Timing Chain Question

[2000StreetRod]

Engine lift points

Many members use the exhaust manifolds to lift the engine. I like this set up: Engine lift points

 

[jschatz]

Dale,

Thanks for the pictures. Do you think your method will be sufficient to handle the weight of both engine and transmission.?

Ray

 

[2000StreetRod]

M10-1.5xx

So I have everything stripped of and am ready to yank these suckers out. Where exactly am I supposed to bolt chains to the block at? Some pictures would be handy. And what thread pitch bolts do I need for said holes?

Thanks,
Ray

I believe the bolt size and thread is M10-1.5xx

 

[2000StreetRod]

Working load

Dale,

Thanks for the pictures. Do you think your method will be sufficient to handle the weight of both engine and transmission.?

Ray

Make sure the bolts are the correct length - long enough to screw into the head most of the way after passing thru a washer and chain link and short enough to tighten against the head. Make sure the working load of the chain and the coupler exceeds the weight of the engine with transmission.

 

[jschatz]

Got the engine and tranny out yesterday. They are split apart and the engine is on an engine stand. I hope to open it up later this week. I think I am going to pull the front clip on my regular truck so I can have easier access to everything. The split is a lot worse than doing a chevy truck. I am almost tempted to pull the tranny out of my regular truck as well but that would require driveshaft and transfer case removal, which I dont want to deal with. Can the transmission cross member be removed or will this cause something screwy to happen because of the torsion bars?

 

[douglasnc]

Think I read here that both engines need to be either 4wd or 2wd when swapping to avoid a vibration as 4x4 engines have a blancing shaft and the 2 wd doesn't.You may already know this but I thought i'd mention just in case. Good luck..Someone here who know's better than I may correct me.

 

[jschatz]

Oh they are both 4wd.

 

[jschatz]

Well the parts truck motor is out and on a stand. I have pulled the valve covers and both oil pans. Just from looking it appears that the front and rear guides are still in good condition. The guide for the small chain that is exposed when the upper oil pan is removed has broken and will need to be replaced. I guess it is time for me to do some reading then ordering and then fixing. I did pull one exhaust manifold and snapped one of the studs so now I have to figure out how to get that out of the head. Open to suggestions, I would like to avoid having to pulling the head and taking it to a machine shop.

 

[jschatz]

So the front cam guide needs to be replaced. I am about to go out and roll the motor over to TDC and remove the balancer and front cover so that I can inspect the primary guide. My lists of parts that I am going to have to buy is getting longer and longer.

 

[jschatz]

Dale,

Is your parts list on located here still correct?

When I search for the primary kit, 2U3Z6D256CA, I dont get hits on either tasca or tousely. I have about decided that I am going to buck up and change it all and buy the tool otc tool kit so that I have a smaller likely hood of screwing it up.

Thanks,
Ray

 

[2000StreetRod]

2u3z6d256ca

Dale,

Is your parts list on located here still correct?

When I search for the primary kit, 2U3Z6D256CA, I dont get hits on either tasca or tousely. I have about decided that I am going to buck up and change it all and buy the tool otc tool kit so that I have a smaller likely hood of screwing it up.

Thanks,
Ray

Tasca and Tousley have it priced at $126.61
I try to keep the parts list current. Sometimes their data base is down and reports no part found.

 

[jschatz]

Ah that would explain it. I was trying to look parts up at 11:30 last night. From what I can tell from looking at everything my balancer shaft guide and tensioner are busted and the front cam guide is busted. But from talking with my dad we have decided that we are going to change all of the timing parts. If I buy the OTC kit can I lock the te passenger side cam in place and then pull the head, or do I have to completely remove the cam to pull the head. The reason I ask is I'm not having any luck getting my broke exhaust manifold stud out with penetrating oil and vise grips. I don't really what to heat the head because then if I still can't get it out the machine shop will complain since I hardened the bolt.

