Don't buy 3rd Gen with 4.0L

[4FordFamily]

I contend that the X is a pretty reliable truck if you take care of it. I've owned some GM and Mopar vehicles and they were not so great, with the exception of a 3.8L bonneville that was a tank

 

[Tankentaisha]

I wouldn't pay anything for side steps. In my opinion they just get in the way when entering/exiting the vehicle.

Personal difference here, because I never find them to be in the way and use them all the time, especially for getting into the car top carrier.

 

[Number4]

Ditch the running boards and add a drivers side grab handle.

https://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=403806

 

[Tankentaisha]

Keep the running boards and add the handle!

 

[va2explorer]

Recently there's been several threads about members purchasing a 3rd Generation Explorer with the 4.0L SOHC V6. I'm sorry if my advice offends any existing owners but I advise against purchasing one unless the original timing chain components have been replaced. Even though the timing chain cassettes were upgraded in the 2002 and later models the rear (right) cassette guide is still not reinforced with metal on the traction side.
View attachment 83746
That means that the guide is a candidate for failure after 200K miles and many earlier 3rd Gens are exceeding that mileage. Most potential sellers have determined this and that is why they are selling before catastrophe strikes.

Replacing the rear cassette normally requires pulling the engine and accurately following a fairly sophisticated procedure. A special tool kit (OTC 6488) is normally required to retime the camshafts.
View attachment 83747

Also, around 2004 the head casting was altered making it almost essential to remove the head in order to replace the front cassette. Removing the head normally requires compressing the valve springs to remove the cam followers and requires another special tool.
View attachment 83748
Since the cassette replacement process is labor intensive it is expensive to have performed by a shop. Purchasing and installing a replacement engine from a salvage yard is less timing consuming but there is still a risk of timing chain failure in the near future if the engine isn't low mileage.

Additionally, the harmonic balancer is prone to failure.
View attachment 83749

And the thermostat housing is prone to failure.

I suggest that potential 3rd Gen buyers who are not inclined to make their own repairs shop for a vehicle with the 4.6L SOHC V8. The timing chain guides on that engine also will eventually fail but both are located in the front of the engine and can be replaced without pulling the engine.

On the other hand, if you're a good home mechanic with the ability to pull/install an engine, and are willing to learn how the V6 timing chain components are replaced and the camshafts are timed, you can purchase an early 3rd Gen with bad timing chains for around $2K. For less than another $1K you should be able to purchase the special tools and make the repairs using OEM parts.

Did you mean to say don't buy a third gen ex with a 5R55 tranny. I have 293,000 on my 03 ex, and i'm on tranny #3 . The motor is solid, and I don't give it any slack. I'll hit 5500 - 6000 rpm at least a half dozen times on my 2hr round trip commute to work everyday. I really think maintenance is a key factor to the timing chain guide issue. keep your oil changed, and if its black it's crap. Now for the 5r55 there is just no hope to make it good. I have done all the upgrades & mods that you can do, and the 5r55 is still a POS.

 

[Viper9087]

Recently there's been several threads about members purchasing a 3rd Generation Explorer with the 4.0L SOHC V6. I'm sorry if my advice offends any existing owners but I advise against purchasing one unless the original timing chain components have been replaced. Even though the timing chain cassettes were upgraded in the 2002 and later models the rear (right) cassette guide is still not reinforced with metal on the traction side.

That means that the guide is a candidate for failure after 200K miles and many earlier 3rd Gens are exceeding that mileage. Most potential sellers have determined this and that is why they are selling before catastrophe strikes.

Ya, i know it's a dead thread, but Holy trash talk!!! Read what you just said! "candidate for failure after 200K miles"
Almost every vehicle in existence is prone to failure after 200k miles.
This post is just infuriating.
Come on man... be realistic. No Car or truck lasts forever, and it's absolutely ridiculous and childish to expect that.
if you buy a 200k miles car then you should expect some major issues IE: engine or trans.
The v8 has a timing chain as well that when fails will tank the entire engine and front cover if neglected long enough, so i' don't see your point in that they are better. The ONLY real difference is that the 4.0 needs to be removed from the vehicle, which may make it challenging for home DIY guys. but otherwise there is NO difference. BOTH engines have plastic guides, BOTH can fail, and BOTH need special tools and BOTH cost the same to fix at a shop. ALSO at 200+k miles you should not be doing this repair, you should just be buying a new motor, or rebuilding the one you have, otherwise you are generally wasting your money on a short term fix.


