That's it, my Powertrax No-Slip is Defective | Ford Explorer Forums

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That's it, my Powertrax No-Slip is Defective

Jason_25

Elite Explorer<br>ECX Member
Joined
November 26, 2000
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City, State
New Bern, NC
Year, Model & Trim Level
'95 Explorer "Expedition"
Ok I have tried everything and put up with it long enough.
Here are my problems:
1.Thud in drive and reverse when put into gear
2.Loud, very noticeable thud upon gear change or decelaration.
3.Wheel hop when in a turn when it locks up
4.This is the worst part: It sometimes "binds up" and releases violently and it feels like a bomb is going off in the rearend.

Now I have heard problem 1 is normal due to the "backlash" the locker creates. Ok I can live with that......but the others are just downright harsh and hard to live with.

Has ANYONE had any of these problems with their powertrax no-slip locker?

The only thing I can find that I have differently than anyone else running it is I have a monoleaf sprung rear. But I don't understand how that can create so much of a problem........

Any imput on this matter is greatly appreciated!
 



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I'm also gonna post on the ranger forums to see if they've had any problems. Do any of you driveline experts know if it's possible that it's my tranny instead of my rear end? Is there any specific thing that I can check?
 






you could lift your rear and do the locker check that powertrax shows in their install manual. make sure its "indexing" correctly and not binding.

It sounds almost like you've got one of the cheaper "lunchbox" style lockers that lock too easy and therefor are a pain on the street.
 






Few questions. . .

Did you install it or did you have it done?

How long have you had it in there (months / miles) ?
 






Yeah I guess I will do their test, I did it before and it turned out fine though.

I put it in myself about 8 months ago.
 






8 months ago and it just started acting up?

Only other thing i can think of is to pop the cover and remove it, checking everything for exessive wear/damage.
 






Oh no it has been like this from day one. I have just lived with the awful thing. When I call powertrax they say "oh, that's normal", well if this kind of harshness is normal for the no-slip, i would hate to see what the lock-rite is like!
 






I wish you had said this on the GWNF run we did last month so we could have switched vehicles and compare them. With the exception of your item #3 which is true for any locker, I have experienced absolutely none of the other symptoms you have described, and I couldn't be happier with mine.

Something is wrong.
 






In that case. . .yes, all your 'symtoms' seem like the result of having an auto locker. And not being able to experience these symtoms first-hand i have no idea how bad they are and if they are "normal" or exessive.
 






Hmm ok.
My U-joints have never been changed. Is it possible that my joints have deteriorated so much that it's causing the rear end to act up like this?
 






Here are my experiences with my no-slip compared to your problems. . . and as contrast to Geralds post.

--1.Thud in drive and reverse when put into gear
Moreso than stock, yes. also the opposite of this: when you put it in park on a hill and roll 6-10" before 'catching'

--2.Loud, very noticeable thud upon gear change or decelaration.
didn't notice between stock and installing the locker, but after i put a chip in, yes. . i lock up my locker between first and second accelerating and sometimes trip my ABS on deceleration. . .but thats because the tranny is shifting quicker than stock.

--3.Wheel hop when in a turn when it locks up
obviously. . its a locker. you have to learn to drive all over again when you install a locker. now if its locking up without having aplied the gas or brake, then something could be wrong.

--4.This is the worst part: It sometimes "binds up" and releases violently and it feels like a bomb is going off in the rearend.
i experience this only in low speed (<5mph) manuevers. scares the crap out of anyone within 20 feet. mine does it more now than when it was new.

However, for anyone else reading this. . i'm not putting down the No-slip. I also couldn't be happier. In my oppinion it is the best lunchbox locker out there. I helped a friend put an EZ locker in his rear. . after all my advise to get the no-slip. . :nono:. . bad choice. . .no more hot roddin' for him.

yes, thuds between shifts and between P and D could be a U-joint problem, or a tranny problem
 






Yep 1,3, and 4 are exactly as you described. But still............maybe I got a little more than I bargained for with it then. I mean everyone else is talking like " I don't even know it's back there". I sure as heck know mine is back there!

