Auto Hubs working again, cross my fingers

[kdogg212001]

owell i searched and had questions!! so knowleged doesn't expire!!

 

[slim]

Hello, my brothers and sorry for the delay with my resonse my computer caught a nasty bug and had to be wiped, just got it back up about five minutes ago. Sure, I will talk hub with you what is your question. My rig has 210,000 miles and still sporting auto-hubs.

Slim

 

[kdogg212001]

my 94 xlt has 195 almost 196k and my fronts not really working the way it use to
and i used to be able to get the fronts to spin when like i had an obsticle or something but now its like only the right wheel in the front in grabbin which is basically nothing so i am stuck on whta to do or think??

 

[ol_ben]

I would be interested in performing this operation to my non working auto-hubs, I have a spare set (from '92)to play with prior to swapping out to the non-operative ones ('93).

I am not sure where these spacers woud go - is it inside the hub under the splined area?
I assume then the snap ring must be removed and the hub disassembled. is this correct?

Thanks,
Ben

 

[slim]

Yes, the hub needs to come apart. But, before anything is done take the hub off look at it face up so you are looking at the spline gear. Notice if the gear and the pot metal cam are flush, if not make a note what it would take the make it flush and that is how thick you spacer needs to be. Also, behind the pot metal cam is were the spacer goes.

So, to get to the gear out remove the snap ring and then on a piece of wood hold the hub upside down and start hitting the hub on the wood. This my take five to fifty hits depending on the force of the hits and how dirty the hubs are. Once the gear is out you can see the plastic inside that is wearing thin.

The size of the spacer should the the same as the backside of the pot metal cam and thick enough so the pot metal cam is flush with the spline gear. Also, there is no set thickness the the spacer it depends on how much the hub is worn. And, once the spacer in the plastic will continue to wear until a thicker spacer is needed. Believe it or not my hubs have a 1\4 inch of spacer in them.

Now, clean them up the best you can without getting and solvent on the bearing and lube them up with some ttransmissionfluid, does everyone know NOT to use grease. Remember to make sure when you put your hub back together to be certain you snap ring back on right or else the hub will fall apart!

good luck

slim

 

[ol_ben]

I've started working on a hub I took off a 92, left over when I put on the Warn Manual hubs.

I took the snap ring off the bearing post and turned it upside down and pounded it about 10 times and the inner gear came off and the outer piece (the cam?) and a circlip that held it to the inner gear came out as well.

I saw the plastic piece which was jammed in place. It appeared to be at an uneven level in the hub. I pulled it out breaking it in two places. What remains is a spring loaded geared piece held in place by a circular spring and three keepers or guides. The splines in this piece mate up with the splines on the inner gear. The inner gear has two sets of splines -top and bottom with a clearance space between.

I removed the circular spring holding the spring loaded gear but have not been able to proceed any further. I can push down against the spring but have been unable to get the keepers out.

I suppose my main question is have I gone to far? I am not sure if I know how to get the circular spring back on or what height to set the spring loaded gear.
Have I messed up by breaking the plastic piece? Can I make up the distance with a spacer?
The plastic piece, being jammed into place, appeared to have kept the internals from moving.

It would be nice to know the mechanical workings that engage the hub when the axle spins as the result of the transfer case being activated. Perhaps that will allow me to understand what I am trying to acheive.

None of the components appear to be broken or even worn. The only sign of improper engagement is some dinging on the lower splines of the inner gear. It appears as if the leading edges were banging against an attempt for partial engagement.

Any thoughts are appreciated.

Thanks,
-Ben

 

[slim]

Ben

Are you going to try to use them again or are you just curious about the hubs.

Yea Ben you have gone too far, you need to use a press to get the rest of that out but that is not nessesary. Also, it sounds like you did not remove the snapring before knocking the gear out. If you do not have a snapring tool you will never get the snapring back on.

Anyway, you are talking about a circular clip, are you talking about the small clip that is near the bearing or do you mean the big one that hold everything else in?

So you busted out the plastic, so you will need a pretty thick spacer. the plastic in my hubs are gone as well but disapeared slowly over time which why I had to keep adding more spacers.

So, I think you should put back together enough to see how thick your spacer needs to be and get them made up. And, if you forced the small snapring off I think you should just get a new one and the tool to get the ring on.

slim

 

[Bleys]

First of all, great site. There is one thing I wanted to add to this thread. If you can find an auto parts store that caters to large trucks and trailers, trailer break cam bushings are a perfect fit. 1 9/16" ID x 2" OD and +/- 1/16" in thickness. EUCE2411A is the part number I was given, and at a whopping 33 cents a piece far surpasses $300 for a new hub, or $150-$180 for a set of manuals.

