hub noise? diff?

[pjw73nh]

Tech, thanks for the tips. Yes I have a few torque wrenches.

Several folks have said that one of the 3 bolts that hold the assy on to the knuckle is a real bear. You don't seem to think so. (bear in mind I am doing this on the ground with the car on stands.). i think they said it was a 15mm.

So you are saying the spindle nut on the end of the splined shaft is the ballbuster? I have air impact tools if you think that would help. I will just have to be sure I have 32 mm socket. (I have breaker bars too). Should I try and at least break it loose just a smidge with the car on the ground (to prevent the shaft from spinning) ?

When you say soak the hub. You mean the 3 bolts and the big nut? Or the mating surface too?

Will I need a hub puller?

Lastly, if I understand the procedure correctly, I will need a NEW spindle nut. Yes? Some folks have said that the torquing of the replacement spindle nut is extremely critical (I think the manual said 184 Ft Lbs) to prevent premature wearing out of the replacement hub. Does this ring a bell with you?

Thanks again for the tips.

 

[Tech By Trade]

The spindle nut is the easy part, a breaker bar and a 32mm socket. Getting the shaft out of the hub is a real pig. Soak it down the night before and you shouldn't need a puller. The 3 bolts that hold the assembly knuckle were a breeze on mine. Just be sure to torque that spindle nut or you can bugger the bearing. Think its around 183 ft/bs but check the manual to be sure. I didn't bother replacing any bolts or nuts on min. Its been over a year with a 100 dollar cheap Chinese knock off in temps between +35 and -40 degrees Celsius 4 feet of snow on back roads and off road hunting deer without any issues.

 

[eeprete]

Tech, thanks for the tips. Yes I have a few torque wrenches.

Several folks have said that one of the 3 bolts that hold the assy on to the knuckle is a real bear. You don't seem to think so. (bear in mind I am doing this on the ground with the car on stands.). i think they said it was a 15mm.

So you are saying the spindle nut on the end of the splined shaft is the ballbuster? I have air impact tools if you think that would help. I will just have to be sure I have 32 mm socket. (I have breaker bars too). Should I try and at least break it loose just a smidge with the car on the ground (to prevent the shaft from spinning) ?

When you say soak the hub. You mean the 3 bolts and the big nut? Or the mating surface too?

Will I need a hub puller?

Lastly, if I understand the procedure correctly, I will need a NEW spindle nut. Yes? Some folks have said that the torquing of the replacement spindle nut is extremely critical (I think the manual said 184 Ft Lbs) to prevent premature wearing out of the replacement hub. Does this ring a bell with you?

Thanks again for the tips.

pjw73nh, I don't believe you'll experience a total failure situation all at the same time, but potentially progressive failure of the part as it degrades. Chances are all will fail close to one another, so its almost best just to replace all as time and money may permit. With mine I had very similar symptoms (noise above 30 MPH, exacerbated in the turns etc). The front drivers wasn't as worn as the front pass, but both were bad. I'll do the backs as well soon because I do hear a little something back there too.

 

[pjw73nh]

Thanks for the input folks. I guess I'll start with one to see if there is any difference. I am not 100% convinced all my issues are with the front bearings, and the backs look a like PITA to do. I suspect once I do one side ( front) the other will be much easier.

 

[eeprete]

When using the hub puller and pushing out the spline you'll only be able to go so far but also make sure you don't damage the half shaft boot. Whichever side you are doing turn the steering wheel fully in that direction.

Alternatively you could also change the stabilizer bar end links at the same time and turn the steering wheel in the opposite direction to get the half shaft through further.

Some other tips:
- use a 1/2 drive flex impact socket for the hub bolts
- or use a 1/2 to 3/8 adapter with a 3/8 drive 15mm socket for that little bit of extra clearance.

Those bolts are only torqued to about 85-90 lbs ft so not too tough to break loose. Like others said use plenty of penetrant.

 

[pjw73nh]

Update: Note my symptoms above. Turning right (loading the right bearing, gave me noise. Turning left gave me noise AND "feel" in the steering wheel and floorboards.) This SHOULD have been the tell tale sign that the RIGHT bearing was the culprit. Even though the noise was more prevalent when turning right (Loading the left bearing), when turning left, I had noise AND feel.

Anyway, I did the left bearing first, took about 45 minutes. Instead of a puller, I used a pneumatic air gun with a pointed bit right in the middle of the spindle (I saw this on youtube). It vibrated out in 4 seconds. That said, I STILL had to beat the hub out of the knuckle, but it succumbed pretty easily. Maybe 4-5 minute. After replacement, only a slight difference in driving noise. Quieter, but not by much.

I did the right one. 3 hours. Bearing would not succumb to my relentless beating. I had been soaking it in (what I though was PBlaster) but it was liquid wrench. I finally realized this and used the PBlaster. 20 minutes later, it succumbed to my beating and abuse. Car is quiet as a church mouse.

I am pretty sure the drivers side was going to go pretty soon anyway, so I don't feel too bad about replacing it. 92k on the clock. Timkin bearings. $167 each.

Moral: The bearing with the FEEL/vibration (not necessarily the noisiest one) is the offender.

Hope this helps someone.


Paul/NH

 

[eeprete]

glad to hear. you should have gotten the hubs from rock auto. Under 110 for me when I got them, although my drivers one I got for about what you paid, when I got it locally.

 

[Explorer_PL]

Eeprete -

the ones from Rockauto - were they Timken or aftermarket ?

