Explorer Sucking in a lot of Air??

[PotatoExplorer]

I just documented this in my other thread since I wasn't sure if it was directly related to my RPM drop issue (Here - http://www.explorerforum.com/forums...pping-when-stopping-4-6l.464087/#post-3633850)
Just incase it's a completely separate issue, I'll go ahead and create this new thread... Here's what's I posted about what's going on -

"Another issue just appeared that may be related but I'm not entirely sure. Now under normal acceleration from a dead stop the Explorer sounds like is sucking in a ton of air. The RPMs seem to also be climbing higher than normal. After it gets up to about 3rd gear, the sound stops. It's sounding like the fan?? Occasionally when I start up the vehicle from a cold start, the fan will kick on for a few seconds and stop - it sounds exactly like this but constantly as I'm accelerating. I thought maybe it was due to the A/C, so I shut it off and it didn't change anything. When I first drove it today there wasn't any issues until about 5 or so minutes into the drive and things got warmed up... so I don't think it would be the fan clutch???"

Anyone run into this issue??

 

[07EddyB]

If it sounds like the fan clutch then why wouldn't it be the fan clutch? Are you watching the temp guage?

 

[PotatoExplorer]

If it sounds like the fan clutch then why wouldn't it be the fan clutch? Are you watching the temp guage?

I guess it could be, but I don't know. I would think that if it was the fan clutch wouldn't it have the same symptom as soon as I started driving from the very beginning instead of it happening after it warmed up in a few minutes? I was keeping my eye on the temp gauge and didn't notice anything off. I even pulled over and sat with the car idling for about 20 minutes with nothing a miss.

 

[Explorer_PL]

I would think a bad fun clutch would only make the fan roar at higher speed unnecessarily since it would not disengage or not turn the blades if it was not enraging.
Can't think of fan clutch and rpm affecting each other the way PE is experiencing.

 

[PotatoExplorer]

OK, question guys - I just went out and tried to spin the fan by hand (cold, non-operating temperature with the vehicle off) and it is putting up a lot of resistance. I give it a big spin and it almost immediately stops. Should the fan spin freely?? Or is this normal?? I tried to find some videos to give me an idea but had no luck. I also ran the car a bit shut it off and tried it again and still the same resistance. I'm starting to thing that maybe it is the fan clutch...

 

[tripplec]

Those clutches do have resistance when cold for sure. They lock up the hotter it get and really spins then and depending on the type and number of blades it can be very loud. Cold engine compartment will not engage it to that level.

 

[Butch-Explorer]

Mine did that when it had air in the cooling system, had to bleed air from radiator, now working fine for last 8 months.

 

[PotatoExplorer]

Alright, sorry for the delay in response guys.

So after doing some more YouTube video watching and internet forum reading (and re-reading this thread from start to finish), I definitely agree with Explorer_PL. My symptoms point to a locked up fan clutch with the "roaring" air noise, but if this was truly a locked up fan clutch then it would be "roaring" well into the higher speeds. Another key sign that it is not a bad fan clutch is that when I first start up the engine I'll hear the fan kick on and then quiet down in a few seconds. A locked up fan clutch would continue the sounds even after a few seconds.

Butch-Explorer - I looked into burping my cooling system and I'm definitely going to give this a try. My only curiosity is that I didn't do anything to the cooling system recently to introduce air into the system. Is there a way for air to get introduced into the system without me knowing? I'm guessing a hole in the system would be throwing coolant all over the place. Maybe it's possible that air was trapped elsewhere in the system and finally got dislodged?

With the research I also found out that what Tripplec said is indeed correct about the fan having resistance when the engine is cold. Again, if the fan clutch was locked up (I believe this is correct from what I was reading) that the fan would be extremely difficult to turn.

Another thought I had was that maybe the fan clutch is on its way out? Could it be possible for these symptoms to arise right before the fan clutch truly gets locked up for good? I don't think it would be any other part of the system failing (thermostat, radiator, coolant fluid) since my temperature gauge holds steady in the center and I have no overheating issues.

