cylinder heads

[dvo310]

So we got out from work early the day before thanksgiving. Yes, i'm starting back on thanksgiving not Christmas or New Years. I started my truck and it sounded almost like the tick tick tick when a car wont start but the engine was running. I called the shop and the guy said it could be a valve spring and sent me a tow truck. that is the last time the truck moved. It has been sitting at the shop since then. He said $300 for a new valve spring and I went home. After he tore into the engine he informed me that both cylinder heads were cracked and the price now goes to $3000. Said he did compression tests and they failed.

First is this even possible? I change my oil and I don't abuse the truck. Seems like a pretty catastrophic breakdown. Also wtf 6 weeks buddy?

 

[Galactica]

Anything is possible, but if your truck was running fine it is rather unlikely that both heads cracked and if they did, I imagine you should have coolant and oil mixed in the pan and in the radiator. I would just show up at the shop and have him show you both cylinder heads that should be off and ask him what the compression was on each cylinder. If he starts acting all offended and crap, don't be afraid to pay him for the work he's done and tow your truck somewhere else in pieces. Otherwise, if everything checks out, find a used engine for way less than that with less than 100K and put that in. It's going to take some legwork, but I would be as suspicious as you if some mechanic told me that...

 

[dvo310]

The existing heads are still on the truck but I did tell him I want to see them before he gets paid. I can stop by the shop on my way home today. If a pull the dip stick will I see coolant or would i have to drain the oil to tell? Truck was running flawlessly when i parked it. He told me the compression numbers. It was maybe 1/5th of what it should have been. I forget the actually numbers. Is it possible to start with 1 bad spring and have everything spiral out of control to end with 2 bad cylinder heads? He has the new heads sitting with my truck. I had asked him about just doing a new engine and he said it would end up being more money. Truck has 100,500 miles. I had talked to a Ford mechanic and he said that in his time he had never seen thins on an explorer.

 

[Galactica]

Sounds fishy to me. 100K is really nothing on these engines, especially the 03-up 4.0L's. It would be theoretically possible to fry both cylinder heads being as the cams are attached on both sides with the timing chains, but that is really a pretty devastating failure methinks. Still unsure what the tick tick tick would be though. Was it super loud? If the engine sounded almost like a diesel, it's possible you had an oil pump failure. The mechanic should at the very least have the valve covers off and you should be able to see some obvious damage.

 

[dvo310]

it was pretty loud, enough so that it could be heard over a cell phone. I don't think the engine tone itself changed, there was just another noise over it. Would damage be easily visible or could it be small enough so that you can't see it?

 

[Galactica]

Unsure. At least have him take the covers off and show you. If you dropped a valve spring, you should be able to see that.

 

[dvo310]

Well thanks for the help. i'll be visiting him again this afternoon. should be interesting.

 

[Galactica]

What help I could give anyway. And BTW, I can't imagine it costing 3 large to replace two cylinder heads. 3 large should get you a whole engine. The only thing I can't comment on specifically is if one can remove the cylinder heads without taking the whole engine out. You can't in an old Ford diesel, but you usually can in a gasser.

 

[dvo310]

I believe from reading other posts around here that to access the timing chain you do need to pull the engine. The mechanic said he would be pulling the engine to do this.

 

[dvo310]

so I talked with the mechanic again this afternoon. He said he has to remove both heads but only 1 is damaged. He said 3 springs and a valve are damaged. I wasn't able to see the parts today but will be able to tomorrow. He was finally moving my truck into the garage when I showed up. It sat int he same spot for 5 weeks and 1 day. awesome. I'd be playing in the snow right now if it was home. At least I only have to shovel 1 spot for now (we're supposed to have 14 inches by lunch friday. The Escape will have to do for now. at least we have the AWD V6 version which is a pretty nice ride.

 

[mustang6878]

Here is a link for a rebuilt engine for $1800. Replacing the top of an engine with 100K on it for 3G's is just not a smart thing to do. Actually, installing this engine should be cheaper since he will remove & reinstall the old one anyway.

http://engineguy.com/amfinder/

 

[Galactica]

so I talked with the mechanic again this afternoon. He said he has to remove both heads but only 1 is damaged. He said 3 springs and a valve are damaged. I wasn't able to see the parts today but will be able to tomorrow. He was finally moving my truck into the garage when I showed up. It sat int he same spot for 5 weeks and 1 day. awesome. I'd be playing in the snow right now if it was home. At least I only have to shovel 1 spot for now (we're supposed to have 14 inches by lunch friday. The Escape will have to do for now. at least we have the AWD V6 version which is a pretty nice ride.

