Steering shaking when braking

[mikelowrey]

Hey gang,

I been having that problem and took it to MAVIS for when I was having a tire change, the guy checked and said the brakes were still looking good but that it could be the rotor of getting so much heat every time I brake that the get to bend (wtf?) and cause the shakiness. Now if thats the case, Do you recommend changing rotors and brake? What brands you recommend?

or what?

BTW is a 15 Explorer Limited. thank you

 

[pup5581]

Hey gang,

I been having that problem and took it to MAVIS for when I was having a tire change, the guy checked and said the brakes were still looking good but that it could be the rotor of getting so much heat every time I brake that the get to bend (wtf?) and cause the shakiness. Now if thats the case, Do you recommend changing rotors and brake? What brands you recommend?

or what?

BTW is a 15 Explorer Limited. thank you

Sounds like warped rotor...mine is doing somewhat the same..not steering shaking..well a tad..but most like a grinding noise and you can feel it in your seat. When i brake from like 50 down..it doesn't do it...but when on highway and doing 70-80 and braking for traffic it does it

If you change the rotors i would just change the pads as well

 

[mikelowrey]

Sounds like warped rotor...mine is doing somewhat the same..not steering shaking..well a tad..but most like a grinding noise and you can feel it in your seat. When i brake from like 50 down..it doesn't do it...but when on highway and doing 70-80 and braking for traffic it does it

If you change the rotors i would just change the pads as well

Thank you, that was the word, I just didnt remember it. What brand would you recommend? this is the first brake change the truck is getting.

 

[182RG]

Thank you, that was the word, I just didnt remember it. What brand would you recommend? this is the first brake change the truck is getting.

Powerstop Ceramic rotor/pad kits from Rockauto. Performing perfectly after 10K miles.

 

[Napalm]

I DD my other cars on wagner Thermo Quite pads - they are a ceramic - and often on sale with some promotion or whatnot with Advance Auto or whatever.

same/similar compound of Hawk Ceramics - sure acts like it. but way cheaper - when on sale.

rotors - I try not to buy the cheap rotors. whatever name. it's occasionally hard to gage but for example for the diameter of the explorer and the like - they should easily cost more than 40-50 dollars. anything under that I find rather questionable. Most with respect to allow quality and actual testing for runout and correction.

ALso I've not had this issue with any FWD car I've owned in the past - but everything is getting tighter in suspension and sharper steering. So

Check your assembly runout. there is a gage you can buy or rent - basically a dial indicator on some sort of clamp/magnet base to attach. With the cleaned hub, and new rotor - place dial indicators ball stylus on the edge of the rotor - IE to run around the circle. I don't know what the ford spec is off hand but usually under 0.005" is common.

With a FWD car on the front axle I suggest placing the car in neutral and jacking both wheels up.

rotate the wheel slowly - watch the dial - if the waver moves the needle more than 0.005, then you need to try to re-index the rotor. Basically take the rotor off and move it over one wheel stud - I like to make one stud as the "starter". rinse and repeat. Again though I come across this need mostly on RWD performance cars.

but as the tire sidewalls get narrower and the suspensions get tighter I could see it becoming an issue in more vehicles. If the Ford Manual doesn't call for a run out check - then it's probably not necessary.

 

[sheltonfilms]

I DD my other cars on wagner Thermo Quite pads - they are a ceramic - and often on sale with some promotion or whatnot with Advance Auto or whatever.

same/similar compound of Hawk Ceramics - sure acts like it. but way cheaper - when on sale.

rotors - I try not to buy the cheap rotors. whatever name. it's occasionally hard to gage but for example for the diameter of the explorer and the like - they should easily cost more than 40-50 dollars. anything under that I find rather questionable. Most with respect to allow quality and actual testing for runout and correction.

ALso I've not had this issue with any FWD car I've owned in the past - but everything is getting tighter in suspension and sharper steering. So

Check your assembly runout. there is a gage you can buy or rent - basically a dial indicator on some sort of clamp/magnet base to attach. With the cleaned hub, and new rotor - place dial indicators ball stylus on the edge of the rotor - IE to run around the circle. I don't know what the ford spec is off hand but usually under 0.005" is common.

With a FWD car on the front axle I suggest placing the car in neutral and jacking both wheels up.

rotate the wheel slowly - watch the dial - if the waver moves the needle more than 0.005, then you need to try to re-index the rotor. Basically take the rotor off and move it over one wheel stud - I like to make one stud as the "starter". rinse and repeat. Again though I come across this need mostly on RWD performance cars.

but as the tire sidewalls get narrower and the suspensions get tighter I could see it becoming an issue in more vehicles. If the Ford Manual doesn't call for a run out check - then it's probably not necessary.

