dumb move

[5.0]

On a 97, there is one... The 97 V-8s have them, possibly the V-6s too. Apparently they did away with them for 98 as best I can tell.



It appears that all the primary solenoid on the firewall does is trigger the secondary solenoid on the starter. If you look at the wiring diagrams for the starting system, it shows two leads coming from the battery: One runs to the starter, and one leads to the relay on the firewall, then to the starter. I've never understood why Ford did that on so many of their vehicles in the 80s and 90s... My best guess is that the current draw of the solenoid on the starter itself was pretty high, but I have absolutely no idea why they're like that. I just know that they are/were for whatever reason.

On the original poster's 99, however, there is no solenoid on the firewall. It's strictly the one on the starter. With no relay between the starter and battery, he should be able to connect a pair of jumper cables, juice the system, and then somehow hit a door lock button or, in my case, use the keyless entry door pad to open the doors.

-Joe

Ah, I see, thanks Joe.

 

[gijoecam]

push past the weather stripping and get straight to the positive side of the battery. connect the negative accordingly. you guys didn't know this?

Lifting the cowl at the base of the windshield leaves you about 4 feet from the battery... Not sure how helpful that would be...

Umm, if by 'cowl' you mean 'hood', the battery is located in the front right hand corner of the engine compartment. Lifting that corner of the hood without simply using the hood release would undoubtedly result in a mangled hood. If he could use the hood release (which is located inside the truck) he wouldn't have a problem in the first place.

The problem is that the battery is dead, the doors are locked, and the keys are in the ignition. I suggested using a pair of jumper cables to provide power to the battery, then opening the vehicle using either using the keyless entry pad on the door (which I'd use) or gently prying the rear window open and somehow hitting the unlock button for the power door locks.

edit: Forgot to add, the positive terminal is also covered with a plastic cover. You'd need to get a hand up in there first to pop the cover off the terminal (assuming, of course there is clearance to do so), then somehow shove a jumper cable end up in there and clip it to the battery... working blind, of course...

Or, one could easily lay underneath it, see the starter cable, and clip it there. No fuss, no muss, no prying the hood open either.

 

[Donner]

4 feet is the distance from the stretched out hanger that would touch the pos side. It's not that difficult.

 

[99stocksport]

thanks for all ideas yall. i think imma try the starter idea. and if that doesnt work imma find a way to get that hood open.

thanks again

 

[gijoecam]

4 feet is the distance from the stretched out hanger that would touch the pos side. It's not that difficult.

...In the hopes it doesn't ground against anything in that length?? Have you ever tried that?

The starter's right out in the open... sure it means laying underneath it, but assuming it's not buried up to the frame in mud, seems to me it would be much easier to clip it to the starter. To each his own, I guess...

 

[ThePhoenix]

cant ya just go buy a slim jim?

 

[best X]

cant ya just go buy a slim jim?

yeah i deffinetly thought those were illegal to buy...but ive been wrong once before

 

[Donner]

This question was asked before...

...In the hopes it doesn't ground against anything in that length?? Have you ever tried that?

The starter's right out in the open... sure it means laying underneath it, but assuming it's not buried up to the frame in mud, seems to me it would be much easier to clip it to the starter. To each his own, I guess...

Not long ago a poster asked the same question. My response was that at the risk of electrocution or damage to the vehicle, don't try this yourself, call a lock smith. That's the same response I wish this poster would take - call a pro to get the door open rather than try something risky.

As for me, I will not say what I have done, but the power can be restored w/o lifting the hood.

 

[Donner]

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=211158&highlight=electrocuted

Just call for help...

 

[TheJackal]

yeah i deffinetly thought those were illegal to buy...but ive been wrong once before

Not illegal... but not something you're going to just pick up at a Wal-Mart or the corner store either... :

 

[Donner]

Man, call somebody...

thanks for all ideas yall. i think imma try the starter idea. and if that doesnt work imma find a way to get that hood open.

thanks again

If you luck out, you won't do any damage to your vehicle or yourself. Call somebody.