 

[tripplec]

Assuming its not locked as all indications are pointing to from your last post. Yes all viscous clutch have resistance as the fluid thins out its less. Heat absorbed will tighten the coupling causing more drag and more fan speed drawing air through the rad. However, (check this) if there is blockage at the AC condensor and/or rad core. There will not be enough air to cool the clutch at times. Driving generates Ram Air flow pushing through the two cores and more when faster obviously or very windy. Something is causing the clutch to engage when it shouldn't need to. You don't overheat with this problem but it will affect gas millage and noise comfort levels.

If nothing else is found you may just have to replace the clutch on the fan unit. Whatever is going wrong cannot be repaired since they're sealed.

 

[PotatoExplorer]

Thanks Tripplec, I wonder if it is related to the AC by chance. About a month ago the AC seemed to be running a bit on the warm side and was really struggling to keep it cool inside the cabin. It was hot as hell that day, but after that day the AC went back to normal operation. I do hear a "Hiss" noise after I shut the car off and get out. I've determined that it's the AC condensation dripping on the exhaust from under the car. As it drips onto the hot exhaust, the water sizzles and makes the "hiss" noise. I'm going to have to get a day to just poke around the engine bay and see if something is blocking the flow of air or inhibiting adequate air flow.

 

[tripplec]

A water hose is good for flushing. A pressure washer not so much. Too much pressure can bend the fins and cause problems. Especially if you're doing the rad it has to be from under the hood between the blades.

 

[PotatoExplorer]

Thanks for the advice Tripplec. Hopefully I'm able to tinker around with the Explorer on Sunday or Monday. I'm going to try and purge out any air bubbles, hose off the bugs on the front side of the radiator, maybe try to pull off the fan shroud to hose off anything from the back side as well.

I've been thinking too (maybe thinking too much about this...), do you think that maybe the coolant is on the verge of needing replaced? I'm thinking that maybe the coolant is good enough to keep the engine cool until I drive for about 10-15 minutes. Then it gets just a tad bit hotter than it wants to be so the fan clutch locks up and the fan kicks on. Once the fan kicks on, this keeps the engine just cool enough to not register a spike on the temperature gauge? Just kind of grasping at straws here.

I'm going to stop at Walmart at some point to pick up one of those coolant tools to see the boiling/freeze points. My coolant is green in the radiator but like pinkish/orangeish in the overflow tank (and smells like straight ass). The green radiator coolant does look a bit on the cloudy side and when I bought the vehicle the radiator cap was kind of crudded up with some type of whitish sludge. This caused the upper radiator hose to keep collapsing until I cleaned the gunk out of the cap.

 

[Gorb]

I just documented this in my other thread since I wasn't sure if it was directly related to my RPM drop issue (Here - http://www.explorerforum.com/forums...pping-when-stopping-4-6l.464087/#post-3633850)
Just incase it's a completely separate issue, I'll go ahead and create this new thread... Here's what's I posted about what's going on -

"Another issue just appeared that may be related but I'm not entirely sure. Now under normal acceleration from a dead stop the Explorer sounds like is sucking in a ton of air. The RPMs seem to also be climbing higher than normal. After it gets up to about 3rd gear, the sound stops. It's sounding like the fan?? Occasionally when I start up the vehicle from a cold start, the fan will kick on for a few seconds and stop - it sounds exactly like this but constantly as I'm accelerating. I thought maybe it was due to the A/C, so I shut it off and it didn't change anything. When I first drove it today there wasn't any issues until about 5 or so minutes into the drive and things got warmed up... so I don't think it would be the fan clutch???"

Anyone run into this issue??

Yeah I've had that happen. .My cooling system had a slow leak and had run low on coolent... then it airlocked and blew out the thermostat housing.

