Won't Start - 10/12/03 - Electrical?

[woodychitwn]

First off, I hate having to ask, but I've looked up the last year's "won't start" threads, and don't think I've found the exact same problem. Some similar, but nothing exact I think.

First off, it's a typical '94 Explorer V6 and started fine this morning. Drove to a friend's house to drop something off and the remote lock worked fine. 10 minutes later I went to unlock it, no problem and turned the ignition but the voltage dropped to almost nothing, the lights dimmed and it didn't start. So, thinking it was just a battery problem, I called a friend to get a jump-start and it didn't help. We hooked up the batteries, the voltage meter jumped to normal, the lights got bright again, but it still wouldn't turn over. We waited 10 minutes to no avail. I could hear the starter trying, and everything else sounded normal, it just didn't start. I checked the fuses and relays under the hood, and they looked fine, so I'm at a loss. Any ideas?

 

[NICE59FORDF100]

same thing happened to me the first day i got my license and was at school. the starter went out. you try and start it, and you hear the clicking noise of the solonoid? but not start? yep, that was mine. funny quirk though for mine. i was waiting for a tow truck when i rolled up my driver window (everything electrical worked) because it was starting to rain, and i had this 'hell, just one more time' thing goin, and it started right up. needless to say, i drove Blue to my mechanic, and had a new starter put in, but ya, could be that

 

[woodychitwn]

Would that cause the strange voltage drop? Right after we removed the jumper cables the voltage went back to almost nill. There was enough to roll up the windows, but only with help from two guys pushing up as well.

 

[Crankcase]

Myabe you left your lights on or something, and completley drained the battery. Try charging it with a plug in charger....

 

[woodychitwn]

I don't see how it could be a dead battery. I was only away for 10 minutes, everything was off, and the jump-start would have still gotten it running. Wouldn't it?

 

[mhn3773]

i had a problem like that b4 and what i did was hook up a diff batery the way my friend did it was un hook my batt then connect the jumpers to his car...id just remove both batts the car started fine so it was just that my batt wassent holding a big enough charge to turn it over

obviously if u did that and it didnt start it would be soilenoid or the starter

 

[woodychitwn]

Alright so I borrowed a friend's car so I've got a way to work tomorrow, but does anyone know how I can confirm it's the starter before I yank it out and throw in a new one? I'll check the board in the morning.

As an interesting side-note, my boyfriend thinks the explorer's got a smoother ride and more comfortable seats than the BMW I borrowed. That made me smile.

 

[NICE59FORDF100]

well, as soon as you get bored of your freinds, ill take them so i can borrow their cars, hehe.

 

[woodychitwn]

I'm keeping my friends; you can't have them. Besides, to see them you'd have to hang out at a lot of gay bars. On the other hand, we also hang out at a lot of Cubs games and the occasional lesbian bar, so it might not be all bad.

Regardless, if I wanted a BMW I'd buy one. But I like my truck. Overnight it seems like everything has gotten bigger and more daunting. Parking spaces look huge, I find myself avoiding raised manhole covers and streets with speedbumps, and this morning I was passing a Honda Civic and caught myself thinking, "Damn that's a tall car." I mean, the thing is zippy as heck, can fly around corners and has reminded me how much I love having a manual transmission. But I miss my truck.

So I'm going to head over to the truck after work today. See if I can make heads or tails of the starter and double-check the battery cables. I appreciate the leads. (No pun intended)

 

[97emerald]

It sounds like you have a bad connection at a battery cable. clean and tighten all of the connections at the battery, starter, and the ground connection. If that doesn't help, you could have a bad cable or the battery could be shorted. Any of these things could explain the low voltage and inability to jump-start.

 

[woodychitwn]

I'm going to have to agree with the bad battery cable theory. While putzing with it tonight, it seemed like sometimes the voltage was fine, and sometimes it was dead. It kept fluctuating, but there was never enough to get it running. Sometimes the solenoid would click, other times nothing. I completely disconnected the battery and hooked up to the one in the BMW, but it wouldn't even try to start. Unfortunately I've run out of time and energy, and am going to the mechanic 100' from the truck, paying them $25 to tow it and letting them diagnose the problem. It took three guys to move the thing to where it's at, and you haven't had fun until you've parallel parked without engine power or power steering. So, let's see what the repair shop says. Thanks for the suggestions!

 

[woodychitwn]

CONCLUSION

So after all that troubleshooting, jump-starting and fruitless attempts to push it up on ramps, it turns out my battery was shot beyond being able to be jump started. The repair shop replaced the battery and it's supposedly running fine. I'm picking it up after work. Kind of pissed that I just didn't stick with my original instinct and jumped to the conclusion it was something more severe.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions! Hopefully this thread will help someone else down the road.

I'm guessing I hit a particularly hard bump (The road was under construction, a lot of torn up street and exposed manhole covers) and something in the battery just snapped. It's the only reason I can think a battery would go from good to bad without anything being left on or showing any other warning signs.

Since the mechanics were able to fix the truck in the street, they didn't charge me for towing. And after parts, labor and tax, the total bill is $109. I figure I would have spent $90 on a new battery anyway. Besides, I had fun with my loaner car, so I think it was worth it.

 

[BLUZ]

Yeah, sorry I didnt see this earlier, but it seemed like a bad battery from the start. If you have a bad battery, it is very possible it cant be jumped. Batteries are like that too, if they get bumped or moved they can short out a cell or something.

I had no battery problems with my other car and was working underneath it so it was jacked up pretty good. When I took it down it wouldnt start. I just brought it in an got like my third free replacement from Sears (the only thing they are good for). Too bad they broke my cowling in the process and it cost me $100 to replace.

 

[professorweed]

we have had the exact same problem with one excetion we got the new battery and drove home yeah!!!! now it is sitting dead in the driveway. new battery and all we have replaced the whole starting system...starter positive cable, solenoid, battery except the alternator and negative battery cable. we are dumbfounded we are pulling the alternator tomorrow we hope that it will test bad so we have a solution if not where next?

 

[professorweed]

My starting problem is solved--it turned out the starter I got from napa was defective. It was shorting out one of the brushes to the case. This vexing problem caused me to replace the entire starting system, with the exception of the harness between the ignition switch and pcm--I mean everything-- the battery, fender solenoid, starter solenoid, the starter motor, battery terminals, battery cables, fusible link (yeah, I know, it's not in the starting system), and ignition switch.
OH--be careful of those pesky brush springs--they will fly out of the holder quicker than you can react--and they are hard to find.

 

[lonestar]

Originally posted by woodychitwn
it turns out my battery was shot beyond being able to be jump started.

The jumper cables were proabably not heavy enough to carry enough current to start the car. Those 14 ga cables you get in a $19.99 roadside emergency get just won't do the job when your battery is dead.

My friend had some of those. He tried and tried to jump start a car, and nothing. Called me up and told me all he was getting was clicking, so I rode over there and saw these dinky little cables and kinda laughed. So I put on my 8 ga. cables and it fired right up.

 

[drussian409]

I had the same prob with mine. I would have the batt tested with a batt load tester. Most auto parts stores will do this for free. A battery can show a normal 12v on a multimeter but that will not tell you if it has the cranking power required to start it. Jump starting a bad battery is like pulling a dead horse up a hill. As far as testing the alt the same tool that the parts store uses should be able to tell you. You could also check with a multimeter it should be puting out about 14.4vdc