Current Concerns i need input on...
1. keeping the ford 8.8 vs the ford 9"
2. best rim/ tire combo

Here are the goals...

Summer 2015:
-Buy Dana 44, Ford 9" Rear- Picked up 7-11-15
-Recondition/ Rebuild Axles

Fall 2015
-Purchase everything for SAS
-Start to Cut off all IFS on truck
- Box in frame/ reinforce frame rail

Spring/ Summer 2016
-Place front axle
-Place rear axle
-finalize everything
-Exo cage
-Bumpers, Sliders, and winch added
https://www.universal4x4.com//four_wheel_parts/rock_slider_kit
http://www.chassisunlimited.com/product/bumper-parts/rock-slider-gussets.html
http://www.jcroffroad.com/product/XJDIYB/DIY-MJ-R.html
http://www.jcroffroad.com/product/XJDIYB/DIY-XJ-F.html

ANY input you guys have will be great. i am still in the planning/ buying phase so right now im ready for input if i need to make a decision or change my plan.
 


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dersch6221992

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Brian pretty much nailed it. Some guys get a little carried away with the radius arm length. At some point there's diminishing returns and your radius arm brackets are put in a vulnerable spot for damage.

The tie rod flip moves not only the tie rod but the drag link up as well with less angle which is desirable to help combat bump steer.

Whichever method works for you to measure drive shaft slip...go for it. With the d shaft in or out you need to get the measurement from yoke center to yoke center or yoke center to the face of the flange...whatever the case may be.

Wow that wristed arm looks super easy to make! i think i will go ahead and do that... so basically does it matter what side i do it on? i think ive seen mostly passenger side done.

tie rod flip makes sense.

hmm. that makes sense wit just letting the axle be and do the driveshaft afterwards.
 


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jmdirk

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i am not too worried about the front brakes right now stock is good enough for me...

for the driveshaft i do plan to take this down the highway so maybe i will try to avoid welding it myself...

and rear thats okay hopefulyl someone else chimes in

As long as you're not driving at high speeds in 4WD there's no issue. you can go 90 mph all day in 2WD and the front d/s won't spin
 




dersch6221992

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As long as you're not driving at high speeds in 4WD there's no issue. you can go 90 mph all day in 2WD and the front d/s won't spin

oh right i didnt think about it like that... i have an AWD right now so that was my mindset.

i think cutting and welding the driveshaft would be the way to go myself.

if the hubs are unlocked and truck is in 2wd mode then only rear spins right?
 




newstylecustoms

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Please someone correct me if I am wrong, but installing the 9" means you will no longer have a speed sensor in the rear like the 8.8 had. That means no input to the computer for shifting or speedometer. I had friend with a Bronco that went to all the trouble to regear and install a 9" only to find that his truck would no longer shift due to the missing speed sensor. When I had a bad sensor in the rearend of my Explorer the truck would shift but had no speedometer and would die when coming to a complete stop.
 




DB_1

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The pre runner guys have used a reluctor ring mounted to the slip shaft at the transmission and then fabbed a bracket to mount the sensor to.

The reluctor ring is just plate steel with teeth cut out on the outer edge.
In our case...4x4 using a transfer case...the ring could be sandwiched between the driveshaft and t-case flange. Getting the right tooth count would take some experimentation. From what i've read, there were different tooth counts used from person to person. Do a search on dezertrangers.com and punch in VSS or some variation.
 




dersch6221992

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The pre runner guys have used a reluctor ring mounted to the slip shaft at the transmission and then fabbed a bracket to mount the sensor to.

The reluctor ring is just plate steel with teeth cut out on the outer edge.
In our case...4x4 using a transfer case...the ring could be sandwiched between the driveshaft and t-case flange. Getting the right tooth count would take some experimentation. From what i've read, there were different tooth counts used from person to person. Do a search on dezertrangers.com and punch in VSS or some variation.

OOOOHHHHH wait so if i switch to this 9" rear i have to install a special thing other wise my truck wont work ???
 




dersch6221992

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Please someone correct me if I am wrong, but installing the 9" means you will no longer have a speed sensor in the rear like the 8.8 had. That means no input to the computer for shifting or speedometer. I had friend with a Bronco that went to all the trouble to regear and install a 9" only to find that his truck would no longer shift due to the missing speed sensor. When I had a bad sensor in the rearend of my Explorer the truck would shift but had no speedometer and would die when coming to a complete stop.

do you have any more info on this!??!
 




dersch6221992

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7-10-15 Dana 44 and Ford 9" bought $340

Well today was a big step forward! Drove 2 hours south to Attica Indiana (yes that's where badlands off road park is). Met a guy down there to buy my axles. Donor truck was a 1978 Ford F150 4x4. I paid $340 and this is what I got...
Dana 44
Ford 9"
Stock coil buckets with bolts
Stock shock towers with bolts
radius arms with mounts
The stock transmission cross member (not sure if I'll use that)
stock coil springs
stock drag link
stock tie rod
stock Trac bar with mount

Overall for $340 I think I did pretty good.
I don't have a better picture because these things are heavy and I'm just leaving it in my truck until I can get it to the shop to be cleaned up and have new parts installed on
15i17o6.jpg


I think I'm going to try and reuse the drag link, tie rod, and Trac bars depending how they look after they get cleaned up. Will just shorten them and sleeve it then weld it back together.
 




newstylecustoms

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I didn't notice that you are in Indiana as well.
Regarding the speed sensor it will be alot easier to use a rearend with a speed sensor. Maybe I missed it in the earlier posts but what gears does the D44 have? The reason I ask is you would probably be money ahead to get a 8.8 from a newer F150 that has the speed sensor. Most F150s with 8.8s have 3.55 gears. I assume you will be reagearing anyway due to the large tires you plan to run.
 