I'll pay 167 for Timken over 110 over some chinese

 

[pjw73nh]

FWIW, mine were Timkens. Amazon $167 each delivered.

P.../NH

 

[eeprete]

I paid 110 for timkins

 

[eeprete]

There is also moog which were made in Mexico and priced about 100. SKF is the other trusted brand and those are about 150 per.

Hubs made in china you can get all day long for about 60-70.

 

[pjw73nh]

I had gone over to Rock Auto first, and they were about $165. I just checked now, and they are still $165. TIMKEN Part # HA590156... This was the only (Timken) front bearing listed for my veh.... The only reason I went with Amazon, is that I have free shipping from them on certain items and this was one of them . These hubs are heavy suckers....

 

[thebrakeman]

I'm still living with the same condition, guys. The intensity comes and goes, but I don't think it's ever completely gone away. I probably need new tires before winter, but I'm not hopeful that this is the cure. So I'll just live with it until something gets worse. I don't like that, but I'm not going to throw endless money into this until I can get a diagnosis.

 

[eeprete]

I had gone over to Rock Auto first, and they were about $165. I just checked now, and they are still $165. TIMKEN Part # HA590156... This was the only (Timken) front bearing listed for my veh.... The only reason I went with Amazon, is that I have free shipping from them on certain items and this was one of them . These hubs are heavy suckers....

pjw73nh, maybe there is a change from 03-08? What part number are yours? My part number for my 03 is SP470201 or SP470200 without the ABS cable.

edit: I see there is a PN change in 06 to the newer model. apologies for any confusion.

 

[pjw73nh]

eeprete, no worries, glad we got it sorted out.

Brake, As mentioned above, I just figured if one was bad the other was probably not far behind. Especially where these were original and these vehicles/hubs have a history (albeit bad). I also tow and the second to last thing I need in my life is being stranded with my family on a holiday weekend, on some interstate in the middle of nowhere with a 5300 lb TT on the back, and a blown out wheel bearing.

I have a friend who had an EB Explorer and had the bearing fail on a long trip (NH to NC) because he didn't investigate the noise sooner.

Where my noise did get a LITTLE bit better when replacing the drivers, side (even though it wasn't the REAL offender), I don't feel too bad about spending the extra coin. At least I don't (shouldn't) have to worry about the drivers side going soon. Plus, the drivers side was the easy one. Only took about 5 minutes of punishment to get the bearing out of the knuckle. I wish the passenger one was that easy ...

 

[thebrakeman]

I've already replaced both fronts and 1 of the rears, after only the rear had a positive failure diagnosis. So it's not the fronts hubs that I'm avoiding for cost (they have already been done).

It's the rear differential I'm waiting on. Not willing to spend that kind of money until I'm sure that's the culprit. Mechanic and separate transmission guy has confirmed that if this is the problem, failure will not be sudden/catastrophic, but will steadily get worse.

That's where I am.

 

[pjw73nh]

Brake, I guess I missed that part

<<I've already replaced both fronts and 1 of the rears, after only the rear had a positive failure diagnosis>>

Yeah, for trans or other drive-line noises I'd wait too. I agree, a bearing CAN be catastrophic and immediate.

 

[thebrakeman]

update:
A couple of weeks ago, the noise did indeed get worse. Before, I could only get the noise at 35+mph when warmed up; now I can get it cold, as low as 15mph, and the noise/vibration is really bad by 40mph. Swerving in either direction, the noise gets slightly worse (not much), but it's equally increased left or right. Mechanic was backed up, but confirmed things this weekend. He wanted to let things cool down, then check the fluid condition again today, but is nearly convinced it's the rear diff bearings.

Under the assumption that it needs a rear diff rebuild, I've been looking at options. He has already told me he can get a rebuilt unit (same clutch-type LSD) for about $700, which is cheaper than he can rebuild himself, given this type. I'm wondering if I should just stick to the stock, or ask him to price a unit rebuilt with a Eaton/Detroit TrueTrac, which is a hylical-gear LSD.

I don't do any serious offroading, as this is our family vehicle. But I do tow a 5000 lbs camper several times a year, and 1 long trip every 2 years. I also like doing donuts in parking lots now and then, and the ability to help pull people out of a stuck situation with a tow strap. This may be what pushed this diff over the edge (?).

Part price alone on RockAuto is about $190 more for the TrueTrac over standard "Posi" LSD. Assuming my mechanic's price delta is about the same, should I consider this upgrade, or just stick to stock clutch-type LSD diff?

 

[Flag Gibby]

I personally would go for the upgraded performance. You never know when it will come in handy and the differential still acts like an open setup when you don't need it or are towing so no loss there.

 

[Explorer_PL]

Funny how these issues start coming up more and more often, I guess our Explorers are aging

I am going thru the same issue as we speak. I developed some type of humming / whining noise and it is mostly apparent at about 65-70 mph. It does not change sound when turning either way. I checked the rear wheels and they are rock solid - in the past if my rear bearing was going bad, I would have a play. As it is every time I had this type of noise I am thinking one of the differentials or transfer case - I am at 192k miles so anything can happen at this point. I really hope it is one of the bearings again - I have done those more times than I remember, I would love that to be the left front as that one has the most miles since it was replaced. Also, my tires were never quiet from the beginning so that is also a possibility.
Otherwise, I'll keep driving until it gets really bad and then I'd know..