Cooling system question

[MrQ]

I have decided to go ahead and get my entire cooling system replaced, but I am kinda curious about a few things.

First, water pump. What is a good brand and are there any special tricks to getting it installed? (I plan on removing the radiator and replacing it)

Second, I have an external tranny cooler but apparently the lines are still run through the radiator. Should I get a manual tranny rad and run the entire trans fluid through external rad? Should I get another external tranny cooler if I do this?

Third, what is the best electric fan to use for my radiator?

And finally, are there any other parts I should consider replacing on a 158,000 mile truck for the cooling system, other than the water pump, radiator, upper and lower hoses, and thermostat?

Thanks

 

[rustbucketMI]

Why are you replacing our cooling system in the first place? If its not broke don't fix it.

If you do go thru with this then i suggest finding a replacement rad with an incorporated tranny cooler, if you cant find one get a tranny rad, i dont know of any kind of specs but transmissions get real hot, real quick so make sure its large enough. For your electric fans the main thing will be sizing. Make sure they are big enough and pull/push enough CFM to cool down the engine, compare specs of the rad verse the fans. Most of the time your fans arn't running because the air flow from the vehicle moving is more than that of the fans. On that subject how have you planned to turn on and off the fans?

Like i said before if its not broken dont fix it. Stock works fine, unless you are pushing your vehicle such that the orginal cooling design will no longer work there is no real advantage to "upgrading" your cooling system

 

[MrQ]

Uhh, I probably should have stated that my cooling system has been running through a gallon of coolant a month...

"Upgrading" in this case is just replacing the old parts with OEM's and doing a little work to help improve cooling and free up horsepower. That's all.

 

[MrQ]

bump

 

[boggs1227]

as to what name brand of pump to use ....don't really know because i never had to replace the one in mine ...but @ 211k it's still working so maybe i go with either a motorcraft one or any new manufactured ones they sell at napa ...stay away from durablast products .


transmission coolers...

the one in the radiator is the best cooler you can use and i would not run just a standalone aftermarket cooler by it's self ...the thermal conductivity of water (coolant) is much higher than what you could get from haveing air blown over a hot stacked plate cooler .aftermarket coolers are ment to be run in conjuntion with the radiator's cooling effect .

what other parts to replace that coolant related ...

temp guage sensor
ect sensor ( engine coolant sensor the one the computer use's )
new cap ( rad cap )


i would make sure i flushed the system out as good as possible before starting any work ,nice to get all the rust and crap out of there or if you chem flush it you'll be removeing the harsh chemicals out of the system before any new parts see any flush chemicals .

 

[lifeguard379]

use an auto trany with ac rad, and bypass the rad for the tranz.
i use a ford torus 2 speed fan. i cant remember what year its out of, but i got it off ebay. make shure it has the thiner moter. their are some i don't think will clear the water pump.

 

[boggs1227]

so what your saying is to disconnect the cooler in the rad core and then run just a small cooler to cool the transmission ?

i think i was reading a post one day were brooklynbay said just what i said earlier...that the one in the radiator is the best one to use ...


little stumped here .....

 

[lifeguard379]

that what the trans guy i know said. he works for ford, so i gues you could go ether way.

 

[ThespecialistKC]

so what your saying is to disconnect the cooler in the rad core and then run just a small cooler to cool the transmission ?

i think i was reading a post one day were brooklynbay said just what i said earlier...that the one in the radiator is the best one to use ...


little stumped here .....

Only if you want to burn up your transmission quickly. The radiator is the primary cooling system for the transmission. The smaller dedicated cooler is secondary. You can increase the size of the smaller cooler, add on axillary elec. fans if you like, but do not disconnect the radiator from the transmission cooling loop.

 

[Maniak]

Running the trans fluid in the radiator or out is starting to get like the old "dino or synthetic oil debate".