 

[2000StreetRod]

head removal & timing

Ah that would explain it. I was trying to look parts up at 11:30 last night. From what I can tell from looking at everything my balancer shaft guide and tensioner are busted and the front cam guide is busted. But from talking with my dad we have decided that we are going to change all of the timing parts. If I buy the OTC kit can I lock the te passenger side cam in place and then pull the head, or do I have to completely remove the cam to pull the head. The reason I ask is I'm not having any luck getting my broke exhaust manifold stud out with penetrating oil and vise grips. I don't really what to heat the head because then if I still can't get it out the machine shop will complain since I hardened the bolt.

It is only necessary to remove the camshaft sprocket retaining bolt before pulling the head. If you have the OTC-6488 then you can use it to hold the camshaft while loosening the sprocket retaining bolt. Remember that the passenger side camshaft sprocket retaining bolt loosens clockwise. There is no need to keep the tools attached to the head if you take it to a head shop for the exhaust bolt extraction. You can use the tool set to time the cams after installation of the head.

You will need to remove the upper pan/reinforcement section to replace the balance shaft tensioner. Do you have a copy of the SOHC V6 installation instructions? There are some things that require special attention when reinstalling the upper pan. If you need them just PM me your e-mail address and I'll send you the pdf file.

 

[jschatz]

If I have already pulled the balancer and front cover off do I need to put them back on to remove the rear cassette?

 

[2000StreetRod]

removing rear cassette

In order to remove the rear cassette you must remove the jackshaft rear plug and sprocket retaining bolt. The torque on the bolt is less than the torque on the camshaft sprocket retaining bolt. Therefore you can use the tools in the kit to hold the camshaft sprocket in place while loosening (counter-clockwise) the jackshaft sprocket bolt. Then you loosen (clockwise) the camshaft sprocket retaining bolt.

 

[jschatz]

I was afraid something would slip. The jackshaft had a little slop which was what caused me to worry. All of the timing parts are out besides the balancer shaft chain and sprockets. Time to order some parts. This is gonna ne expensive. I was able to get my exhaust stud out. I welded a nut to it and then busted it loose with my impact. Thanks for all the help. I will probably have more questions for you when I go to put it back together.

 

[jschatz]

Well I got the heads off yesterday afternoon and took them down to Napa, cause I think they are they only machine shop in town, and they informed me that they would check them but if they were out of spec there was nothing they could do. The computer told them that the heads could not be surfaced, is this really the case? My piston tops have just a little carbon build-up on top.

Since I am this far into it is there anything that I should look into doing in the bottom end? Are there any decent priced overhaul kits? Since I have already dumped this much money into it I am going to try and make my X last a long time.

 

[jschatz]

Nobody has any ideas. My heads came back at .006 and .007 warpage. Napa refused to surface them because their computer told them they could not. So should I risk putting warped heads on. I don't think there is another automotive machinist in the area. Or should I bend over and pick up a new set of heads. If I need to buy a new set what kind should I get.

 

[2000StreetRod]

Head warpage

I have no first hand experience on the SOHC V6 head warpage and milling but I found the following:

My Haynes manual specifies a cylinder head warpage limit of 0.003 inches in any 6 inches and 0.006 inches overall. Haynes states "If the warpage exceeds the limit . . . it can be resurfaced at an automotive machine shop."

My GM V6 OHV rebuilding book specifies a diagonal corner to corner warpage limit of 0.002 inches for an aluminum head. It emphasizes that milling the heads increases the compression ratio.

I think I would contact another shop for a second opinion. Milling off a few thousands does not seem excessive to me. I seem to recall a trick years ago was doubling a head gasket to lower the compression ratio. A moron in a machine shop many years ago took 0.060 off the head of my DOHC 2600 Spider trying to get rid of pits in the alloy which would have no effect on compression or coolant leakage. My compression ratio increased by 1.0 and I had to adjust the intake and exhaust cams to get adequate clearance between the valves and the pistons.

I would not buy new heads until I eliminated other less expensive options.

 

[2000StreetRod]

head gasket thickness

According to Super Six Motorsports the stock SOHC V6 uses a 3 layer MLS head gasket with a compressed thickness of 0.030 inches. They were developing an improved copper hybrid 4 layer MLS gasket with a compressed thickness of 0.040 inches. That would accomodate milling the heads 0.010 inches. If they never developed it there may be other Mustang SOHC V6 high performance thicker gaskets available.