Auto Hub problem or Transfer Case?

[pugsy]

Still trying to get my 4x4 working. Been such a hassle and I don't know where the problem lies.
First, the shift motor is fine and engages into 4x4 and 4lo as expected. So when I put into 4x4, I hear some grinding then a clunk from the front left wheel but I don't hear anything from the right side. When I stomp on the gas on a gravel road, neither front tires spins, only the rears do. When I have it in 4x4 and drive forward a few feet to lock the hubs, I put it in neutral and got out to look to see if the front driveshafts are rotating (I looked under it while pushing the truck forward slightly), the left side driveshaft is rotating but the right side driveshaft isn't. When I took off the 4x4 and rolled it back a few feet, then neither driveshaft is rotating, as expected.
Do I have an auto hub problem or a transfer case issue? I want to know cause I don't want to think it's a hub problem and convert to manuals and still have no 4x4.
Thanks for the help!

 

[Brandons]

grinding/clicking up front would more then likely be a hub problem, same problem with mine, either grinds when the back tires are spinning, or it clicks while your driving. Wont do any harm to take the front wheel off and check out the hub, very easy.

On my old hub, left wheel. The left part is how it should be, the right was my broken parts. Keep an eye out when looking at it if you have any simmilar wear.

 

[pugsy]

I did take the hubs off and they look okay, both sides look the same. My question is, why isn't the right side drive shaft turning? Has this happend to anyone that only the right drive shaft rotates?

 

[pugsy]

Anybody seen this before? What could be the problem?

 

[Brandons]

Sorry i havent replied, missed the first reply for some reason. Its easier for it to spin the left driveshaft then the right, especially if the hub is busted. as long as the driveshaft going to the front spins when the transfer case is engaged, your problem lies at your autohubs, which as you probably know, are a bundle of fun. Theres a good chance your right autohub is fine, but your left has some damage, you did clean the grease off so you could actually see for any cracks or defects in the parts right?

Edit - When i first had a simmilar problem, I couldnt tell if the parts on the hub that remain on the spindle when it is off were good or not. I replaced the hub from a parts truck (also note here, the hub you pull off, the one piece in that could be toast as well, but you cant see unless you pull it off, which is relatively easy. Theres many parts that could go wrong in them hubs, chances are your best bet is to get manual locking hubs.

 

[pugsy]

cool..thanks for the reply. I did clean off the grease and things seem to look okay, however, I don't know what lies on the spindle is supposed to look like in working order. I just don't get why the passenger side axel doesn't rotate when engaged in 4x4 - even if the hub is broken, shouldn't the axel still spin freely? Could there be a front differential problem to transfer the power from the front driveshaft to both wheels equally? Just curious, don't know much about the 4x4 system.
Thanks!

 

[Brandons]

well, being a differential that i presume isnt limited slip? It will normally only spin the easiest side, if the right autohub is working, it may still only spin left even when moving, since it takes less force to spin a broken hub then to engage a working one.

I just remembered, try spinning the driveshaft to the front differential without it in 4x4 of course and shut off in park. If you watch the front right driveshaft it might budge for a quick second, then chances are the right side will stop, and the left might spin. If the front left spins, might take a bit to spin the driveshaft, but if the left spins in this scenario, there is definately something wrong with that hub.

Good luck.

 

[pugsy]

K...I'll give that try and see what happens. Will the autohub engage if the truck isn't moving? ie. if I turn the drive shaft while in park. I heard that both the wheel and driveshaft need to be turn to engage the auto hub? This true?

 

[Brandons]

no it is not true in the least bit . For example what if you are stuck in snow, and the back tires are spinning, yet the front wheels arent moving at all, the hubs engage if the wheels are moving or if there still.

When you turn the driveshaft with 4x4 off, (if 4x4 is on, you wont be able to turn it since the trucks in park), it should spin a little bit, then the hubs will lock, if there working. If one hub isnt working the driveshaft will spin on that side. As you say the front left makes the grinding noise, so id keep an eye on that one.

 

[cculter]

Try this I found it the best way to test for bad auto hubs. Lift all four tires off the ground, put the truck in 4x4, then put it in drive and get out. Check to see if both back tires are spinning, then see if one front tire is. Grab the drivers tire and hold it. The passenger tire should turn if not check to see if the shaft is turning, if the shaft is but not the tire....bad auto hub. If there is a lot of noise from either tire...bad auto hubs.