BKennedy

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I thought the rear axle speed sensor for the 94 was just for the ABS?
When I deleted the ABS, the only wires going to the sensor on top of the rear diff were the ABS control wires.
 




newstylecustoms

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I thought the rear axle speed sensor for the 94 was just for the ABS?
When I deleted the ABS, the only wires going to the sensor on top of the rear diff were the ABS control wires.

That is correct, but this is a 2000. There are three sensors on the newer trucks, one at each front wheel and one rear. No output from the transfer case to drive the speedo.
 








dersch6221992

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That is correct, but this is a 2000. There are three sensors on the newer trucks, one at each front wheel and one rear. No output from the transfer case to drive the speedo.

yes i am regearing to 5.13

and isnt the speedo sensor in the transfer case though? i will have to do some seearching because i havent heard of this yet. have you seen any write ups or how tos or any more info you cna post?
 




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I'm not familiar with 3rd gen and up Ex's but newstylecustoms is probably right. As suggested, it would be easier to stick with the 8.8 and modify the bolt pattern.

There's not much to gain with the Ford 9" other than a stronger r&p and no c-clips to deal with bit that's never been a big problem for the 8.8 if you keep the tire size 37" or smaller. Just weld up the axle tubes to keep them from spinning and it's a pretty stout axle.
 




dersch6221992

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I'm not familiar with 3rd gen and up Ex's but newstylecustoms is probably right. As suggested, it would be easier to stick with the 8.8 and modify the bolt pattern.

There's not much to gain with the Ford 9" other than a stronger r&p and no c-clips to deal with bit that's never been a big problem for the 8.8 if you keep the tire size 37" or smaller. Just weld up the axle tubes to keep them from spinning and it's a pretty stout axle.

i have a 2000 mountaineer (2nd gen) but i am strongly considering keeping the 8.8 now. regearing that would be a task in of itself but i think i can do it.
 




newstylecustoms

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I used adapters to match the pattern and keep my 8.8. When I first completed the front end work I was not aware that the sensor in the rear was bad but it caused several issues that I mentioned I'm the earlier post. The system only needs one sensor to function but since the front two are eliminated you only have one left. The 99 up transfer cases have no speedo output or speed sensor. I am sure it is possible to work around like mentioned before with fabricating a reluctor ring but as stated above the 8.8 is very strong anyway and more efficient than a 9 inch.
 




dersch6221992

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I used adapters to match the pattern and keep my 8.8. When I first completed the front end work I was not aware that the sensor in the rear was bad but it caused several issues that I mentioned I'm the earlier post. The system only needs one sensor to function but since the front two are eliminated you only have one left. The 99 up transfer cases have no speedo output or speed sensor. I am sure it is possible to work around like mentioned before with fabricating a reluctor ring but as stated above the 8.8 is very strong anyway and more efficient than a 9 inch.

yea i think that i am going to go with the 8.8 i hope to try and sell the Ford 9" if i can. im going to have to try and tackle the 8.8 by myself with regearing. i think im just going to regear and lock it and not redo any bearing or put new axle shafts in since i dont have a bearing press
 




FR-425

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yes i am regearing to 5.13

and isnt the speedo sensor in the transfer case though? i will have to do some seearching because i havent heard of this yet. have you seen any write ups or how tos or any more info you cna post?

Second gen = 1995 -2001

The speed sensor is in the transfer still on a 2000. The tone ring in the diff is only for the ABS.

You can mount the tone ring in the 9". You need to grind out the case a bit for clearance and drill a hole for the sensor. Not too tough if you have the right tools. You can, for a couple hundred bucks have a machine shop do it up.

Best part is you only need to carry the 3rd member and not the entire housing to the shop.

Here's a link with pics of a 9" with the tone ring mod.

http://www.therangerstation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89605

This would be the better way to go than mess about with wheel adapters. Cheaper too.
 




newstylecustoms

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Second gen = 1995 -2001

The speed sensor is in the transfer still on a 2000. The tone ring in the diff is only for the ABS.

You can mount the tone ring in the 9". You need to grind out the case a bit for clearance and drill a hole for the sensor. Not too tough if you have the right tools. You can, for a couple hundred bucks have a machine shop do it up.

Best part is you only need to carry the 3rd member and not the entire housing to the shop.

Here's a link with pics of a 9" with the tone ring mod.

http://www.therangerstation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89605

This would be the better way to go than mess about with wheel adapters. Cheaper too.

My 99 did not have a speed sensor in the transfer case, I have a manual 1354 case note with no sensor and the speedo works from the rear did sensor. I believe the 95-98 trucks did have a sensor in the transfer case
 


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FR-425

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I don't see the parking brake assembly in your pile of parts?

You should go back and grab the entire assy. It's not much trouble to add the 1978 cable assy and build a short extension to the stock mounty cable than it is to engineer a whole new setup.
 




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