 

[kdogg212001]

ok i have yet to tear aprt the auto hubs i have waht are these spacers before i venture into it? whatsa ahead i guess you could say??

 

[ol_ben]

Hey all,

I completely disassembled the two hubs that were left over from when I converted to manual hubs on the 92 explorer and learned how they work.

Years ago I found a few large steel washers in a parking lot and being the kind of person who saves almost everything as "it might of use someday" I still had them. They are 1/16+ inch thick and had a inner diameter about 1/4 inch smaller than the central gear in the hub and slightly larger than the outer diameter to fit inside the hub. I turned two to the proper daimeters and installed then under the cam gear. I aslo turned the face of a third washer to the thickness of the plastic piece to replace the one I broke.

I have reassemled tthe hubs and have used ATF to lubricate them ( they each had an enormous amount of grease which I cleaned out). They revolve freely by hand and are barely away from engaging.

I will install them on 93 whenever my wife will part with it - maybe this weekend. I will post results.

I took plenty of pictures but am unable to post them here.

-Ben

 

[BobK]

Slim,

Are you still around? Funny how this thread keeps coming to life. I have a couple questions about the washer thickness.

You say that the washer should be thick enough so that the pot metal cam sits high enough to be flush with the top of the inner gear, right? The inner gear has little nubs on every other tooth to prevent the pot metal cam from slipping off. Should the pot metal cam be against those nubs when the washer is in place? Or, should there be a little wiggle room?

My pot metal cams sit nearly 3/16" below the top of the inner gear and the hubs have always worked until just recently. Yet it sounds as if others have had their hubs quit working with much less wear. Do I need a washer that is 3/16" thick, or should I allow for some wiggle room and put a 1/8" washer in?

Finally, are you still selling washers?

 

[F14CRAZY]

This needs some pix. I'd like to do this, but I don't understand any of it

 

[BobK]

Here is a picture of the pot metal cam from my 97 Ranger hub. Is it supposed to have the little teeth sticking up? Or, is this the wear that we're all talking about?

Can anyone confirm by looking at theirs that this is or is not the way the cam was originally designed?

My initial thought is that I need a washer that is as thick as the little teeth are high.

As best I can tell, this cam presses up against a piece of plastic. If this truly is wear, how in the world did a piece of plastic wear a piece of aluminum down so much? And where did all the metal go? I found no metal inside the hub.

The air brake cam bushing/washer mentioned above that is supposed to be a perfect fit is a Euclid E-2411A. I found it in a kit here: http://www.newlifeparts.com/catalog/e/page25.html. Hopefully, I can buy is separately somewhere else.

 

[BobK]

Please see this post for additional pictures and discussion: http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1353302.

 

[slim]

Hello everyone, I am still around however my explorer is a bit under the weather. It has so much wrong with it I am not sure if I am going to fix it or not. However, the auto-hubs still work.

I am surprised this thread popping up I like hearing from people who are fixing there hubs.

slim

 

[Chamoru]

I can't seem to bring up the pictures to this thread.....I would like to see exactly how the washers go.....been messing with these auto hubs for 3 days...all cleaned of grease and nothing broken... (that I can see) still I can't get them to engage the 4 wheel...if I stick a piece of cardbord to make up the space between the wheel bearing nut and that plastic cam it seems to lock, making me think the thrust washers are missing...I can't find anywhere on thec cyber world where I can buy those thrust washers......I have a 1994 Explorer XLT....

 

[Torqueranger]

I can't seem to bring up the pictures to this thread.....I would like to see exactly how the washers go.....been messing with these auto hubs for 3 days...all cleaned of grease and nothing broken... (that I can see) still I can't get them to engage the 4 wheel...if I stick a piece of cardbord to make up the space between the wheel bearing nut and that plastic cam it seems to lock, making me think the thrust washers are missing...I can't find anywhere on thec cyber world where I can buy those thrust washers......I have a 1994 Explorer XLT....

Do your self a favor and find manual hubs instead of playing auto locking.. I put them on my ranger and what a world of difference and you buy them used for like $100 or so..

 

[BobK]

I lost my picture server a long time ago. I uploaded PDFs of all the threads and pictures to my Skydrive/Onedrive here: https://onedrive.live.com/?cid=D6C27C881C7BC608&id=D6C27C881C7BC608!277&sc=documents