In general, Yes, running in the Radiator is what you want to do. If your going to try to run it out of the radiator you better have trans temp gauge and one heck of a large external trans cooler. Most of the external coolers aren't made to be run as primary as they are small.

We run it out of the radiator on our X but we are running over 50,000 btu worth of trans coolers (30k gvwr and a 24k gvwr) and have a trans temp gauge and a 10" fan on one of the trans coolers

I only went this route since we have a trans cooling issue running issue due to our trans/converter choice and primarily when its over 100F. In "our case" I did find the trans runs cooler out of the radiator but not by that much. We dropped the trans temp < 10 degrees. Also it doesn't get much below freezing around here and for only a few days a year if that. Running it in the radiator also warms up the fluid in cold weather.

In general, I would probably keep it in the radiator unless I "needed" to take it out due to other circumstances. Use the bigger radiator (the one for a/c and auto transmission) and add a good sized external cooler for the transmission. If the engine isn't highly modified a good fan clutch should keep it cool.

Even when we had the transmission lines in the radiator we could run around wheeling in 105F+ temps and the engine temp would never come up. We upgraded to the hayden severe duty fan clutch which you "might" need to do if your not getting enough air flow at lower speeds with the stock fan clutch.

~Mark

 

[lifeguard379]

i would do what they said. lol i was going off hearsay.

 

[ThespecialistKC]

Running the trans fluid in the radiator or out is starting to get like the old "dino or synthetic oil debate".

In general, Yes, running in the Radiator is what you want to do. If your going to try to run it out of the radiator you better have trans temp gauge and one heck of a large external trans cooler. Most of the external coolers aren't made to be run as primary as they are small.

We run it out of the radiator on our X but we are running over 50,000 btu worth of trans coolers (30k gvwr and a 24k gvwr) and have a trans temp gauge and a 10" fan on one of the trans coolers

I only went this route since we have a trans cooling issue running issue due to our trans/converter choice and primarily when its over 100F. In "our case" I did find the trans runs cooler out of the radiator but not by that much. We dropped the trans temp < 10 degrees. Also it doesn't get much below freezing around here and for only a few days a year if that. Running it in the radiator also warms up the fluid in cold weather.

In general, I would probably keep it in the radiator unless I "needed" to take it out due to other circumstances. Use the bigger radiator (the one for a/c and auto transmission) and add a good sized external cooler for the transmission. If the engine isn't highly modified a good fan clutch should keep it cool.

Even when we had the transmission lines in the radiator we could run around wheeling in 105F+ temps and the engine temp would never come up. We upgraded to the hayden severe duty fan clutch which you "might" need to do if your not getting enough air flow at lower speeds with the stock fan clutch.

~Mark

Agreed and I stand corrected. It is possible to remove the radiator from the cooling loop, if you know what you are doing and use the proper equipment. But like you said it probably only makes sense if you "need" to do it. But then again what does "need" really have to do with any of this. lol?? Since we are on the subject, let me pose a question (or two).....
I'm tinkering with the idea of finding a trans cooler from a severe duty Crown Vic (or the like), mounting it in the vacant space next to the current trans cooler, plumbing the trans to it and using the current factory trans cooler as an engine oil cooler. Also maybe adding a small cooler/filter system for the power steering below the radiator. My question is this.. if I do add all this additional cooling, am I inhibiting the cooling performance of the radiator and the A/C condenser? I know the grill opening for a first gen isn't huge, thus only so much air can flow through. I don't want to "pre-heat" the air too much before it hits the major cooling components. I'm also thinking of adding a dual set of this 6 inch pusher fans in front of everything (if I can shoehorn it all in behind the stock grill) that I can manually control to add in airflow at low speeds. But again this is more "junk" in front of the radiator that will possibly inhibit airflow at highway speeds. Thoughts??
FWIW, mostly stock 2wd 1st gen w/ 145k on the clock. Never sees off-road or rocks. Tow a very small utility trailer a few times a year. Mostly highway/around town commuting. New trans at 100k, I want to make sure it lasts until at least 200k.....
Thanks as always.....

