1st generation X V8 swap ???

[wingnutkev]

I've been lurking on this board for about a month now and I have been reading up on all the V8 swap post. I have a few questions for those of you who have done this. Right now my plan is to start looking for a donor in April, I'd like to find a 97-01 explorer at an insurance auction or salvage yard to use as a donor. I hope to get the 5.0 and 4R70W out of that. I have time, this project will not really be time critical. I plan on keeping it 4wd, hoping to keep the AC. I will probably install a 2" body lift to help everything fit smother. Right now my explorer is completely stock. I've had it for about 3 years and have just gone through the second transmission, that's what brought up the idea of the swap. Also I have never been satisfied with my 4.0 performance.

If you had it to do over again would you?
What kind of automotive experience and background do you have?
What kind of gas mileage are you getting?
I hope to find a 97-99 explorer to use as a donor vehicle, if I found a AWD transfer case would it be usable in my 92 X with the 4R70W tranny or would you recommend using the stock transfer case with the AA adapter?
Any concerns about the fuel system from the 92?
Did you guys sell your old engine and transmission and how much did you get for them?

I'm sure I'll come up with more questions as the project gets closer. Right now I am only in the planning stages and doing as much research as I can find.

 

[expo5.0]

i haven't done the swap, but i can answer a few of the questions to the best of my knowledge.

if you swap everything in stock you should get between 14 and 20 mpg (rough estimate but probably close enough). however, since the motor will be pulled from the other explorer i highly recommend you replace the stock exhaust manifolds with headers (it seems like everyones leak and make a ticking noise) and obviously get a custom exhaust set-up. the other thing you might not think of would be to do the baumann shift kit. its incredible! and it will both insure more fun and longer life of your project (plus make it easierr for engine upgrades later if you see fit because it will be ready)

as for the awd transfer case: its great, if you want a street truck. i'm thinking that if you are going to put the 302 in a 1st gen and do a body lift right off the bat that you will be planning on going offroad some, right? then don't keep the awd, the lack of low range was one of the original reasons i decided to make a street truck out of my current project, and it will end up bothering you for the life of yours if you keep it. besides you should be able to sell that and many other parts off of your donor x for good money. (remember to email me first when you get it and see if i want any parts... lol)

as for the fuel system from the 92 i would replace/upgrade right away. maybe the donor truck will have newer (lower mileage) parts that are in good shape, but i wouldn't count on it until you check it out. for sure though every ford i've seen has a crapped out fuel delivery system by the end of ten years (ignore this if you've already upgraded)

dont' count on getting much for your ohv 4.0, but if looks nice with good compression you may get enough to make a difference. i've seen good ones go for dirt cheap though.

btw- my automotive experience is really none. i have never had an automotive related job or anything like that. i've just worked on a few old fords mostly in the family as well as my car and a couple of jeeps.

also, fyi i get around 14 mpg with my truck currently, but as high as 16 on the highway (i know thats what you asked rather than speculation about what you would get)

hope that helps, and more knowledgeable people resond soon as well.

 

[Gofast]

My .02 worth.....

I'll give it my best shot on your questions.

1) Do it again? For me, NO! Keep in mind that mine has been a very rough road, due job layoff's, and a couple of shops that did not deliver any of the service they promissed. I did not have the benefit of some of the other swaps that our members have done either so I am kind of stuck in an almost finished mode.

If I were to start this today, I would most likely buy a 96 V8 explorer from the auction pool, high milage etc. I would then put a d44 under the front and an Atlas II behind the tranny. This combo would be around 5K cheaper than what I have now.

Again, a lot of guys here have done it cheaper, but it depends on your backgound knowledge and ability.

2) My background; Well, it's very extensive. Formal training in Automotive back when Carbs were more normal than F.I. and computers. Been building and racing for 22 yrs. Considered opening my own shop. Owned a fabrication business years ago for a non-automotive business. So I wasn't to scared with fabbing parts or finding someone to fab them. Currently a Manager at one of your favorite parts store. Don't ask me which one, I will not tell.

3) Gas Milage? Well, never worried about it in my rig, probable get around 15 mph when done.

4) I would not use the AWD, not strong enough for a lot of offroad stuff when combined with big tires. Gerald has done a lot with his 99 model, but I bet he would rather have an Atlas II.

