No turn signals, no dash lights, no luck!

[budwich]

OK.... that helps quite a bit as we are interested in the connector side of things although I would have expected things to be good going thru the flasher.

Your "new readings" line up with expectations.... almost.

Your continuity to the MFS switch is good / expected as that's what I would have expected.

Your O/Y (sorry my V or Y was hard to read but if you see Y then we concur). As expected that should be hot in run and is.

Your R/W is as expected hot at all times.

My pin 4 and your pin 4 appear to disagreed along with pin 5. Drawings show black as a ground.... having said that... your reading appears to be a "floating ground" and hence, my guess is that you lost your ground connection. BUT there are some other "disagreements" in pin number versus color (ie. 3 and r/w and hot at all times).... so the conditions for the r/w versus measurement appear correct but the pin number doesn't align. Is it possible that you are misreading the connector????

No problem but we can continue "in the dark". My new guess is that you lost your ground connection.... so somewhere on the connector, you should find a ground. My guess it is black (convention). My drawings show that the ground (G100 in this case) comes from the left hand side (driver's side) of the engine compartment.

Further, and this is your "winning number"... you guessed it... your illumination comes from the same ground (g100). By george, I think you have got!!!!

 

[gliderman8]

Update... I did check from the Light Blue wire (#1) to ground when operating the turn signal stalk. I get ground in LEFT and RIGHT positions. So I assume that the MFS switched the ground connection.... is this correct? If it is, then the White/red must get +12v from the flasher when it is working.... is this correct? Do I have my head on correctly?

 

[budwich]

not quite... your MFS switch switches in "resistance to ground" as in bulbs.
As for the rest of your "conjecture"... not sure how to interpret it. basically, "flashing voltage" is sent on the two wires to the MFS (you have previously identified this with continuity checks... LB and R/W ... IRCC) which then feed to your light bulbs.

Again, I think you have narrowed down your problem to lack of ground ... which DOES NOT come from the MFS but is connected to the flasher "directly" thru the connector from G100 which is a common ground for your illuminating dash lights. You need to check G100.

 

[gliderman8]

I think we are both thinking the same at this point (scary!).
OK, I am thinking of running a ground directly to the pin #5 to see if the flashers work... what do you think of that idea?
Next, "You need to check G100" Can you elaborate on that? Since I don't have a schematic, I'm not sure what G100 is.
I'll wait to run that ground wire until I hear from you. Thanks again for all your help!

 

[gliderman8]

Ok budwich how do you spell success? You spell it TURN SIGNALS ARE WORKING!!!!
Thanks to YOU and your steady help you were able to guide me in the right direction to resolve this problem. It is always nice to meet nice people on line and you are one of them!!!
I decided to do what I said and ran a separate ground wire to the flashing relay and that did it.
Now, any ideas on how to trace the presumed short in the black ground wire that also feeds the panel illuminations lights? Also, any thouhgts about physically getting to the dimmer control? I can't see how to get to it without disassembling the whole dash.

 

[budwich]

As I mentioned in the earlier post (a few back).... the G100 ground is located in the left side of the engine compartment (ie. drivers side). I suspect you should see a black wire running to a screw on the side wheel well.

 

[gliderman8]

Got it.... I will check the condition of G100 tomorrow and see what I can find. I'm just thankful that I have one problem solved. Now onto problem #2!

 

[budwich]

Looking at the "ground diagram".... it is unlikely that the ground at the fender wall is broken completely as a number of other "important" circuits would be "misfunctioning".... so it is likely that a splice along the route is broken. According to the info that I have, there is a splice near / around the obd connector that holds the "key" to your problem... I think.

 

[gliderman8]

Thanks again budwich for your followup. I would have to concure with you that if the ground were broken, I would have additional headaches!
OK, my abbreviation ignorance is showing.... I don't know what "obd" refers to. Please let me know and I will begin the process of looking for the needle in the haystack.

 

[budwich]

when in doubt on "acronyms" or abrev., search is always your friend including google.... OBDII connector is the connector under the steering.

 

[gliderman8]

Got it... thanks!

 

[gliderman8]

Here's what I found..... you are correct, there is a common ground coming from the dimmer control to the flasher relay. I tried getting continuity on the black ground wire coming out of the back of the dimmer control and ground with no luck.
Next, I set the meter to dc volts and measured +11v on this ground wire with the key on. Based on this, I can only assume that there is a short in one of the components on the dimmer circuit board. Tommorrow I will pick one up at an auto salvage place. They have one and quoted me $10. I'm confident that will solve the no illumination problem and it's a small price since the dealer wants $170.
Will update you after I install it.

 

[budwich]

I don't think that will resolve your problem as a short on a ground circuit.... IS just a ground! Checking for grounds is not done with voltage readings ... it is done with continuity measurements. IF you have no ground in a circuit when you measure voltage in that circuit, it will "float" to some potential above ground.

Not quite sure that I understand your "common ground coming from the dimmer switch". Grounds are usually NOT fed thru a component / switch to another component / switch... there is usually a splice with each component getting its own ground.
Of course, you could be right and I have forgotten everything that I have learned in my past. The 96 diagrams certain DON'T bear out your conclusions though.

 

[gliderman8]

budwich.... you were right again!!! Switching out the dimmer switch did not solve the problem. After reading your post last evening, I sat back and thought about what you wrote. This morning, I pulled the plug off of the dimmer switch and started probing for ground but found none.
I began searching for any short by trying to follow the black wire (ground) through the maze of the wire loom. When I became frustrated I simple cut the ground wire close to the plug of the dimmer switch and ran it to a grounding point.
Everything is working as it should: panel lights, turn signals, radio, compass, so far I have not noticed anything that is not working.
The lesson you taught me was to never turn my back on logical thinking in that there had to be a short in the ground somewhere and the component should not have been suspect.

 

[budwich]

It is more likely that you have a BREAK in your ground not a short..... Anyways, you have worked around it so that is good. The break is likely near the connector that I mentioned but tracing is always tough under the dash when you are in there hanging upside down... . Good luck hopefully your workaround will suffice.

 

[superboat]

i have the same problem.flasher and blinkers not working.i ended up taking a +lead jumper wire and tapped into the red/white wire which would be number 3 inside the flasher.my blinkers and 4ways work now.if i unplug the flasher it stops working.so im wondering whats causing me to get no power to the flasher,is there another relay under the hood or somewhere behind the dash?kinda lost right about.any advice would deff help.thanks
edd