Replacing A4LD in 91, need some help.

[Malchi]

Ok, I got me a replacement trans last weekend, and today I removed my old one. Hoping to put the new one in sometime next few days. I will need a little help thru out the process, I assume. So, this thread is born. Now, first question.

Contrary to a lot of good advice, I am planning to re-use my torque converter from the trans I am removing. Unless, the experts here can tell me that it is the craziest thing to do and refuse to help me unless I get a new converter. Reason I am re-using mine is 1. I couldn't get the one off the truck the new trans came out of cause the engine was locked up. 2. I am working on a tight budget and just can't afford another one. 3. Mine seemed to be working just fine, so why won't it last a little longer. 4. I am only trying to get by for another 2-3 years, then I can afford to get a better vehicle and, even if my trans goes out before then, I have so little in it that it will not be any loss to just junk it.

Now, here is the question, I plan to try to flush out the TC before I put it back in. Can someone tell me how to go about that and what to look for that would indicate that it is bad? Also, do I fill it with fresh fluid before I put it in, or will it refill when I put fluid back in the finished product in the vehicle?

Thanks for all the help. Please don't be too upset with me for re-using my TC.

 

[BrooklynBay]

The old torque converter could have worn plates, and fail after a while. Another reason is that it stores old debris from the bad theansmission just like the front cooler. The cooler could be flushed with cooler cleaner, but the torque converter is almost impossible to thoroughly clean without cutting it open. You might be able to find a remanufactured torque converter at a local rebuilder for $75 (with your old one as a core). As for refilling it with fluid, you could do it, but it's difficult since it might spill out.

 

[Malchi]

lol Brooklyn Bay I was afraid you would chime in. Why? Because I know you're right and I guess I just have to face it. Ok, ok, you win. I will look for a new, or reman, torque converter.

I understand your reasoning, and agree, it's just that it's a hard pill to swallow to pay almost as much for a torque converter as I did for the trans. But, I will swallow it. I really don't wanna have to come back to the forum next week or so and say I re-used my old converter and now I gotta pull the trans back out, or worse have to replace it that quick.

So, just put the new converter in empty and it will fill back up itself when I fill the trans up with new fluid after I install it?

 

[Malchi]

Also, is there an easy way to line up the converter to flywheel bolts when I re-install it? I haven't quite got that far yet, but just thinking about it seems like it's gonna be difficult to do.

 

[rhauf]

pour a couple quarts of fluid into the converter before you install it. they won't spill out while you install it, and it'll prevent it from starting dry and damaging itself. other than that yes, it'll fill itself immediately after the engine is started.

i've re-used torque converters before, but only when putting in junkyard transmissions, in cases where the old trans didn't blow up, but was just warn out (no metal pieces) if i put in a new trans i put in a new converter either way. remember the troque converter lock-up clutch in the a4ld is in the converter itself, it does wear out, and when it wears out that often attributes to the transmissions failure (pieces and debris from it clog the valve body, oil ways and other things)

and on a side note... why replace your X as soon as you can afford another vehicle? if it's a good car hang on to it. besides, you only live once.. might as well enjoy what you have. i for one have better uses of my money than throwing it at new car payments. well thats my philosophy on life anyhow.

the way i line it up is i put the bolts at "12 o' clock, 3, 6, and 9" on the engine, then the same on the TQ. make SURE the torque converter is in all the way into the trans (sometimes the last bit is tricky) when you put the trans up, it should meet the engine and the converter shouldn't be jammed hard against the flex plate (it should have at least 1/8" if play) the bolts should drop through the holes, easy as pie right?

 

[Malchi]

rhauf,

thanks for the info. I am using a junkyard trans, but the torque converter for it was stuck on the flywheel since the engine was locked up. At least, that's what the fellow told me who pulled it for me. I, having never pulled a trans before, hired a fellow to pull it for me and when he went to remove the converter to flywheel nuts said he couldn't cause the engine wouldn't turn. I never questioned whethe the converter could have been removed after the trans was out of the way. I assume it still couldn't be done even then.