 

[Brandons]

Thats not near as easy as just spinning the front driveshaft... you can turn the wheels right and reach the thing. What if theres a chance the hubs will work in the air because theres less force, since the gears might not be worn down totally?

Edit - Hell i just went out and did that, both hubs still work (knock on wood haha). you can grab the ujoint when the wheels are turned left and that makes it a bit easier to rotate it.

 

[pugsy]

I did the "rotate the driveshaft" test. Had it in park with 4x4 off. The drivers side axel was spinning freely but the passenger side would kinda move a bit then stick and not spin. BUT...the passenger side axel didn't rotate before i changed the broken auto hub with one from a scrap yard. I couldnt rotate the passenger side axel by hand either - too hard - maybe something in the hub is binding up the axel and not letting it spin?? What you think?
Like I said, don't know much about how the autohubs work. The actual hubs that slide off the axels look okay (I had to replace one because the assembly inside the hub broke off from the hub and would slide out). The 3 prongs that stick up on the hub look fine. But I'm not sure what the pieces on the axel are supposed to look like, I think that's most likely my problem - anyone have pics of what it's supposed to look like (ie. what the pieces look like on the axel). Maybe I'm missing some or are broken.
If one hub is good and one is bad, would it make a difference if I switched them over to see? Or this wouldn't do anything if the problem lies on the pieces on the axel?
Thanks for the posts!!

 

[Brandons]

The passenger side driveshaft when it moved a bit then stuck, the hub just engaged there, so ignore the right side from this point forward, done.

The picture i have in the above posts, shows the good part on the left and bad on the right. These are the only parts you can pull off the axle to check, and its easy as hell to do. You do have to be carefull though since it may not feel like it wants to come off, just wiggle it and make sure you get a firm safe grip on it to pull it off.

Inside the hub theres one gear you have to worry about, and thats the one that surrounds the outside of the main gear in it. The problem can rest in the two pieces that sit on the axle (infact on sits in the other) or the one in the hub. Pay very close attention, since you seem to be working well on this, grab some papertowel and wipe down the two parts i posted pictures of. I thought mine were fine, but you cant see cracks when its covered in grease.

 

[Brandons]

I just remembered this pic, i put squigly red lines were the problems were.

I cant remember if the clip and washer have to come out to access these parts, if so its pretty damn easy so no worries. this also happens to be my left side.

 

[pugsy]

awesome...thanks man! I'll take a look and see what's going on with the parts on the axel. The hubs themselves I think are okay on both sides. Not sure when I'll get a chance to take the wheels off, but I'll let you know how it goes and ask any questions if I'm lost!

 

[Brandons]

Yeah, have yourself a very close look at them parts i had in the last pic. Left hub is the problem in your case (hub being the parts in the last pic, and the hub itself). If you take the parts off you understand very quickly why they break, there like plastic..

 

[pugsy]

Hey Brandons....had the front end of the truck up in the air this aft. and took off both front tires to check out the whole kit and kaboodle. What I found was that the autohub cam and other metal piece that sit on axel (in your pics above) are fine. No broken or worn out pieces. So I rotated the front driveshaft and still only the passenger side (right side) hub was catching. So I swapped the actual hub from the left side to the right, and low and behold, now the driver side tire was locking and unlocking as it should. So, I've proved to myself that the assembly on both axels are working right, and the problem lies in the actual hub itself. However, I looked at both hubs and they both look fine (no broken teeth, they spin okay, etc.), but the one that doesn't seem to want to catch - the inner mechanism that locks to the spindle seems a bit looser then the working one, but it doesn't fall right out or anything, and like it said, looks the same as the working one, really not much difference. The not working hub did have more grease in it then the working one but I cleaned it out with ATF but still no locking.
Nonetheless, should I just try and find another hub from a scrapyard? Or is there anything I can do to rejuvenate my old one? What do they charge for an old auto hub at a yard??
Thanks!

 

[Brandons]

well the easiest thing to check, i wish i had a picture of, but its the outermost metal piece in the hub, it can come out, but its tedius. Theres three teeth to it i think, I'll try and dig up pictures, but i work tomorrow and have to head to bed. This is probably your problem, and going to a wreckers you may be able to get an intact hub. If it costs alot though you might be best to switch to manual hubs.

 

[cculter]

I wouldn't try and fix them or find one in a scrap yard. Most yards charge $40 or more per hub. Just switch to manual and save yourself some headaches.

 

[Brandons]

$40 i didnt know they were that much lol. Ill be getting manuals next time a hub goes.