But #2 worries me still. But come to think of it, it used to do that before the locker but not nearly as bad. Could the locker have amplified a preexisting condition?
 






Originally posted by Jason_25
But #2 worries me still. But come to think of it, it used to do that before the locker but not nearly as bad. Could the locker have amplified a preexisting condition?
Yes, I'm sure it easily could with the extra 'backlash' it adds to the system.
 






Thanks for the input Jefe and Gerald. I'm gonna have my u-joints changed and see if that does the trick. If not, I'll be off to talk with the tranny guy.
 






I got a lock rite... pretty quiet... no problems with it, and it does it's job
Pete
 






1.Thud in drive and reverse when put into gear - your U-joints are definitely shot.

2.Loud, very noticeable thud upon gear change or decelaration. - again, your U-joints are definitely shot.

3.Wheel hop when in a turn when it locks up - a locker will require a change in your driving habit.

4.This is the worst part: It sometimes "binds up" and releases violently and it feels like a bomb is going off in the rearend. - check the friction fluid/modifier, that may be the cause. I had mine installed at a shop and never had this problem.

#1 & #2 went away after I replaced my U-joints. You could do a visual inspection and also test it by try to rotate the drive shaft. If there is some play in your drive shaft, you need new U-joints.

Good luck.
 






#4 I love #4

#4 the "bang"

I always get the "what the hell was that... and is the truck falling apart" look from my wife. At this point my 5 yr old usually says " mom thats normal- its the different-tail"

Ill agree with everyone above- check your u-joints. All lockers(sans selectables) will add backlash to the driveline. It may be that the increased backlash from the no-slip has made the u-joints more noticable. But more likely its just the increase in the back lash is more than your willing to tolerate.

It also could be that your mono leafs wrap up and work to magnify the backlash even more. This Im not too sure of, but it sounds plausable. I dont know how you could check this. Maybe add a temporary stop on top of the pinion snout and listen for it to be hit or leave a mark. I dont know. Strap a video camera to the bottom of your truck and take it on a test drive?

Like Khoa said driving habits have a big part in how much noise a locker(any auto locker) makes. It will help to stay off the throttle in and around corners. You have to drive it a bit differently than with an open diff. - the vehicle will have more understeer(wants to go straight) in corners when it locks up, so light throttle is the word- or mash it and do a power slide with it locked !!!


I too think the No- Slip is the best "lunch box" locker avail

Good Luck Jason
 






Check these things before anything else: Warning, this is a long post

I was so unhappy with it I was about to yank it and switch back to an open diff. The people who have an automatic trans notice it much less than those with a manual trans. I’ve got the manual 5 speed, and it was REALLY noticeable. In addition I’ve got a Ranger, so it’s light in the back end. I had all the same problems you have. If you’ve jacked up the back end off the ground, and done the test they recommend and it passes, then you can be pretty assured your powertrax is working properly. I took of the rear cover to check for wear, and there was none. The powertrax noslip is sensitive to several things: 1) different tire diameters (same sizes, different air pressure can cause problems) 2) worn or loose shocks/ubolts/ujoints/etc.3) the break-in period, and 4) driving habits.

I’ve done quite a few things that have minimized the problems to the point where I can say it’s better than an open diff. What I found was many little things were adding up to make a big problem. Fixing these things made a big difference. The one thing to keep in mind is that the powertrax noslip is very sensitive to which tire is perceived as going slowest. I’ll get into that more further down.