Any vehicle that can reach 150k without issue is by definition amazing, and explorers can do that, v6 or v8, as long as they are properly maintained and not abused. After 150k you should be realistically expecting these things to go. IF you complain about the cost... well that's another issue. as time goes by, everything goes up. A crate motor for a new car is 30k, in comparison to the car costing upwards of 60k. Spending 10k worth of work on a used car and getting a new engine AND trans... means you just got an other 200k miles for 10k dollars. if you don't like it, go out and buy the 60k car and roll the dice to see how long it lasts... Ive seen MANY people need motors and trans between 30-60k miles on ther NEW car/truck with their HIGH monthly payments and Outrageous insurance costs, and taxes (if applicable).

I would gladly spend 10k on a used car because knowing that a new one costs over 1k per (est 500 payment / 500 insurance) month, my old ****box just paid for itself in 10 months and is practically free for the next 200k miles with MINIMAL insurance costs.

 

[Number4]

Ya, i know it's a dead thread, but Holy trash talk!!! Read what you just said! "candidate for failure after 200K miles"
Almost every vehicle in existence is prone to failure after 200k miles.
This post is just infuriating.
Come on man... be realistic. No Car or truck lasts forever, and it's absolutely ridiculous and childish to expect that.
if you buy a 200k miles car then you should expect some major issues IE: engine or trans.
The v8 has a timing chain as well that when fails will tank the entire engine and front cover if neglected long enough, so i' don't see your point in that they are better. The ONLY real difference is that the 4.0 needs to be removed from the vehicle, which may make it challenging for home DIY guys. but otherwise there is NO difference. BOTH engines have plastic guides, BOTH can fail, and BOTH need special tools and BOTH cost the same to fix at a shop. ALSO at 200+k miles you should not be doing this repair, you should just be buying a new motor, or rebuilding the one you have, otherwise you are generally wasting your money on a short term fix.


Any vehicle that can reach 150k without issue is by definition amazing, and explorers can do that, v6 or v8, as long as they are properly maintained and not abused. After 150k you should be realistically expecting these things to go. IF you complain about the cost... well that's another issue. as time goes by, everything goes up. A crate motor for a new car is 30k, in comparison to the car costing upwards of 60k. Spending 10k worth of work on a used car and getting a new engine AND trans... means you just got an other 200k miles for 10k dollars. if you don't like it, go out and buy the 60k car and roll the dice to see how long it lasts... Ive seen MANY people need motors and trans between 30-60k miles on ther NEW car/truck with their HIGH monthly payments and Outrageous insurance costs, and taxes (if applicable).

I would gladly spend 10k on a used car because knowing that a new one costs over 1k per (est 500 payment / 500 insurance) month, my old ****box just paid for itself in 10 months and is practically free for the next 200k miles with MINIMAL insurance costs.

This is mildly inappropriate. I get it, but you’re ignoring some basic facts.
1. The 4.0 timing can and WILL fail at as little as 100k miles. The kicker, there may be zero warning.
2. Any reputable shop will charge you $3,500 to do the repair without the catastrophic failure.
3. The 4.6l will ALWAYS give signs of failure. AND you can ignore those signs for thousands of miles before total failure.
4. The 4.6l can be repaired by an amateur with only a crank holding tool WITH the engine in the car. (Renting tools)
So @2000StreetRod is due an apology. Especially with his extensive knowledge on the 4.0 which has benefitted many many people on this forum.

I don’t judge you for your opinion, but come in a little less strong next time.

 

[94Eddie]

Plus, there is a 1-2 punch that comes with most 4.0L SOHC engines which is the 5R55 transmissions. There are good odds that one will spend nearly $6k in transmission and timing chain repairs before 200k miles if they can't do the repairs themselves. I tell people I know to avoid this engine/transmission combination like the plague.

