Trans or 5.0 pull?

ttbit · March 27, 2009

Well, my front seal is leaking in my 4r70w.

I just put this drivetrain in my Sport Trac and replaced that seal so I wouldn't have to do it later. I guess I buggered it up. Should have left it alone!

I am thinking it might be easier just to pull the engine to replace that seal. I have a cherry picker here and dread trying to balance that tranny to pull and put back in. Also dread all that time on my back again. Also don't want to deal with the more rear part of the exhaust I just had done.

When I did the swap, I dropped the tranny and engine in at the same time. That is an easy way to go when you have to do both.

What do you guys think?

I figure I can pull the upper intake plenum and drop the motor on the front axle (like someone had suggested here before). Hopefully I can then get to the trans bolts and separate the engine and pull it.

Heck...maybe I should replace the torque converter too. It is a little bit of a dog...

CDW6212R · March 27, 2009

I'm sorry to hear of the leak. I have a front seal leak in my 91 that keeps me from driving or selling it. Ask Jamie for specific things, but from what I read in his threads, the engine is not that bad to pull by itself. He lifts it by the lower intake I believe, doing the engine mounts last.

He leaves the engine mounts off until he attaches the trans, starter etc. What front seal did you use? I'm sure my kit will have the same kind of seal, I like to use Ford rear seals for sure because they have the extra dust boot. If you are just changing that, get a seal from Ford.

The stock torque converter is fairly good for a stock part, but other choices are not cheap. The best wish part would be a used high performance TC, but then you have to trust someone else about the condition and stall speed.

try to read through Jamie's latest thread, the one about a 98 Explorer V8 truck with a new engine. He has a good number of hints and helpful pictures there.

ttbit · March 27, 2009

Thanks Don. I will search for the thread. The seal was a FelPro. I guess I will get one from Ford this time. Glad you mentioned the rear main seal too as I planned on doing that with a FelPro I already own.

The engine needs a little pep and the tranny needs some firming up on the shifts, although it seems fine otherwise. I have done a Baumann kit on an AODE in the past and was very happy. I may do that with this trans. I am tempted to throw a different cam in here, but nothing radical like an E cam or something that will kill low end. I wonder if something like a stock HO cam from a Mustang would do. I guess I need to check around. I hate to pull the beast back out without doing something!

CDW6212R · March 28, 2009

Felpro makes great products, those and Ford are my preferred gaskets. Felpro makes some stuff that is much better than anything else, but the seals are about the same.

If you do swap cams, don't buy a Ford letter cam of any kind. Most cams that people would use in another car are not the best for a 4500lbs. truck. The HO cam would be a good alternative. I have a used cam that unfortunately I never got to use myself. I built an HO engine with it for my Lincoln, and ended up selling the engine for a 95 Cobra. It did well in that, and it has intake duration about halfway between an HO cam and the letter cams. I got it back after the guy ran nitrous for about 18 months and burned up a head gasket. I'd use it for a mild 302 but not for a long term vehicle. Buy a custom cam for any long term use.

ttbit · March 28, 2009

I didn't go with the letter cams in my '95 Mustang either. The stock GT cam goes a long way for mild builds and forced induction, I found.

So the cam you have you don't want to use in your Explorer?

CDW6212R · March 28, 2009

I have a custom cam built into my 347, I did consider it. A cam is much more critical than people give credit for. It can really hurt an engine if the compression and cam, force ignition timing to be retarded as an example. I'd suggest that the right camshaft can do much more than a computer tune, and you hear a lot of amazing stories about that.

ttbit · April 5, 2009

Engine out/Trans in

OK..that was a beotch. Pulling the engine out without the trans was tougher than I expected and a little tighter than I expected. I broke one of the O2 harness connectors and bent the heck out of the tranny harness cage. The only thing I used that floor panel for was to disconnect the main trans harness and to get the cage straightened out to get the engine out. Probably could not have gotten to it easily anywhere else. Oh yea...for fun...I haven't drained the tranny yet. It started to drip pretty good though. Have a pan under there. Will tackle that next. I get to replace my mangled tube now.

Got to the bottom four bolts with a u-joint and extension. Had to move the engine to the right a little to get one of the left bolts out. Right ones came out easier than I expected. Top ones took less than 5 minutes with a box wrench. Holy cow did I make a mess with the antifreeze. Geeez. There CAN'T be any more in that engine. The bottom rad hose pours right on my engine hoist leg making it hard to catch the mess. Perfect design.

I can hardly wait to try to stab it back together...