Solutions:First off, the break-in period for me was critical. The locker was so much smoother after 3000 miles were put on it. Do your u-joints. Either way that might help at least a little, maybe a lot. Second, tighten everything up – check for loose swaybars and loose shock mounts. I took my truck to a driveline shop, one that specializes in doing gears and custom driveshafts and stuff for an evaluation. They test drove it and then brought me in back and showed me what they found. Have someone else that you TRUST in the drivers seat, have them pull forward a few feet and slam on the brakes several times, while you are behind the vehicle watching the rear axle. Here’s what I saw: shocks that seemed tight were literally flopping around. U-bolts seemed tight but were loose, and the swaybar was also flopping in the urathane bushings. I went home, took a couple of hours tightening everything up. This all made a big difference. Then I checked air pressure in the tires. I’ve got large oversized tires (31x12.5r15 bfg all terrains), so I was running a lower air pressure to keep the ride quality from being that of an empty cement truck. I increased the air pressure 10psi and that made a huge difference. Powertrax lockers are VERY sensitive to different size tires. With low air pressure, the tires were flexing significantly with weight changes such as those that would occur in a left or right hand turn. I found that even a lane change was causing the tires to “squish” on the outside. That was enough to change the diameter of the tire, causing a change in which tire was perceived as the slowest tire.

I didn’t really think tires would squish that much, but when I was at the driveline shop, they had two guys rock my truck back and fourth. I was amazed at how much the tires flexed. Seriously we’re talking the tire squished an inch or so on each side! I was running around 18-20 psi I think, at the time. With the tire changing so much, the noslip was “hunting” for the slowest wheel constantly, as weight shifted. Minimize the changes and you minimize the effects. Adding air pressure to stop this from happening made a pretty significant difference.

I also adjusted my driving habits – a lot! COASTing through left and right turns makes a huge difference. If the noslip is driving the inside tire when you make a left hand turn, accelerating briskly, several things happen. Weight shifts OFF the inside wheel which is the one driving you through the turn. As you accelerate, the inside tire is also turning somewhat sharply. When a tire is turning sharply, a significant portion of the tire is slipping a little. The wider the tire the more pronounced the slippage. With power to this wheel and weight shifting OFF this wheel, it’s easy for the tire to give more slippage than it otherwise would. You might not even perceive this as spinning, since you may not hear much or any squeal. What happens though is that as soon as it starts to slip, it catches up to the outside tire. The locker locks with the outside tire momentarily, and instantly shifts back to the inside tire which slowed down instantly once power shifted. This total effect going through the turn is experienced as understeering, then oversteering, then understeering again as you feel the power shift from wheel to wheel. You’ll probably also feel/hear the locker engaging the different sides.

When you coast through a turn, you allow the inside wheel to not slip as much, minimizing the effect. When I talk about coasting I don’t mean foot totally off the gas type of coasting. I mean gentle power. I’ve found that the locker, which normally has both wheels locked and under power, can sometimes not want to release a wheel when it’s got a lot of force on it. The meshing gears don’t want to release when you’re on the gas. That’s pretty common when you are making a left hand turn quickly, and let out the clutch fast. To minimize that, As I pull up into the intersection, waiting for my time to turn left when traffic allows, I go a little wide and then turn the wheels as I come to a stop. This allows the rear wheels to go at slightly different speeds, and the noslip opens up under low force, making the resulting turn much smoother when I step on the gas. Since I mastered this technique, which isn’t that hard to do, the noslip is so much easier to drive. I had just gotten used to punching the gas in a turn. Once I got used to not doing that, or at least knowing how it will react when I do punch it, its so much better than before.

I also installed the cheap james duff traction bars. Spring wrap-up on a ranger is quite significant. This solved that problem quickly.
Once I was convinced that the noslip was working properly, and then modified my driving habits, I’ve grown to love the noslip. I wouldn’t go back to an open diff. I’ll put a noslip in every truck I ever own, it’s made that much of a difference. My advice: Take the rear cover off, assure yourself that no damage is being done. Then go out and learn how to drive it. It takes a little getting used to, but once learned makes it awesome on the street.

I hope this helps!
--Bob
 






Thanks bored_2wd. I'll try to air my tires up more and take a look and see if anything moves back there.

But after 8 months I have gotten used to driving it well and I really have very few problems with drivability. It's mainly just annoyances.

Also, I'm getting new u-joints tomorrow.
 



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Let us know how that goes Jason...I'm getting ready to install my no slip back there and this is a great thread for info...
 






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