 

[Donystoy]

This is mildly inappropriate. I get it, but you’re ignoring some basic facts.
1. The 4.0 timing can and WILL fail at as little as 100k miles. The kicker, there may be zero warning.
2. Any reputable shop will charge you $3,500 to do the repair without the catastrophic failure.
3. The 4.6l will ALWAYS give signs of failure. AND you can ignore those signs for thousands of miles before total failure.
4. The 4.6l can be repaired by an amateur with only a crank holding tool WITH the engine in the car. (Renting tools)
So @2000StreetRod is due an apology. Especially with his extensive knowledge on the 4.0 which has benefitted many many people on this forum.

I don’t judge you for your opinion, but come in a little less strong next time.

I agree, These forums are meant for friendly assistance in helping other members that have varying degrees of expertise.
The 4 liter engine certainly had more issues than the 4.6 which I was already aware of in 2005 when I purchased my 2002 with 75000 klms on it. Any plastic component is subject to degradation from heat and age and I wonder why Ford would use this material in these guides in the first place. My 2002 (4.6) that I sold last summer had almost 195,000 klms (120,000 miles) and could have easily have gone many more I am sure without any issues. Having said that, it was always properly maintained with oil changes (semi synthetic) every 5000 kilometers (3000 miles). Also the body was always oiled and in perfect condition. The power train never gave me any major mechanical issues either but I also did earlier than recommended fluid changes. I find that lots of folks complain about how many problems that they have had with a certain vehicle but under scrutiny find that they only did repairs after they were stuck on the side of the road.

 

[Reklaw]

All Right, since this thread was rehashed and I have an '04 V6 with 211k on it and I have already spent the money on a rebuilt transmission and for living in Pennsylvania it has very little rust, what would you guys recommend I do? From the time I have owned this Ex I have been a member of this forum and never noticed anyone talking about this issue before. If I'm reading everything correct there are no warning signs for this and of course, now I'm paranoid as I am single and this is my only vehicle. Do I get an estimate and save for the fix as soon as possible or should I just bee looking for another vehicle?

 

[boominXplorer]

All Right, since this thread was rehashed and I have an '04 V6 with 211k on it and I have already spent the money on a rebuilt transmission and for living in Pennsylvania it has very little rust, what would you guys recommend I do? From the time I have owned this Ex I have been a member of this forum and never noticed anyone talking about this issue before. If I'm reading everything correct there are no warning signs for this and of course, now I'm paranoid as I am single and this is my only vehicle. Do I get an estimate and save for the fix as soon as possible or should I just bee looking for another vehicle?

Keep driving it like normal and save some money just incase. Ive seen 250k on original stuff before still look good. Maintenance is key. You start hearing a noise that sounds like a screwdriver hitting a bike chain and other people at red lights start to look at you its time to lift up that mattress and fix er.

 

[Viper9087]

Smh... didn't know that opinions were considered inappropriate.

Good to know

 

[Reklaw]

Keep driving it like normal and save some money just incase. Ive seen 250k on original stuff before still look good. Maintenance is key. You start hearing a noise that sounds like a screwdriver hitting a bike chain and other people at red lights start to look at you its time to lift up that mattress and fix er.

Thanks Boomin. I was afraid of that because I think I've been hearing that type of sound for awhile but I still haven't listened good for outside the vehicle. I'm also kicking myself now because I saw a V8 a few weeks ago at a good price and I didn't call about.

 

[Number4]

Smh... didn't know that opinions were considered inappropriate.

Good to know

Opinions are fine. Of course everyone has one and they all stink right? My issue with the post was the tone, it was disrespectful and added no value to the topic. The same conversation could’ve been had with different words and it wouldn’t of been disrespectful. Especially consider the person that was being talked about and how beneficial they’ve been to people on this forum.

 

[boominXplorer]

Thanks Boomin. I was afraid of that because I think I've been hearing that type of sound for awhile but I still haven't listened good for outside the vehicle. I'm also kicking myself now because I saw a V8 a few weeks ago at a good price and I didn't call about.

Then your back to an unknown on that transmission history. Unfortunately the v6 timing chain repair isn't but so much cheaper then doing a remanufactured engine if your going to actual repair shop. If you can do the labor yourself that's a different story.

 

[94Eddie]

Thanks Boomin. I was afraid of that because I think I've been hearing that type of sound for awhile but I still haven't listened good for outside the vehicle. I'm also kicking myself now because I saw a V8 a few weeks ago at a good price and I didn't call about.