5) The 92 fuel system should be fine for a normal 302 set-up. After you jump up to 500+ HP, then we can talk about beefing up the Fuel system.

6) Yep sold the old stuff, Got a $100 that was quickly spent on the truck.


Good luck with your research. I have not regretted my conversion, but I would definatly do it different next time.

Thanks Rob

 

[Speedfreak]

Research is definitly the best thing to do for a project of this magnatude. Don't leave one stone unturned. Now to answer your questions.

1. I would do the convertion again in a heart beat. The first conversion (93 X, 5.0L, AOD, 2WD) was a great experience and I learned alot from it. The second (my 91 X,5.0L AODW,4x4) I applied the ideas generated from the first conversion and improved the end product vastly. I still learned alot doing the second conversion and have new ideas to improve it more. I will probably be applying some of my ideas to my own truck to see if they work.

2. Now my experience varies, but I think that I have a background that is by far the best for this type of conversion. I have worked as a shop hand, a tire tech, a part person, and most importantly an autowrecker. I spent 8 years at an all Ford wrecker. I was able to apply ideas to the conversion using a core engine & tranny dropped on to a stripped X frame. I have also done 5.0L conversions in earlier Mustangs.

3. I am getting poor fuel economy at this time because I am running the wrong gears for my tire combo right now. I'm getting 12 to 13mpg average right now and about 10mpg on 4x runs. I have 3.73's and 32 inch tires. With this combo, rpms are too low, about 1300 at 50kph, when it should be closer to 1800. This is lugging the engine and causing poor economy. I plan on installing 4.56's soon, so I hope to see an increase in economy.

4. If you plan on 4x4ing, then I suggest losing the AWD case. The stock case seems to hold up nicely in my truck even with 267,000kms on it. If it is just a grocery getter then use the AWD case. There could be a problem with the front bearings as an AWD though. The front suspension was only designed for part-time use and you may find that you have more wear and high maintenence requirements in AWD.

5. If you get an X 5.0L, then the only concern is the size of the stock 4.0L pump. I put in an aftermarket 155LPH pump from the motorsport catalog (same as Mustang). The lines will connect right up to the 5.0L fuel rail. I wouldn't swap tanks, yours is plastic, while 95 and newer are metal. Your tank will never rust out, especially if you 4x4 and cant get all the dirt out when cleaning the frame.

6. My 4.0L was toast hence the conversion, but I did swap my recently beefed up and rebuilt A4LD for the custom AOD with wide ratio gear set and the AA adapter. (I payed for the adapter, but it was installed for me as part of the swap)

I hope this info helps you and feel free to ask any more questions as you think of them. With this conversion, no question is a stupid question.

Dave (Speedfreak)

 

[thornbird33]

Well i think I might be able to answer some of your questions.

I no longer have my X but am on my second 5.0HO swap into a ranger which is the same stuff as a X

I am running 3:73s and 31's w/c-4 auto turns alittle high
on the highway but I still get around 19mpg sometimes better or worse.

I would go with a mustang 91-94 5.0 bight the bullet and buy the L&L motor mounts, oil filter relocator and headers this will save alot of headaches motor mounts bolt into stock holes and locate the engine perfectly the headers fit like a dream and have never leaked (have a very thick flange where they bolt up to heads) get yourself the Advance Adapters C-4 to 1350 ranger/broncoII transfer case adapter and blast a hole through the floor for the shifter you might have to modify your drive shafts alittle but they might work the way they are too.

good luck and take your time....pay attention to detail and it will pay off.....I don't have money falling out my a$$ but I am a firm believer you get what you pay for alot of people that are trying these swaps dont realize
it aint cheap to do things right.

GOOD LUCK

 

[wingnutkev]

I do plan on keeping this mostly as a daily driver. My main focus right now is to get it up and running. My transmission blew a seal and I'm pretty sure the A4LD is toast. So it sits for now. I may decide to get it a little more off road capable in the future but as for right now I just need a reliable vehicle.

I want to go with the 5.0 and 4R70W tranny. Wasn't sure about using a control trac with low range transfer case or just keep my stock and use the adapter. I was planning on using the L&L motor mounts. I hadn't decided which headers would fit the best or how much of a difference it would make where I got them from. Most of the other conversion needs, remote oil, oil pan and transfer case adapter I was planning on getting from James Duff. If I can find a 96-00 explorer 5.0 to use as a donor I wasn't sure about the transfer case or radiator if they would fit. Other than that I'm still researching other possible donor vehicles.

