2014 Sport P0299 & P0430 Catalytic Converter and Turbo underboost.

[josh_ruppert]

Hello everyone - I recently purchased a 2014 Sport. It was a good deal and I paid cash for it. It has around 180k and I knew I would be taking risk, as with any vehicles with high miles. I've noticed that when I accelerate, it falls flat over half throttle. Comparing this to my recently lost 2015 Expedition 3.5, due to a girl running a red light, I would expect a lot more. It has the check engine light so I hooked it up and got the 0299 and 0430 in this order on the device. I have a few things to take a look at before I start replacing anything. I need to make sure my downpipes are tight. Actually had this problem with my 2015 with some loose fittings causing the 0299 code. But the 0430 code is making me think it definitely needs a new cat. Could the codes be related? Meaning, could a bad cat cause the turbo underboost or could a bad turbo cause the cat code? Any thoughts?

 

[peterk9]

Hi Josh. If you do a 'Search' on the codes individually, you will find a few threads on each but not where they both come up together.

2013 Sport with P0299 code (Underboost)

I keep getting the P0299 code for Turbo (driver side) Underboost. I tightened all of the hoses up, cleared the code and it now it has come back again. I don't really notice any power loss and the engine light never comes on. I have read that this is common on the F150s but that is related to...

www.explorerforum.com

P0430 code data and diagnosis

I started getting the dreaded P0430 code about three weeks ago. I have cleared the code a couple times, and it is usually several days before it comes back. Most recently, it went off on its own and has been off a couple days. Nevertheless, I need to figure what the problem is. I have...

www.explorerforum.com

BTW, have you checked the turbo hoses for possible loose connections? That has happened more than once.

Peter

 

[josh_ruppert]

Hi Josh. If you do a 'Search' on the codes individually, you will find a few threads on each but not where they both come up together.

2013 Sport with P0299 code (Underboost)

I keep getting the P0299 code for Turbo (driver side) Underboost. I tightened all of the hoses up, cleared the code and it now it has come back again. I don't really notice any power loss and the engine light never comes on. I have read that this is common on the F150s but that is related to...

www.explorerforum.com

P0430 code data and diagnosis

I started getting the dreaded P0430 code about three weeks ago. I have cleared the code a couple times, and it is usually several days before it comes back. Most recently, it went off on its own and has been off a couple days. Nevertheless, I need to figure what the problem is. I have...

www.explorerforum.com

BTW, have you checked the turbo hoses for possible loose connections? That has happened more than once.

Peter

I was searching on the codes earlier. I understand what each one means and what to look for. Where my question comes in is are these codes independent of each other. My concern is that if I replace the converter, could it go bad again. Could the turbo be leaking oil into the converter? My expedition ran great and had no issues so my understanding of what "could" go wrong is limited.

I will go through the hoses this week to make sure everything is tight and proper.

 

[peterk9]

Not being that technically familiar with the issue and looking at the threads here, I would say that they are independent of each other as no other posts seem to have them linked.

Peter

 

[josh_ruppert]

UPDATE:

Last evening, I went through the clamps that I was able to get to on the turbo piping. I found every clamp that I was able to get to from the top to almost tight. Each one required a turn and a half. I went underneath and low and behold, the clamp to the front turbo was hanging. My first impression was that the clamp was broken. Why would it hanging, I thought. I was able to grab the tube and pull it right off the turbo. So I went ahead and tighted it up, which was a pain in the arse. I found it very difficult to get a socket on the nut. After tightening this clamp, I took it for a drive. Huge improvement! I do feel the issue with the cat though. At half throttle it falls flat but I can tell there is much more power/torgue on low end. There was quite a bit of oil leaking out of that tube when I pulled it from the turbo. Ideally, I would like to pull everything and clean. I ordered an oil separator today and will be installing. When I get more time, I want to check the passenger side rear turbo, which I believe will require pulling the front wheel.

 

[josh_ruppert]

Found metal shavings in my blow off valve. Ran my finger around the plastic housing where it sits and found metal.

 

[josh_ruppert]

Did a compression check today. 5 cylinders show 145. Middle back shows 50.

Car-part asks me to pick between 3.5 turbo with or without oil cooler. Do we have an oil cooler?

 

[mguy13sport]

The ecoboost don't have blow off valves. They use an electric air recirculating valve that routes back to the air intake which is why they are pretty quiet.

As for your codes, they could be related if the turbo is bad. Best way to check is remove the catalytic converter and look inside turbo housing. Spin the turbine and check for play. It could be something as simple as the wastegate linkage has fallen off which will result in underboost (P0299).

The compression test has many variables involved. First, how was the test performed and did you test it multiple times or just once? Compression/head gasket issues are not common on these engines even at 180k. If the engine has ever overheated (bad internal water pump) then it would be possible.

If those are OEM turbos they are probably toasted at 180k. Per Ford the oem turbo is only rated for 150k. Most people only get 70k out of them. Any rattles on cold start up?