If you are going for a V8 then I suggest making it a 4th gen model. The reason is the transmission the V8s are mated with. It is a 6R60 (2006-2008 models) or a 6R80 (2009-2010 models) in the 4th gens. These transmissions are extremely reliable when maintained properly by dropping the pan, replacing the filter and refilling every 40k miles. Since a 3rd gen V8 still has the 5R55 transmission, you could be paying for a replacement transmission sooner than you would want. Also, the 4.6L 3V V8s in the 4th gens have quite a bit more power and gets better gas mileage than the 3rd gen V8s.

 

[2000StreetRod]

Frequently, there are warning signs: cold start rattle. If you're not using synthetic oil it takes longer for the tensioner to pressurize allowing slack in the chain. Or the upper part of the cassette guide positioner could be broken as shown below.

If the lower part of the cassette guide breaks then the chain could easily slip causing valve damage as shown below with the dings in the pistons when they collided with the valves.

I was lucky because my guide assembly was demolished but my timing chain did not slip and I had no dings or valve damage. If you have cold start rattle its time to pull the valve cover and inspect the cassette guide assembly.

 

[Reklaw]

If you are going for a V8 then I suggest making it a 4th gen model. The reason is the transmission the V8s are mated with. It is a 6R60 (2006-2008 models) or a 6R80 (2009-2010 models) in the 4th gens. These transmissions are extremely reliable when maintained properly by dropping the pan, replacing the filter and refilling every 40k miles. Since a 3rd gen V8 still has the 5R55 transmission, you could be paying for a replacement transmission sooner than you would want. Also, the 4.6L 3V V8s in the 4th gens have quite a bit more power and gets better gas mileage than the 3rd gen V8s.

Eddie, Thanks for this info also. I do tow a pop-up camper so it definitely would be nice to have more power with better mileage. I did get my Ex with 92k on it so I definitely put the miles on it. Also, if I would need another 5R55 transmission I think I would do it myself this time. That was probably the only thing in the past 20 years that I've paid a shop to do. We had a first gen Escape before I got the Explorer and I'm so used to working on them that I'm almost definitely going to look exclusively for a used Ford. I just need to check on the F150 forums for things to look for with those as I have no experience in the pickup area.

 

[Reklaw]

Frequently, there are warning signs: cold start rattle. If you're not using synthetic oil it takes longer for the tensioner to pressurize allowing slack in the chain. Or the upper part of the cassette guide positioner could be broken as shown below.
View attachment 329399

If the lower part of the cassette guide breaks then the chain could easily slip causing valve damage as shown below with the dings in the pistons when they collided with the valves.
View attachment 329403
I was lucky because my guide assembly was demolished but my timing chain did not slip and I had no dings or valve damage. If you have cold start rattle its time to pull the valve cover and inspect the cassette guide assembly.

I have been running Amsoil signature series pretty much exclusively since I got my explorer back in 2014. I haven't noticed a start up rattle but i'll have to pay attention to that. I know for the longest time you could hear the belt tensioner "clicking" at idle and I don't think that is the sound I'm hear now. And of course the sound i'm hearing now is intermittent so it's even more of a pain.

 

[94Eddie]

Eddie, Thanks for this info also. I do tow a pop-up camper so it definitely would be nice to have more power with better mileage. I did get my Ex with 92k on it so I definitely put the miles on it. Also, if I would need another 5R55 transmission I think I would do it myself this time. That was probably the only thing in the past 20 years that I've paid a shop to do. We had a first gen Escape before I got the Explorer and I'm so used to working on them that I'm almost definitely going to look exclusively for a used Ford. I just need to check on the F150 forums for things to look for with those as I have no experience in the pickup area.

One of the bigger issues for the pre 2011 F150s is the 5.4L 3V engines. They have a lot of issues with cam phasers, inadequate factory oil pumps and timing chain/guide issues from lack of inadequate oil pressure and/or flow. If you replace the oil pump cam phasers, chains/guides with more robust parts then the 5.4L 3V is a good engine. There is a robust market for rebuilt 5.4L 3V engines due to oil system related failures. If you can get a F150 with a blown 5.4L 3V engine cheap enough to cover installing a rebuilt engine then this is a viable option for these trucks.