But, a good friend advised me that since my trans was slipping and did not seem like the converter was locking up, then it would be best to just replace it rather than take the chance. And, BrooklynBay strongly opposes my re-using a converter. I know that he knows his stuff way better than I do, so I will trust him on this one. (really, I just don't wanna have to come back later and admit I was wrong, lol)

I will try your way of aligning the bolts. Sounds like it will work.

Side note..... while I like the X, it's just not my preference. Forgive me for saying this here, but I am missing my Jeep Cherokee.

 

[SuRrEaLNJ]

the tourqe converter can be turned once the trans is in the truck bu reaching through the starter hole and the holes in the flywheel to turn it. Get one bolt in, thread it all the way in but don't tighten it untill they are all in so u have some wiggle room, turn The motor till the next hole and repeat. Peice of cake.

I've re used torqu convertors, but since your trans was slipping I would stay away from it

 

[BrooklynBay]

Do you have a transmission jack, and a pry bar? You will need both of these tools to remove the old transmission, and reinstall the new/used one.

 

[Malchi]

yes, I actually removed my old one yesterday. Took me about 5 hours, not too bad for a first timer on my back with X on ramps?

 

[Malchi]

make SURE the torque converter is in all the way into the trans (sometimes the last bit is tricky) when you put the trans up, it should meet the engine and the converter shouldn't be jammed hard against the flex plate (it should have at least 1/8" if play) the bolts should drop through the holes, easy as pie right?

Uh, having trouble with this part. First time I slid the converter in and tried installing trans, and wouldn't even get close. So set it back down and worked on getting the converter seated correctly. After some trying, we finally removed the little small shaft that goes thru the center of the main shaft, inserted that in the converter first till the splines lined up and it seated good, then put the converter, with that shaft already in it, into the trans, wiggled and twisted, and the converter "seemed" to seat all the way. But, when we put the trans to the engine, still had a 1/4 inch or so between the bell housing and the block. And, the converter was all the way tight against the flex plate.

So, can anyone give any other pointers on how to get the converter all the way into the trans?

How about that little short shaft? Mine fell out of my "new" trans before I even knew it was there. When I looked at it to put it back in I noticed that on one end the splines are shorter than the other end. Looking at my old trans I see that the shorter splines were towards the trans and the longer ones were in the converter. But, I can't remember if I had removed it from my old one earlier or not. Does anyone know for sure what direction that short shaft goes in?

 

[rhauf]

I think it's getting the TC to line up with the trans's oil pump that makes it a pain to get it in that last little bit. i've done a bunch of transmissions and i have no secret way, i just keep trying until it goes.

last time i did an explorer one it took me about 15 minutes of fooling with it. i just keep wiggling it up and down, turning it, and pulling it in and out until it drops into place. i cant say for sure which way the shaft goes, but if i remember i'll look at one of the spare explorer trans's i have laying around tomorrow (IF i remember...)

 

[Malchi]

Thanks Rhauf,

I re-read the end of Glaciers diary and he mentions something called the driven gear being bevel side in, and if not then you won't seat all the way. But, I'm not sure if that shaft is what he is referring to. I'll look at it tomorrow and see if one end is beveled.

Please remember to look for me tomorrow. I live in a trailer park and "major vehicle repair" is prohibitted. I was doing it anyway after office business hours and thought I was covering my tracks pretty well. Not well enought it seems. Got a notice today from Manager that I have 7 days to complete the job and get Ex back running, or get it out of here. Well, at least he was kind enough to let me complete the job. "You already started you might as well finish it", were his kind words. So, I gotta get this thing seated and put back in next day or so so I can get everything put back together Saturday morn.

 

[Malchi]

Ok, got it in. Rhauf, the shaft can only go in one way, short splines in. But, what I was doing wrong was that, after you slide the shaft in, I still had to rotate/wiggle/jiggle it to get the splines to fit in whatever is down there. Once that happened, it slid in another half inch or so, and everything worked just fine after that.