Sounds like you may have in essence "caught him in the act". The man goes from "both cylinder heads are cracked" and "bad compression across all the cylinders", to "3 springs and a valve are damaged". And he let your rig sit for over a month. Part of it (a small part) is on you for not calling for regular updates, but that would not be acceptable to me unless he warned me beforehand that it may be that kind of time frame. My motorhome is in the shop right now because the poo tank broke free and smashed itself to bits going down the highway...(it was full too....) and the shop told me that they have a whole bunch of other rigs ahead of mine and it would likely be close to 2 months before they could get it done. For RV places though, they have the best reviews of anyone in my area, and it's winter, so it has not been an issue. Point is, they told me it would take that long. This shop sounds like a bunch of two-bit hack-jobs...

 

[dvo310]

Its not on me. I was there at least once a week. Every time I went he would say it would be done at the end of the week but come friday there was another excuse for why it had sat in the same spot. Maybe I misunderstood. The only fault I could take is being too trusting I guess. Maybe he isnt the nice guy I thought.

 

[Galactica]

Its not on me. I was there at least once a week. Every time I went he would say it would be done at the end of the week but come friday there was another excuse for why it had sat in the same spot. Maybe I misunderstood. The only fault I could take is being too trusting I guess. Maybe he isnt the nice guy I thought.

Sorry. Wasn't meaning to be rude....

 

[dvo310]

Went back this morning. It still hasnt moved. there is 1 truck in the bay and i'm next. Aparently that truck has been there longer than mine. I talked to 2 other places and its too much work for them and the place I did find would out a new (used) motor i. It would be $2500 Vs $2200 I'm looking at right now but would be a minimum of 2 weeks plus the cost of another tow. the guy who has my truck again siad it will be ready this friday. Unfortunately it seems like my best (least costly and quickest) answer. (side note. my second vehicle is having trouble and my boiler shut down this morning looks like a good new year!)

 

[dvo310]

also I didnt take you as rude, you were just saying it as u saw it.

 

[Galactica]

I have been lucky. I was a car guru from day one, and a lot of my friends are professional drivers/racers/journalists and one of my best friends owns a shop that all of our friends service their cars at. When something goes wrong, my whole family takes their vehicles there to get fixed. Yesterday when I had my GTO there for a quick oil change, there was a Lotus Elise 240S, a 335xi, 3 E46 M3's, an Evo IX, and a Z3 there. They are an awesome shop. Enthusiasts getting their cars serviced by enthusiasts (who also happen to be master mechanics. You need to try to find those kinds of people, because this guy is a tard. I would be absolutely beside myself at this point and threatening to call the BBB on him. At this point, to me, I wouldn't care if it took longer. I would pull my rig out of there and wave buh-bye at him with both fingers on my way out. He does not deserve your 2200 bucks, man! In my humble opinion that is..

 

[dvo310]

I agree, he doesn't deserve anything. I just want my truck back and this is going to be the quickest cheapest way. I'll be looking for another place to go from now on. Too bad u can recommend a place being on the opposite coast. This site should set up a section for recommended shops ( and shops not recommended)

 

[05dakotatrac]

How mechanically inclined are you? An engine swap can easily be done by the average "shade tree" mechanic in the driveway or garage. Most auto stores have the engine hoist and specialty equipment to remove and install motors otherwise a well diverse mechanics tool set is all that's needed something like a 200 piece craftsman box set would do.

 

[dvo310]

I would love to be able to do it myself but there are a few issues preventing that. First I dont have a garage it was -9 when I woke up yesterday. Today is a bit better at 19. I have done a bunch of stuff myself. I actually used to work at a place called Truck Guys which sold and installed stuff from ladder racks and tool boxes to cold air intakes and catbacks and this isnt the sort of thing they would do or help with. Now all my free time is going to renovating my house, raising twin 18 month old girls and studying fro my architectural licence exams.

During our last chat he claimed he told me 3k so if he ran into other problems and he wouldnts have to increase the price again and it should be closer to $2200 as it stands now. As much as I dont want to, I think i need to just bear with it and have him finish.

Heres a photoshop i did for all the advice
http://postimg.org/image/6d50dmu7z/

http://postimg.org/image/6d50dmu7z/