Maybe I Need a Thermostat | Ford Explorer Forums - Serious Explorations

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Maybe I Need a Thermostat

Wolfie_85

Well-Known Member
Joined
April 20, 2014
Messages
498
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7
City, State
Iowa
Year, Model & Trim Level
1994 Ford Explorer XLT
It's been in the 20's Fahrenheit here lately, and I've noticed my Explorer only warms up to the "N" or "O" on the temp gauge, even after idling 15-20 minutes. I'm thinking the thermostat is stuck open. I'm going to replace it when I get a chance, but I was curious if this is normal or if I'm really running cold.
 



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Don't worry as much as where the needle is compared to other people's rigs. Worry about where did the needle sit on your rig during more human temperatures :).

Different coolant temp sending units (the single wire 1) will change where that needle sits. At 195f coolant temp, the current sender will between the M and A. The sending unit before this sat between the N and O.

I have an after market temp gauge too which is how I Know when it reaches 195.

~Mark
 






Variability

I've owned 20+ cars over the years and just recently bought a 1994 Explorer for my son. I will say that I've never seen a temperature gauge fluctuate so much when running. I replaced the coolant sender and it helped a lot but the gauge still moves around when driving. Have never seen that in any other car I've owned. Typically they get to the usual (warmed up) spot and sit there rock steady.

I am going to replace my thermostat as well. Not a problem, just curious to see so much movement in the gauge!
 






I've had movement on the gauge before too, but they were caused by 2 different issues...

1st is a cracked head. Of course, you get other symptoms with that too.. Either a smoke screen, or oil in the coolant etc..

The 2nd is a bad fan clutch. When the fan clutch is weak the fan doesn't spin enough when you are accelerating (think, getting on the freeway). The engine warms up as your getting up to speed, once your up to speed the load goes way down and you have plenty of air coming in thanks to you pushing through the air...

Also, it is a single wire temp sender... If your voltage is moving around, so will the gauges..

~Mark
 






Fan Clutch

Could be the fan clutch as well then. I understand the fan should spin freely when the engine is cold. Mine goes maybe a 1/4 turn with a little push when cold. Definitely resistance there.

Maybe need to replace the fan (it has cracks) and fan clutch as well!
 






Variability

I've owned 20+ cars over the years and just recently bought a 1994 Explorer for my son. I will say that I've never seen a temperature gauge fluctuate so much when running. I replaced the coolant sender and it helped a lot but the gauge still moves around when driving. Have never seen that in any other car I've owned. Typically they get to the usual (warmed up) spot and sit there rock steady.

I am going to replace my thermostat as well. Not a problem, just curious to see so much movement in the gauge!
 






Thanks, guys! I don't feel as pressed about it. But I probably will replace the thermostat at some point. She's 20 years old, and who knows if it's been done, or if it was replaced with one of those 160° units.
 






<snip>who knows if it's been done, or if it was replaced with one of those 160° units.

Just an FYI, at mid 25f, you don't get heat going down the freeway with a 180f thermostat, let alone a 160f thermostat..

~Mark
 






Oh yeah, had cars that never warmed up at speed with everything working right. But maintenance never hurts. And if it works better after replacing a part as cheap as a t-stat, even better.
 






Sometimes cheapo thermostats that are thin with a weak spring will allow a lot of temperature fluctuation that will show on the gauge. I threw in a cheapo from Autozone when a Motorcraft 'stat failed out on the road and it allowed the temp gauge needle to move an amazing amount, compared to the Motorcraft which stayed pretty much in the exact middle of the gauge all the time.

The Stant Superstats are a good quality thermostat for not much money, they are stainless steel and made in the USA. I've been using the 195 degree Stant and have been very pleased. The Stant may actually be better than the Motorcraft, since the Motorcrafts do seem to just suddenly fail after a few years. Haven't had that happen with a Stant....yet.

Also, it's pretty normal for the gauge to read a little to the left in cold weather, and a little to the right in hot weather, especially with the A/C on.

If it's way over to the N though, it could very well be that the fan clutch is either stuck or at least staying engaged harder than it needs to. Replacing the fan with the newer 10-blade model and a new fan clutch isn't a bad idea. Just be sure to get the right one, the auto trans needs the "heavy duty" and only the manual trans can use the "standard duty" fan clutch (although it can use the "heavy duty" for better cooling).
 






The fan is one of the things on my list, but I should see how freely it's spinning right now, to be sure. I checked not long ago, but things can change. I was debating Stant, Motorcraft, or NAPA for the thermostat. Good to hear that Stant is decent!
 






The NAPA thermostats are just reboxed Stants. The one I have in there now is a "NAPA Gold" Superstat. The NAPA packaging is a pretty fancy gold label box compared to the Stats on a hanging package.

Either way, the Superstat gets my vote - and I was exclusively using Motorcrafts for years before I learned my lesson.

I do prefer the "regular" Stant gasket/o-ring though, the one that comes with the Superstat is thin and has sharp edges, the thick rounded rubber one fits better and looks like it makes a better seal when pressed in the housing. It's worth paying the extra dollar and change for seperately.

The Motorcraft seems nice, but for the crazy high price, they don't always last and they fail by closing up and overheating the motor. Better to buy two Stants and keep one in the vehicle along with tools in case you ever need to replace it on the road.
 






