Another 02 sensor removal problem

[Daisywheels]

Hi all ...I managed to get that special removal tool stuck on my 02 sensor (Bank two sensor two). I first thought I was stripping the 02 sensor, but apparently I was moving it a bit as it is NOW STUCK AGAINST the CHASSIS. Now the the tool is stuck and I don't see any way to get this off as the chassis is blocking any movement upwards. I've PB blasted it, heated it up, but now know there is not enough clearance. Even if I cut it, the new sensor still needs the clearance from the chassis. I am absolutely dumbfounded with this problem. If anybody has any ideas, I surely would appreciate it very much. Thanks!

I'll try to add a pic if the system lets me.....
Nope, gotta use dropbox
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fivey194u7ded9g/stuck 02 sensor.jpg

And for the electrical gurus - see anything wrong? Obviously Bank 1 sensor 2 shows 0 voltage - easy explanation - I cut the wires, long story. Not having a good day
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1m9lwjdnlpx67dx/Ford obd.jpg

DW

 

[2000StreetRod]

remove access panel

There is an access panel under the center console. Remove the console. Remove the plate. See 2nd gen console removal

 

[Daisywheels]

There is an access panel under the center console. Remove the console. Remove the plate. See 2nd gen console removal

Thanks Rod, I already have the console removed and access panel. The sensor is actually stuck on the chassis transmission hump. No where to go. Also I cut the wires on the other sensor because I thought I could put a 7/8 in deep socket on it and access it from inside the vehicle. Won't grab - no luck there either

 

[Daisywheels]

I feel like just running the truck with no downstream sensors. Don't they just check the performance of the Cats or, is this a bad idea? Not worried about CA SMOG right now.

 

[2000StreetRod]

affects fuel trims

Even though that is the primary purpose of the post cat O2 sensors the PCM will adjust the fuel trims attempting to test the cats. One forum member recently posted the impact of cross connected post cat sensors and it was fairly significant. You may have an aftermarket exhaust system with the O2 sensor improperly placed or your body bushings could be shot and the body is lower than stock.

You may have to partially loosen the exhaust system to lower it.

 

[jremington59]

Have you tried to see if you can pry the exhaust pipe downward a little? You might also try seeing if you could grab the pipe with a pipe wrench and turn it a bit. If not you may have to break the top of the sensor off, heat the base of the pipe and thread the old sensor out with a wrench or do what Rod says and drop the exhaust. Any way you do it you need that sensor.

 

[SoNic67]

When I tried to remove my stuck O2 sensor, I forced/torqued the exhaust manifold so hard that the exhaust gasket failed on that side.
Noise was so annoyingly loud that I had to replace the gasket.
In your case, move BACK the socket 1/4 turn - that should release the pressure from the face of the socket and let you remove the socket.
Now, why is the sensor hitting the frame... that's another story.
Lift the truck frame up with a 4x6 and bottle jack (wheels should remain on ground) - that will release the weight on the body mounts (less compression) and maybe give you a little more space.

 

[Daisywheels]

Even though that is the primary purpose of the post cat O2 sensors the PCM will adjust the fuel trims attempting to test the cats. One forum member recently posted the impact of cross connected post cat sensors and it was fairly significant. You may have an aftermarket exhaust system with the O2 sensor improperly placed or your body bushings could be shot and the body is lower than stock. You may have to partially loosen the exhaust system to lower it.

That's probably it! I have it on ramps right now, and I'm thinking about raising the right side of the body with a jack. Hopefully that will give me an inch or two which is all I need.

 

[Daisywheels]

Have you tried to see if you can pry the exhaust pipe downward a little? You might also try seeing if you could grab the pipe with a pipe wrench and turn it a bit. If not you may have to break the top of the sensor off, heat the base of the pipe and thread the old sensor out with a wrench or do what Rod says and drop the exhaust. Any way you do it you need that sensor.

Good thoughts. The only thing is these sensors are right near where the two exhaust pipes are cross welded together. That area isn't gonna budge.

GW

 

[Daisywheels]

When I tried to remove my stuck O2 sensor, I forced/torqued the exhaust manifold so hard that the exhaust gasket failed on that side.
Noise was so annoyingly loud that I had to replace the gasket.
In your case, move BACK the socket 1/4 turn - that should release the pressure from the face of the socket and let you remove the socket.
Now, why is the sensor hitting the frame... that's another story.
Lift the truck frame up with a 4x6 and bottle jack (wheels should remain on ground) - that will release the weight on the body mounts (less compression) and maybe give you a little more space.

That just might work better than leaving it on ramps. Excellent info. Thank you!

DW

 

[Daisywheels]

That just might work better than leaving it on ramps. Excellent info. Thank you!

DW

BTW, how hard was it to replace the exhaust manifold gasket? I'm sure I have a leak in either the intake or exhaust manifold.

 

[SoNic67]

Exhaust manifold nuts where super rusted, basically part of manifold. I took it to a mechanic that had a torch capable of melting those away in case they break

 

[Daisywheels]

Well, I managed to get the down stream 02 sensors replaced. My neighbor took bolt cutter (no joke) to that one that was sticking up where the tool the was stuck. Anybody with similar problems: Do NOT buy or use those special tools. You NEED a .22 Ml socket at all times. 7/8 will strip any frozen 02 sensor on vehicles like mine.