 

[josh_ruppert]

No rattle on startup. I can rev the engine and no obvious noise but I do hear a subtle rattle. Almost like when those converter shields come loose.

As for compression, I took the gauge and checked all cylinders except the rear driver side. The one with the turbo tube coming over. When I checked the middle, I had the gauge against windshield and watched it jump up and down has engine was cranking. It started at around 50 and would jump to 85 and back down to 50. It would go back and forth, back and forth. I would let off the start button and it returned back to 50. I removed the gauge a few times. Checking for debris, etc. Result was the same, each time I checked.

I do not know if these are oem or not. The oil lines look pretty ugly with rust.

 

[mguy13sport]

Is the turbo housing rusty? How about the bolts on the manifold? If the flange studs are rusty its probably never been touched. The Ford logo will be stamped on the front.

You could try to get a spy cam down the cylinder with low compression and see if theres any noticeable damage. Very uncommon to see 3.5 eco with low compression without further known damage.

 

[josh_ruppert]

I haven't had a good opportunity to take a look at the turbo.

I drove my son's 16 SHO today. That thing is quick. Makes my car feel like a 4 cyl. Anything else I should do before buying another engine? This is going to be a LOT of work to swap out.

 

[josh_ruppert]

Ordered a boroscope. I will look into the cylinder once I receive it.

 

[Odrapnew]

No rattle on startup. I can rev the engine and no obvious noise but I do hear a subtle rattle. Almost like when those converter shields come loose.

As for compression, I took the gauge and checked all cylinders except the rear driver side. The one with the turbo tube coming over. When I checked the middle, I had the gauge against windshield and watched it jump up and down has engine was cranking. It started at around 50 and would jump to 85 and back down to 50. It would go back and forth, back and forth. I would let off the start button and it returned back to 50. I removed the gauge a few times. Checking for debris, etc. Result was the same, each time I checked.

I do not know if these are oem or not. The oil lines look pretty ugly with rust.

It's odd that #5 is the only one that did that, but might be worth trying another gauge.
A compression tester should jump up and hold the peak.
If it's dropping down after each compression stroke, that leads me to think there's an issue with the gauge.

 

[josh_ruppert]

I thought about the gauge being the issue. I bought this gauge a few days ago at harbor freight. I'll do more checking before buying another engine

 

[JohnelP]

I thought about the gauge being the issue. I bought this gauge a few days ago at harbor freight. I'll do more checking before buying another engine

gauge must have a Schrader valve that should prevent the dial to dial back. Save time and buy a cylinder leak down tester. With a compression tester tool you need to know how to read the "first jump". As for a leakdown tester, buy a reasonable one. no need for snap-on, but don't go harbor freight also. I would have said OTC , but now I take it back seeing the junk they sell now.

 

[josh_ruppert]

I took back the crappy harbor freight compression gauge. I watched some youtube videos on this gauge I bought and a lot of people were saying to stay away from it. The Schrader valve isn't even located at the threaded end. It is in the gauge itself. Will be picking up something else. My scope camera will be here tomorrow.

I will also do a leak down test.

One thing to note, aside from this compression issue, I was datalogging last night and found my boost to be -10 and ran up to -3. It never made it above into positive numbers. I remember my expedition would run around +15 or so.

 

[josh_ruppert]

I took back that harbor freight compression tester yesterday. Rented one from a parts store and rechecked that cylinder over my lunch period. smh...

This other gauge reported 180 psi when cranking over. 55 on HF tester. I rechecked it with throttle open and received 170 psi. I have read you are supposed to do this, not sure why though. So what gives?? All I can say is that I am so relieved.

Going back to the point of discussion, I have the P0430 bank 2 cat. I ordered a new one and it is sitting in my living room. I have P0299 Turbo A. Does this mean bank A? I hope to have the front cat pulled this weekend and inspect. I think I am hearing some chatter at idle so it could be this turbo. I really do not want to purchase front side when it is the rear.

I appreciate all of your help in direction.

 

[JohnelP]

How did you measure the boost? With forscan or a pressure gauge?
i hope i am stating the obvious that, if the car is sitting at idle, there is no boost. Even short acceleration with car standing will not be enough to generate boost. It is mostly atmospheric pressure (or just slightly higher). You have to drive and load for the system to load the turbo

And yes, according to your info, the car did not create boost in your tests. if you think it should have, check all the vacuum hoses, check the wastegate, etc.

Also, do not treat the error codes separately. the same problem may trigger indirectly both. Fix boost first, then worry on the cat.

 

[josh_ruppert]

Could the cat cause the boost code? That is first on list of codes.

I am using an sct x4 and forscan. Both reporting the same. It never goes above -2 while driving or wot.

 

[JohnelP]

Could the cat cause the boost code? That is first on list of codes.

I am using an sct x4 and forscan. Both reporting the same. It never goes above -2 while driving or wot.

The cat could cause the boost if the cats are completely clogged. But in that case you will see the turbocharger get cheery glowing hot and there is almost no power at all when driving