Thanks for the input so far and keep it coming. I plan on getting started on this either this spring or early summer.

 

[Hotweels]

For what its worth (not much) here's my .02
If and when i do my 5.0 swap i think instead of paying $800+ for an adapter to keep the stock T-case i will be looking around for a C4-D20 combo from a EB or maybe use a ZF 5speed and D-20 with the tail shaft and gear upgrade..........i think that $800 goes along way to building driveshafts and i dont care much for the electric shift crunch box T-case the X comes with. like i said just my .02

 

[Sandy]

Since Speedfreak has spoken I will not add too much.

I have not done a complete X or Navajo swap but I have done a few Ranger/5.0 swaps and yes I would do it again...

My Navajo swap was getting close to completion when someone wanted it as is, so GONE.

Ford should have built the 5.0 into the mix when the "X" started, in the Ranger it made a whole new truck out of it.
My last Ranger is still running in Maine as we speak, it is 15 years old with the 5.0 swap at age 5, so the 5.0 can take a beating.

Mileage in the Ranger wasn’t too bad maybe 18mpg, w/3.73s and 31s, turning 3000 rpm most of the time. It got a little worse as time went on. I think I should have had 4.10s or higher numeric gears, with 33s.

My experience is as follows: Electrical Engineer working in Quality Assurance as Manufacturing Engineer, build Mustangs (10 of them) growing up, wrenched all of them myself, except for the machine work. Most turned in the low to mid 11's with a tunnel port and dual 450s, not bad for 289 ci. Built and/or helped on five Ranger/5.0 conversions, and conversed on many engine swaps.
If that is not enough - I still dabble in build-ups, my latest project is a "brand-new" Scrambler, bobbed, with (what else) a Ford Long Rod 5.0, NV4500, AtlasII, I built the engine myself, and the rest goes together as I go. 115 to 1 final low-range ratio; that equates to 0.8 mph @ 1000rpm. I can get out and take pics of the vehicle while the Jeep crawls by itself.

So now that I am done waving my own flag...

Wingnutkev,
How do you intend to do this swap without any experience? This is not a swap that should be taken on by just anyone. You need mechanical, electrical, fabrication and cooling system experience, not the backyard, do it yourself thing.

Good Luck, next to time and experience money is what you are going to need to do this right. Get help and plan all of the parts a head of time.

Don't mean to rag on you too much man but think it over, it is going to take time and effort.

Oh ya, throw out the all wheel drive.

Luck,

 

[wingnutkev]

Sandy, No offence taken.
I have some experience, not with swaps but enough engine experience that I am confident that I can get the job done. Obviously I wouldn't be quite as proficient as some who have more experience but none the less I am confident in my ability to do the swap. I will have some help and access to more experienced individuals for some things. I expect I will probably be posting here when I get stumped.

I have learned that I will be going with the advanced adapters to use my transfer case. My other idea had been to maybe use the control trac 4wd transfer case but it wont work with my front axle.

Other than that, anything anybody has to add feel free. I'm open to any kind of useful input.

 

[bigpimpin]

i have a quick ? about the price of a conversion with an earlier model explorer. I would like to know exactly how much ur looking at to have an engine with good miles like 75,000 or less pulled put into a 1st gen. explorer. Would i be better off just replacing whatever goes bad n my x with some new stuff or used to stuff in good shape, and then seeing if my engine overall will hold up with so many miles (150,000)

 

[bigpimpin]

ok...it was a lot longer than what i planned lol

 

[Arizona EX]

5.0 v-8 conversion

Hey Wingnutkev if you want good advice ask asp84. Hes done the conversion. Ive seen it and talked with him myself, hes knows his stuff. He also has an engine for sale right now out of an Ex. Got to for sale section.

 

[wingnutkev]

I have had this conversation with Al. A little while back. He was very helpful and I'm sure I'll be keeping in touch with him as my project approches.

 

[RiverRat]

If you have any questions feel free to ask. I am almost done with a swap into a 96 ranger which is similar to your X.

 

[wingnutkev]

Thanks River Rat. My project is getting closer and closer. We have just moved so finances are tight. As soon as we settle into the new house I'll be looking for the money to put this thing together. I'm looking to start this summer, either late June or early July. I'll keep you in mind.