CDW6212R · April 5, 2009

Good good, it's getting easier each time then. Odd question, with as much as you have looked at the trans, can you imagine running one trans line from the right side over the top to the left side, frame rail? I need to mount an extra trans filter, and I'd rather it be on the driver's side. I'll swapping my trans sometime very soon.

Remember to swipe a dab of RTV around the edge of the new front seal before you tap it in.

ttbit · April 5, 2009

Shouldn't be too bad, but not the most fun thing to do. The closer to the front of that trans, the tighter it is, but you should have plenty of room where the have the wires for the O2s and such. It will lower quite a bit if you drop the crossmember, which should really help you out. I bolted up my transfer case that way, including the top bolts.

CDW6212R · April 5, 2009

Thanks, I'm buttoning up my built trans now. Did you notice if your trans had a rear top vent nipple, or a simple cap? My built trans was a 99 or 2000 Explorer, and it has a nipple for a hose, it sticks straight up. Other 4R70W's I've seen have no hose there, just a cap for venting and keeping out water.

ttbit · April 5, 2009

Mine is a hose.

ttbit · April 5, 2009

What did you do when you built the trans up? I am planning on putting a Baumann kit in while I have the fluid drained. Mine is a '96, so not sure if I need to check the accumulator pistons like I did in a '94 AODE I had. Any suggestions on other things I should check...while it will be drained with the valve body out?

CDW6212R · April 5, 2009

Yes do a VB kit, that or a Transgo is very good. Also change the accumulators, that's a critical upgrade of the 98+ models. They now come as better rubber coated parts, those are cheap also, maybe $25. That's about all to do without going into the trans. Oh yes you might change the DTRS on the side if you can, the early models through 96 or 97 had sealing issues, moisture getting inside. Buy that aftermarket also, Ford parts are much higher. Night,

ttbit · April 7, 2009

I ordered the Baumann kit and they suggested replacing another part while I am in there, so I got it too. I just got done doing my taxes so my brain it too tired to remember what it was. Probably to do with shutter issues in OD that some people have.

Anyway...I have to replace my water pump gasket (don't use Ultra Black for water) and thought I would do the timing chain and gears while I am there and just replace all those darn front seals/gaskets. I found a guy who will sell me his HO cam for $35 shipped. You think it would be worth taking the lower intake off and swapping that cam? I am on the fence. I don't want to lose torque, but I know if I had the HO cam in there, I would be replacing it with anything more radical. If I wanted more power, I would go with forced induction.

Heck if people can live with an E cam!!!

Turdle · April 7, 2009

I have a lil tip for ya--
bolt the motor mount plates to the mounts now, then, set the engine on the plates, and bolt the engine to the plates from underneath. Much easier that way-

ttbit · April 7, 2009

Thanks for the tip!

CDW6212R · April 7, 2009

There are also a couple of Sonnax VB upgrade parts that you should install as well. The parts I'm suggesting will be $10-$20 and easy to swap in the VB. The shift kit might have one like it, so don't open any packaging until you have all of your parts to look at.

You can get them and most parts at the local stores. I prefer the trans shop near you, ABC transmissions, it's off Baxter Ave from I-75. The internet suggests that they are two blocks from where I remember them being. Call 524-1871 and ask them where they are there.
http://maps.yahoo.com/map?q1=1037 W...&zoom=17&q1=1037%20Wray%20St%20Knoxville%20TN

ttbit · April 7, 2009

Yea...the part he mentioned was a Sonnax part and I think it comes with another one in the kit for line pressure. I was waiting for you to say, do the HO cam. This way I can blame you if I don't like it. It's bad enough I have to blame myself for pulling this all back out.

CDW6212R · April 7, 2009

I meant to suggest that the HO cam would be a good choice. Everyone is down on the Explorer cam, but the torque converter is better than 302 Mustangs I've been around.

There is a lot of power lost through the whole exhaust, and the whole 302 and stock heads are easily beaten by easy to build strokers. Save money for a better new engine. Before I bought my truck I figured that 350-400hp would be more than enough, and a stroker would be a great way to do it, if possible. Now I know it's possible, but the hp possibilities are far higher than what I knew of ten years ago.

ttbit · April 8, 2009

The nice thing about doing a KB on a 302 is you improve gas mileage and get stroker torque and HP. Bad thing is, you do have to worry about detonation when you are really using it. I have considered doing a stroker though. It adds up after you pay for the heads and other top end parts. Of course, if you buy a KB new, it is a LOT of money. The new ST with the 4.6 has a ton of potential.

Man...I gotta hit the sack.

Oh...and I can't wrap my head around the price on those torque monster headers. WHOA!

Trans or 5.0 pull?

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