The reason I started this whole dumb project was a lean code of PO171. Since it was bank one, and my cheap *ss scanner was reading no voltage to that sensor, I just decided to replace them all seeing as how the truck has 125K miles.

I've been reading and learning about Fuel Trims as well. Just getting a lean code really doesn't tell you much. However, my LTFT on bank one = 25%. They guy who replaced the sensors said don't pay attention to those cheap *ss scanners and everything is good. HOWEVER, my PO171 code along with the check engine light came back before I even drove it anywhere. It was off after the new sensors were put in.

Anybody got any ideas? Don't you just love driving into a CA SMOG station with a check engine light on What the hell is the point. Thanks all....

DW

 

[2000StreetRod]

lean condition procedure

. . . The reason I started this whole dumb project was a lean code of PO171. Since it was bank one, and my cheap *ss scanner was reading no voltage to that sensor, I just decided to replace them all seeing as how the truck has 125K miles.

I've been reading and learning about Fuel Trims as well. Just getting a lean code really doesn't tell you much. However, my LTFT on bank one = 25%. They guy who replaced the sensors said don't pay attention to those cheap *ss scanners and everything is good. HOWEVER, my PO171 code along with the check engine light came back before I even drove it anywhere. It was off after the new sensors were put in. . .

The O2 sensors gradually deteriorate and their voltage range will decrease. It's probably a good idea to replace them every 100K miles for best fuel economy. However, they are normally not the cause of lean codes.

The upper and lower intake manifold gaskets on your SOHC V6 dry and shrink with age. Eventually they will leak allowing unmetered air (not measured by the MAF sensor) to enter the intake manifold resulting in a lean mixture. If yours have never been replaced that may be the cause of your lean code. This thread may help: Lean condition procedure

 

[Daisywheels]

Possible bad Cat?

Thanks much StreetRod, I'll definitely look into that. Quick question: Would a bad Cat cause excessive exhaust noise? I'm trying to fix the little (Cheapest) stuff since I need those parts replaced eventually. I slid off a mossy granite slab onto another granite rock, and the truck immediately gave off an exhaust noise coming from "around" that Cat. It was even dinged a bit, shield was bent, but I never got any codes for a Cat problem. I'm thinking more of a cracked exhaust manifold (it hit hard), or even (hopefully) the exhaust manifold that just realigned and now needs a new gasket. Based on that info, I should be more concerned with the exhaust manifold? Or would the granite rock still be considered for upper intake manifold? Thanks so much again Streetrod.

PS. The excessive exhaust noise and the check engine light all started right after this rock incident. I told my neighbor to treat the truck like it was in an accident. It kinda was. I hit a rock instead of a car lol.

DW

 

[Daisywheels]

Skid plates

When I bought this truck, I assumed it had skid plates. My old Ranger did, but I didn't know they were an option for the Explorers. Previous owner opted NOT, and the truck now reminds me of a soccer mom car!

 

[SoNic67]

Some had a gas tank skid plate (it was optional).

 

[Daisywheels]

No skid plates to protect Cats?

I also smashed the hell out of my A/C condenser, yet the A/C stills blows ice cold. Got lucky there (Thats what proper skid plates should protect).

Any ways, decided to do something different since my truck has been running rather cold since I bought it. I took out the thermostat (ran so cold I swore there wasn't one even in there but there was) , boiled it, and it was closed until about just before boiling point. So I can rule that out.

Funny thing happened whiled doing this simple project. I managed to break the throttle linkage. But that's not even the worst part. While looking around I found a CRACK IN THE INTAKE MANIFOLD. I don't know how I missed it over all this time. Plastic piece of crap. And I'm almost certain I have a bad Cat, and bad exhaust manifold as well. One thing at a time. Happy happy joy joy.

I'm going to do some research to see if that manifold can be fixed with some sort of plastic welding kit. I think I'm reaching, but hey, why not.

DW

 

[2000StreetRod]

JB Weld

See this thread for more information: 1997 Ford Explorer 4WD V6-245 4.0L SOHC VIN E EFI -Cracked Upper Intake Manifold

 

[Daisywheels]

Gaskets

See this thread for more information: 1997 Ford Explorer 4WD V6-245 4.0L SOHC VIN E EFI -Cracked Upper Intake Manifold

That's an excellent link because it turns out I may not have a crack after all just like the guy in the thread. I thought it was cracked, but noticed their are several "lines" on the intake manifold. I sprayed carb fluid on it, and no change in idle - no air bubbles. I guess gaskets are another cheap way to see if I can get this disaster of a truck running properly. 2 quick questions:

-When they speak of upper and lower intake gaskets, they are still talking intake manifold, and not Exhaust manifold?

- I cannot locate any hose or connection to what is supposed to be here in the pic link below. It's gotta be something important, no? It's an open hose connection just wanting something stuck in it. Hard to see in the pic, but it is right in front of the more solid line that ends up in to Air Flow tube (the one that comes off the Air filter housing). Or better yet, the non flexible solid hose connection to ends up in to Air Flow tube. I think I just confused everyone, including myself. It's close to the firewall near the intake manifold.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/euin069w55hyi2a/ford hose.jpg

DW