There is so much help available on this site, I love it.

 

[HotCtyPlaya]

Couple Questions

Hey I have a couple questions i am thinking of swapping my '92 XLT to a V8 also and I was wonering

1. What does the pricing look like on a V8 right now....what kind of mileage do u expect might be on it.

2. What do you think is the largest V8 i can get into my X and not have to much of "extra" hassle.

3. What kind of HP are we talking in the V8

4. And what additions should be made to the cooling system in the truck...

5. What is a roundabout of the total price i would be looking at for this project?

 

[metalhed]

You can find v8's for anywhere from $300 to $2000+.. Just depends on how hard you look and if you get lucky enough to snag a good deal. 302 is probably the biggest you'll want to go without a major body lift and lots of custom fabrication.

Good info here:
http://www.v8-ranger.com/engine/engine.html

This one goes a little more in depth:
http://www.jamesduff.com/broncoII/v8conversion.html

Both are for rangers/broncos, but are still very similar to our rides. They give good information, and will give you a good overview on cost/labor.

<ed>

Personally I would look for an old mustang engine (94-95) with a fairly decent amount of miles (80k-120k), and then just rebuild it. That way you know exactly what you're putting into your truck. If you can get a v8 for around $400, then rebuild it for another $600-700, I think the savings outweigh the headaches of doing everything yourself.

Of course, I'd love to get a crate motor fresh off the line... Just depends on what you're willing to spend, and how eager you are to spend the next 6 months wondering how the hell you're gonna put it all together

 

[RiverRat]

Re: Couple Questions

Originally posted by HotCtyPlaya

1. ..what kind of mileage do u expect might be on it.
Around 13-16 mpg. About the same as the 4.0 it replaces.

2. What do you think is the largest V8 i can get into my X and not have to much of "extra" hassle.
The 302 is enough of a hassle to get in as it is.

3. What kind of HP are we talking in the V8
It depends. Mine will start out around 210hp and 280# of torque. It's only up from here

4. And what additions should be made to the cooling system in the truck...
There are many different choices here. I am trying to fit the factory 4.0 super radiator and use the explorer fan.

5. What is a roundabout of the total price i would be looking at for this project?
Depends. I'm around $4000 including leather seats, autometer gauges, regear, adapters, etc.

 

[RFR2212]

-Mileage? I dunno what mine will be, and don't really care.
-302 is easiest of em all simple as that
-HP-HO motors are around 220hp and around 280-300ft/lbs torque from most i've seen. I'm hoping to be around 250 hp and 325tq but those are mearly whimsical guesses for what my motor is..
-Cooling, I think there's a ranger radiator that works if not the swap ones are supposed to do a decent job
-Total? Too much... some with great connections, and skills can do it for only a few thousand dollars... im way up there 6+ grand? But then I didn't research enough, and paid for it. I've also gone orginally from injected with a manual trans to carbed with an auto tranny. I'll know more this summer once it's running.

 

[Speedfreak]

Here are some answers from my own experiences:

1. I get about 13MPG city and 18 to 20MPG highway. My personal conversion cost around $2250 canadian. I did all my own work which made it alot cheaper.

2. A 5.0L is more then enough for the X, but if you wanted you could drop a 351W in. There would be alot more expense in it if you wanted EFI though. I would say tack on another $2000 to the total bill for 351W.

3. An H.O. is 205 to 225HP and 280 to 300ft/lbs torque. My Cougar engine is probably pushing 230 to 240HP with some simple mods.

4. The only mod I made to the cooling sytem was the addition of a 16" electric fan and a 180 hi flo thermostat. The rad is stock, even the lower rad hose is 4.0L stock. To do this though you have to use the short accessory drive package available on '91 to '93 T-bird/Cougars and '94 - '95 Mustangs.

5. My total price was the 2250 figure but that was lots of planning and waiting for the good deals. I also had help with a rebuilt and well modified A4LD as a swap for the fresh built wide ratio AOD trans. (I picked up the needed 4R70W tranny core from a taxi company for free) I did a 2wd 5.0L for a friend and it ran closer to $6000. He also bought heavily from the James Duff catalog. They have great stuff, but you can find alot of it at local auto parts stores for better deals.