Explorers are notorious for bad tstat housings and leaky radiators. Check the rear heater core too if you have one. It's behind the drivers side rear wheel well

 

[PotatoExplorer]

OK, so I went out and tinkered around with the Explorer for a bit and collected some data. I thoroughly looked at the front and back side of the radiator. It appeared to be in fairly decent shape with minor debris (bugs and such) on the front and hardly anything along the back. I pulled the radiator cap off and started her up. I was expecting to see some bubbling up through the coolant but after 5ish minutes there was nothing. I sucked out some of the fluid from the top of the radiator (down below the neck) and the fluid began to pulsate up and down. After a minute or two of this pulsating, the coolant levels rose to the top of the radiator cap opening. I turned on the heater to max heat/fan and the coolant levels dropped significantly back down below the neck. Still no bubbling so I decided to rev it up a bit. After a few seconds around 3k RPM, the coolant came pouring out the top of the radiator cap opening. I let the coolant settle back down and then turned on the AC to max cold/fan. Coolant began to pour out the top of the cap opening. After this I decided to shut the vehicle off since the engine fan was kicking coolant all over the engine bay. I grabbed my garden hose and tried to rinse off most of the coolant spray and also sprayed off some of the debris along the front of the radiator.

Is the pulsating of the coolant levels normal?? Could it be possible that the radiator is clogged? I grabbed the bottom return radiator hose and after all of this it was fairly cool to the touch.

Thanks Gorb, I park on the main street and haven't noticed any recent leaks along the ground. I did have a minor leak a while back with the rear heater hoses but a simple worm clamp solved that issue. The coolant was to the top of the radiator cap and the overflow was filled to the correct marking.

 

[tripplec]

Not normal to me. Maybe compression getting into the coolant. Head gasket or such.

See what others say.

 

[07EddyB]

I think you are on the right track - mine did that when I replaced the radiator and had to get the air out of the system. Make sure that the front end is higher - park it on a hill or jack the front end up and the air will come out without so much coolant.

 

[tripplec]

Ramp on a grade of a driveway usually does a fair job and or raise the base with a couple of 2x6 under the front of the ramps for a 2" rise.

 

[PotatoExplorer]

ROUND 2!

I had about 30 minutes and tried this again. This time I did the little trick of taking a regular oil funnel and getting it tight into the radiator cap opening. After getting it up to normal operating temperature and several rounds of heat and AC cycles, the coolant filled to nearly the brim of the funnel. I had massaged the top/bottom radiator hoses. The bottom one produced several smaller bubbles but nothing too crazy. I realized that yesterday I failed to turn on the heat for the rear... not sure if doing that today will help. This time there was no significant drop in coolant level when the heat was turned on and also there was no pulsating in the coolant. After running the coolant to the brim of the funnel I decided to shut it off and check throughly for any coolant leaks. Not a drop. The engine fan cycled on and off several times throughout the processes. I failed to elevate the front end though... this time and last time. I figured that the radiator cap was the highest point of the cooling system but I could be wrong. Tomorrow I should hopefully have some time to try again and I'll throw her up on some ramps. Should give me a 5-6 inch rise. Another observation - the coolant does look gross and probably needs changed.

I'm going to try and give it a test drive later tonight if I get 15 free minutes.

 

[tripplec]

Ramps are higher than 6 inches but yeah give it a go. If its air in the system it needs to burp out. Same as if there is air in you, its got to come out. But it don't normally come out your mouth!!! LOL Purged else ware.

 

[PotatoExplorer]

Round 3!!!

I topped off the overflow tank since I took out a good bit in rounds 1 and 2. Then I placed her on some ramps and did the funnel trick again. Let it warm up on its own this time without revving. Once it was up to operating temperature I went ahead and massaged the upper and lower radiator hoses. The bottom hose wasn't even that hot to the touch. Several bubbles came up into the funnel with the bottom hose massage. I also did several cycles of heat/AC to the front and rear (also did some dual climate controls to the front... not sure if that did anything). I also kept it running well over 30 minutes. I revved it way up afterwards to get it nice and hot. Shut it off and cleaned up everything.

I wanted to drive it around pretty hard so shortly afterwards I took her around town. The fan clutch was engaged a good bit of the time even with this pleasant weather (about 80 degrees and low humidity). I parked and let the Explorer idle for 5-10 minutes then brought the RPMs up to 3k. After doing this the temperature gauge spiked sharply above the thermometer symbol on the temp gauge. Then about a minute or two later the needle spiked back down to the middle. I drove it around town some more and the needle was sharply spiking up and down.

Now it seems like it could be a thermostat issue. After I got home I grabbed the bottom radiator hose again and it was barely warm. The top hose was hotter than hell and the center back of the radiator was pretty hot.