 

[Maniak]

If you have a good fan clutch, I don't think you would block enough air to cause an issue in coolant cooling.

We have 2 stacked plate style coolers and a 10" fan in front and at idle/low speeds or the freeway the coolant temp stays < 205 with a 195F thermostat.. That is including in 105F+ temps.

You do need to keep any fan in front off at higher speeds or they will restrict air flow as moving air will move faster than the fan can push it.

We do have a/c so I know the air is preheated quite a bit by the time it gets to the radiator. Especially when the trans is sitting at 180-190 pan temps.

just go get a better idea of how much stuff is in front of the radiator..

~Mark

 

[ThespecialistKC]

That's pretty much exactly what I have in mind, except 2 small fans instead of 1. Yeah, I would only kick them on in low speed situations, below 30 mph or so or in stop and go traffic. Were you able to cram all that behind the grill, or do you run it open like the picture? Thx.

 

[Maniak]

That all fits behind the grill, but barely.. The fan touches the grill.

That fan is from a Geo Prism/Toyota Corolla..

I have mine on until "about" 45mph (actually, its until the converter locks)

~Mark

 

[Hitchhikingmike]

I have just been having trouble with the engine cooling system in my Explorer. Engine temps were regularly peaking a bit above 220F cruising on the highway now that the temperatures have regularly been above 105F.

I just took off my under drive crank pulley and replaced it with my stock pulley to speed up the water pump. I then dumped all my coolant, ran a flush through the engine for a couple hours, flushed out the flush by running the garden hose through the engine (literately), flushed out the tap water with distilled water, then refilled again with Ford Gold Premium motor craft coolant from the stealership.

I have a two speed ford taurus fan in the ex and it is still better than the stock fan I know for sure.

But ever after all that my engine temps still peak up to 220 driving around with the AC with outside temp of 107F. But my temps don't peak that high as often and the temperature falls down a lot quicker now.

I might add a pusher fan in the front to help out the puller.

105F summers are hard on our engines…

good luck.

 

[Hitchhikingmike]

From what I have read on the internet 4500CFM is a commonly accepted value on the hi speed of the taurus 3.8L fans. And there are not any aftermarket fans that beat that. I still believe adding a Ford taurus fan is an upgrade in the general cooling system in any explorer.

 

[Hitchhikingmike]

Wow, I just realized this thread was from 2009.......



I did a search on engine cooling and this came up, though it was recent.

 

[rustbucketMI]

220F isn't that bad in outside temps of 105. I wish I could tell you how hot I've got some of my cars at work. With the AC on it stresses the engine more, and you are loosing some of the cooling power if you will, because forced air in the front also has to cool down the condenser. If you start getting to 140 I would be worried, but the engine should be able to run, albiet not great, at 120. It sucks but one of the things you can do is open all of your windows, turn the heat all the way up and the blower on full. That will take quite a bit of heat out of the coolant.

Another couple small things you could do are take off the grill and drive slower. taking off the grill will allow more air to get to the rad. There is a lot of surface area blocked. Driving slower will reduce the amount of energy in the system, and the cooling system will be able to keep up. You'd be suprised what 5mph will do.

One of the things that you probably aren't looking at is your trans temp. That cooler is integrated into the rad and as such dumps a lot of heat into the coolant. Go find a transmission oil cooler (air to oil) and mount it in line, after the rad is probably better. That should cool down the trans and as a result the engine. Make sure you don't already have an aux trans cooler. If you do I'm not sure the trans oil pump can handle 2 coolers.

I don't think that an addional pusher fan in the front will help anything. I'm running thru the physics and unless you are actually forcing more air past the rad there isn't any difference. To me if you have a pusher on the front, and a puller on the back you're just making the fans work less hard. You might get a little more air flow, but I can't imagine its that much. Just my thought.