Funny this discussion should come up right now... I just replaced my water pump (gasket leak, but decided to do the pump as well), fan, lower hose, and fan clutch (heavy-duty version) a couple of weeks ago. Since then I've noticed the temperature gauge moving farther to the right - just past center - periodically, which it never did previously. Does anyone have an idea how long the Stant Superstat typically lasts? I installed one about 2 1/2 years ago and it looks like I need to replace it.
 






You replaced the water pump and didn't put in a new thermostat? I'd say that'd be something to do at the same time while the coolant is drained and you already have easy access, it's more hassle replacing the thermostat later on since you have to drain the coolant again and go through the air purge procedure.

How long a thermostat lasts depends more on mileage than age, if you only drive a few hundred miles a year a thermostat may last decades. Generally they can last over 100,000 miles if the engine never has temperature issues and so the thermostat never gets hot enough to damage the wax inside it. The moment the engine temp goes far enough over 200+ degrees, the thermostat is affected and will never be the same.

The Stant thermostats are 195 degrees rather than the 190 degrees of the stock Motorcrafts, so the gauge needle sometimes reads ever so slightly to the right of center, but it's also possible that the new water pump and/or new fan clutch is just putting more of a load on the engine while they break in, and so that extra amount is causing the temps to be a little higher than usual, even with the thermostat open.

Coolant can affect tempertatures too, since a poor mix or the wrong type of coolant can result in poor heat transfer. A lot of the "regular" coolants these days are Dex-cool, including regular and long-life Prestone. The best coolants for the 4.0L OHV seem to be either Zerex Green (regular old-style ethylene glycol) or Zerex G-05 (the yellow stuff they use in current Fords). You can also get the G-05 at the dealer in a Motorcraft branded jug.

Mixing coolants, especially with Dex-cool versions, can cause sludge and otherwise affect heat transfer since you're mixing two different heat transfer chemicals. If ever using a different coolant than the one you used before, it's best to completely flush the system so it's 100% water, then drain, and add a gallon of coolant, then top off with more water. The 91-94 has a coolant capacity of about two gallons, so this gives the ideal 50/50 mix.
 






Thanks for the information, Anime. Yes, I should have taken the opportunity to change the thermostat, no excuse. I've been using the 'standard' Prestone yellow coolant in a 50/50 mix for many years and hadn't thought there was a better alternative. Being in the Pacific Northwest we don't see temperature extremes in either direction, so other than monitoring the coolant level and checking the ph occasionally I don't pay much attention to it. If this isn't getting too far off topic, what do you think of the 'wetter water' additives?
 






I used Prestone for years, thinking it was the same old "green" stuff it had always been - until the water pump gasket started leaking and there was no good reason why. Dex-cool type coolants eat gaskets in motors not designed for Dex-cool (and sometimes even in motors designed for Dex-cool), or if you mix Dex-cool with other coolant types. I switched to Zerex G-05 and the leaks went away and cooling performance is great.

Redline water wetter is something for vehicles that are used on a racetrack - since most tracks completely ban using actual antifreeze/coolant because it's toxic, but also since it's super slippery if it gets on the track (either from a leak, burst hose, or a collision) and is both a danger while it's on there and a pain to clean up. They run it with water as a substitute for coolant, so it still raises the boiling point of the water, preventing the water from boiling at engine temps, but it's not as toxic nor much of a hassle to clean up, seems like it can just be washed away with water.

As for using it in a street vehicle, sure, you can, BUT actual antifreeze/coolant gives better protection against rust and corrosion, which is actually the point of using it. Straight water with no antifreeze/coolant actually transfers heat better than a mix of water/coolant, but of course the water by itself in a motor will rust a steel block and heads, and corrode aluminum heads, water pumps, intakes, etc. The antifreeze/coolant also gives protection against freezing and boiling so the vehicle can operate in a wide temperature range. Water wetter raises the boiling point, and also gives some rust/corrosion protection, but does not give any protection against freezing.

I know the companies that make the stuff also market it as being an additive to a water/coolant mix, but that's a marketing gimmick to just sell it to more people in the auto parts stores. It might actually improve cooling in some vehicles, but that's because those vehicles have coolant that is old or the system has too much coolant which is inhibiting heat transfer.

A cooling system that has the proper 50/50 mix of water and coolant with no mechanical issues is generally the best all-around solution for a daily driver.

If you want slightly better cooling, and live in a climate where it never gets cold, you can go down to about a 30% coolant mix (70% water, 30% coolant) and get better cooling (since more water allows better heat transfer), while still getting rust and corrosion protection from the antifreeze/coolant. If it gets cold though, such a mix is not going to give protection from freezing at temps as low as a 50/50 mix. A 70% coolant, 30% water mix actually gives the most protection from freezing in really cold climates.
 






Glad you posted that, Anime. I thought the green Prestone didn't change! I had a car with Dex-Cool (it was a GM). It's horrible stuff. Clogged the cooling sytem, it would get hot and just dump coolant. Great fun. I loved that little car, though. Aside from the Dex-Cool issue, it was great. It was cleaned out and replaced with green (not Prestone) coolant. No problems with cooling EVER again.
 






I also appreciate the information. Next opportunity I'll change to the Zerex type.
 






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