This is the dial indicator I use. My rotors at 15k were only 0.001-0.0015 runout on each rotor.

http://www.harborfreight.com/clamping-dial-indicator-93051.html

 

[Napalm]

almost exactly like mine.

does the ford manual call for a runout check? now I'm curious. I say that because this is the first FWD car I've owned in some 16 years that I'm intending to do any MX on.

 

[WJGreer]

I believe this condition results mainly from light to medium brake application over extended periods, where the rotors and pads are allowed to get extremely hot. In Colorado we have lots of very long descents, at relatively high speeds, on highways. I-70, for example, gives back 2400 feet of elevation in an 8-mile stretch westbound between the Eisenhower Tunnel and Silverthorne.

I used to get warped rotors on my vehicles all the time. At a point, I decided to avoid using my brakes to regulate speed on downhill stretches and instead mainly use the gearbox, like semi drivers do. Since I've been doing that, I've noticed a pronounced improvement. Obviously, if I need to stop or abruptly slow down, I use the brakes.

Maybe this is or isn't what's happening to you, but I thought I would mention it for the benefit of the thread.

 

[sheltonfilms]

almost exactly like mine.

does the ford manual call for a runout check? now I'm curious. I say that because this is the first FWD car I've owned in some 16 years that I'm intending to do any MX on.

0.002 inch for max runout


Front brake disc minimum thickness (325 mm (13 in) brakes) 28.5 mm (1.122 in)
Front brake disc minimum thickness (352 mm (14 in) brakes) 30 mm (1.181 in)
Rear brake disc minimum thickness (330 mm (13 in) brakes) 10.0 mm (0.394 in)
Rear brake disc minimum thickness (345 mm (13.5 in) brakes) 17.5 mm (0.689 in)

 

[bigdude2468]

Not an unusual problem, I think I have had this occur on almost every vehicle I have ever owned. I normally will have the rotors turned the first time I do the brakes and if needed buy a new rotor after that. You can pick up cheap made in China rotors but its not worth it in IMO. A high quality rotor, Wagner, Bendix will weigh substantially more than the Chinese rotors. Weight is important, it allows the rotor to accept more heat before it warps.

 

[JETZ]

Had the same issue. Had my front rotors changed out last Friday. Pads @ 6mm still lots of meat left, not recommended to change yet.
I have 93000 km on my truck, the tech was surprised that I got that many KM's out of the front rotors. I had to replace my rear pads last year already!

New car rotors (for years now) can't be turned cause they are too thin. They are just throw away.

 

[bigdude2468]

That is not always the case. Honestly I don't know on the Explorers rotors but I recently turned the front rotors on our 2012 Dodge Caravan and there was plenty of meat left after machining. Obviously the amount of material that needs to be removed impacts this.

 

[sheltonfilms]

New car rotors (for years now) can't be turned cause they are too thin. They are just throw away.

I think the whole "rotors are now being made too thin" is all marketing hype/crap.

Just like 3,000 mile oil changes.

I have taken the cheapest rotors before and have turned them 3x and they still meet the oem spec for minimum thickness.

 

[Halwg]

Yep, just get them turned an they will be fine.

 

[WJGreer]

I think the whole "rotors are now being made too thin" is all marketing hype/crap.

+1. I've never heard that from a person not trying to sell me new brake rotors.

 

[Napalm]

so on some more performance oriented cars this is a real thing. I think all audi's now per the shop manuals tell the shops to full replace the rotors.

but again - everyone specs differently. But yes any decent measurement - and someone that can run the machine right - can re-true a rotor without taking major metal off.


On the warping - someone above mentioned being in CO and long decents. Yes you can get the rotors and pads very very hot. upwards of 1100 degrees F on some cars and conditions. (not sure the limits on an explorer)

The warping isn't so much that the metal bends out of shape - not saying it can't - but that's not the prime culprit as it turns out. It is possible with that heat, and the pressure right under the pad - to press the brake dust into the rotor grains, creating bumps in essence. Many pad and rotor makers agree on this which is part of the reason you see more and more ceramic compounds on the market as standard. they resist heat better than the semi-metalics of before.

anyway - if you have this issue - cutting the rotor will help, but only for a short time - you have to get upwards of a few hundredths of material removal to get it all out, a few thousands while refinished - isn't removing the lump - just evening it out. 2 or 3 hard brake applications later and it's back again.

This is the main reason you see shops going to the "replace the rotor" philosophy. That and the abundance of cheapo rotors.

OH and slotted rotors - if you want to get all neck deep in performance brakes - while they are most aggressive and capable are more and more sensitive to this pad deposit issue than smooth face.

side note - cheap rotors don't often have the same cooling vane design or ability as your higher quality castings. they can be quite complicated - but pumping that air though there helps. Example - DBA 4000 series rotors.