Now just gotta put all the other stuff back up and see what happens.

Thanks to all for the help.

 

[rhauf]

Okay i just checked.. i have two a4ld transmissions.. one of them (the one on the left) has a bushing or something preventing the shaft from pulling out. the other one has no bushing, and the shaft pulls right out (As have others i've worked on)

on one end the splines seem to end about 1/4" before it gets bigger.. this is the converter end, the other end that goes in the trans the splines went all the way to the thicker shank part of the shaft. i took a picture in case this isn't clear, just as it pulled out.

edit: just read you're last post. glad you got it figured out. let us know how it runs and all after it's all together.



.

 

[Malchi]

Rhauf, thanks for the info. I did figure it out, but your post gives me relief from the nagging feeling of "What if I was wrong?". Now I know for sure.

I see on your picture how the splines end before the shaft gets bigger. I'll have to look at the one from my old trans and see if it's like that. I didn't notice that before. Thanks.

Yeah, I hope to get it running at least by Saturday noon. Maybe as early as Friday evening. But, either way I'll be glad to post back here to update how it went.

 

[Malchi]

ok, getting everything almost together. Just gotta stick the transfer case up, bolt the drive shafts to it, and put the converter bolts and starter on.

I'm also gonna drop my pan and add a drain plug.

Also, searched a bit and never came up with a good answer. What's the verdict on Lucas Trans Fix? A good idea to put it in there or a waste of money?

And, do I just use the Mercon III like it came from the factory? Or upgrade to Mercon V?

 

[rhauf]

I use the standard dex-merc III and it works fine (as recommended by my trans builder)

ALL of those "magic fix" products are worse than a waste of money. they destroy things.. for example, the "stop leak" stuff reacts with seals and gaskets making them swell up like a sponge absorbing water, which may help slow a leak by filling the "void" temporarily, however this also breaks them down and they fail completely in short order.. the other additives (to improve shifting and whatnot) soften you're clutches and bands making them grip easier (sort of like amonia on you're tires) but likewise, this is a very temporary improvment which also leads to complete failure, you DONT want to soften and destroy you're clutches/bands.

so stay away from all of that kind of stuff, this includes anything with "high mileage" on the label as well. (same goes for engine oils)

 

[Malchi]

Thanks rhauf.

That's what I did, put in dex-merc III, without any additives. And, so far so good. I fired 'er up and ran the fluid thru all the gears and they all seem to work. I wasn't able to test drive it yet though cause it's late and I still need to get back under there and top off the transfer case and double check a few bolts, as well as put the seat back in. And I need to grab some 3/8 fuel line or something tomorrow to replace the little hose coming off the transfer case that just tore instead of coming loose.

Thanks for all the help. It has very much been appreciated. This would have been much harder without this forum for reference and assistance.

 

[Malchi]

Ok, took the X for a test drive today and she seems to shift very well, except for that I have no OD. I can switch between D and OD while cruising at 65 and nothing happens.

Now, I did adjust the bands before I put the trans in and I think I may know the problem. I have a 91, and the 91 has double wrap band on OD, which you back off 3.5 turns. But, my trans is from a 94, which has single wrap band on OD, which you back off 2 turns. Is my logic and info right? And, if so, do I just go out there and tighten the OD band 1.5 turns in and that will fix my problem?

Thanks again for all the help.

 

[Malchi]

Hmmmm... I found the problem. The 3 prong connector was no connected. Took a bit to get it to connect, but it finally clicked in.

Now, I have OD, and I think I have TC lock up. Tell me if I am checking this right. At about 60, in OD, I am at about 2000 rpm, I let off accelerator for a second, then press it back down, now I am at about 2400 RPM at 60, then a second or so later it drops down to about 2000 RPM again, still at 60. Is that right? But, it doesn't seem to do that in D. Is that normal?