 

[Essex4x4]

Well not being a locksmith or ever having broke into a car my advice here is limited, but here it goes. First what you need to do is find your self a small rock or a hammer. Then Locate a window on the Explorer, hit it sharply. Unlock door. <<<< Just kidding, do you have anything like AAA or know somebody who has it?

 

[gijoecam]

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=211158&highlight=electrocuted

Just call for help...

In his case, connecting a jumper cable to the starter terminal would have restored power to that vehicle too, and the key fob would have worked again. The other issue is that, due to lack of use, his door lock didn't work. A shot of WD-40 may have been enough to free up the tumbler.

Not illegal... but not something you're going to just pick up at a Wal-Mart or the corner store either... :

My local CarQuest carries them for around $12, IIRC. A coat hanger works almost as well most of the time.

If you luck out, you won't do any damage to your vehicle or yourself. Call somebody.

What damage can be done by connecting a pair of jumper cables to the truck? You're acting as though everyone here is completely mechanically inept. People safely and successfully use jumper cables all the time without any dire consequences. Hell, the people that work for AAA do it all the time too... why can't we?

 

[daffy]

I would just have gotten a pig-tail to hook up a 2 amp slow charger to my trailer wiring, and back-fed the distribution block. It would give enough juice to work the door solenoids.

And if left long enough, it would charge the battery too.

No muss, no fuss, no crawling under.

Even if he hasn't got a trailer plug, the wiring is just hanging up there above the frame rail.

Also, IMHO hooking a jumper cable to the starter lug is asking for trouble...way too much potential to touch a ground source down there and make big sparks.

 

[Donner]

Out of context...

In his case, connecting a jumper cable to the starter terminal would have restored power to that vehicle too, and the key fob would have worked again. The other issue is that, due to lack of use, his door lock didn't work. A shot of WD-40 may have been enough to free up the tumbler.



My local CarQuest carries them for around $12, IIRC. A coat hanger works almost as well most of the time.




What damage can be done by connecting a pair of jumper cables to the truck? You're acting as though everyone here is completely mechanically inept. People safely and successfully use jumper cables all the time without any dire consequences. Hell, the people that work for AAA do it all the time too... why can't we?

You took my advice to the poster out of context, and suggest that I say inept and so on and so on - Fact is that poster should just call for help. End. I don't mean to insult the poster, but when people lock their keys in the car, it's best to call for help - I never implied anyone was or is inept. There are people that have done damage to their vehicles, and injured themselves trying to get in to their car using these methods. Pay somebody $25-$50 and get into your car. This is just drama... some of us can break into cars, some can't. Those who try should read your disclaimer before continuing.

 

[gijoecam]

I would just have gotten a pig-tail to hook up a 2 amp slow charger to my trailer wiring, and back-fed the distribution block. It would give enough juice to work the door solenoids.

And if left long enough, it would charge the battery too.

No muss, no fuss, no crawling under.

Except that the trailer light circuits only have power when the truck's lights are turned on. The trailer brake, signal, and parking lights are all triggered by relays, and with the truck's battery dead, there's no connection back to the battery, so that wouldn't work unless the lights were left on and if the relays aren't normally open (which they are).
Even if he hasn't got a trailer plug, the wiring is just hanging up there above the frame rail.

Also, IMHO hooking a jumper cable to the starter lug is asking for trouble...way too much potential to touch a ground source down there and make big sparks.

More of an issue than, oh, say, jump-starting a dead battery with the hood open??? How? If you're connecting the jumper cables properly, the cables are DEAD when you connect it to the dead vehicle's battery or, in this case, the starter cable. There's no chance of anything sparking or grounding out.

You took my advice to the poster out of context, and suggest that I say inept and so on and so on - Fact is that poster should just call for help. End. I don't mean to insult the poster, but when people lock their keys in the car, it's best to call for help - I never implied anyone was or is inept.

Then why does he need to call for help? He did ask for help: HERE.

There are people that have done damage to their vehicles, and injured themselves trying to get in to their car using these methods. Pay somebody $25-$50 and get into your car. This is just drama... some of us can break into cars, some can't. Those who try should read your disclaimer before continuing.

He is appealing to US for help, and that's what I'm trying to do. That's why this board exists. Rick started working on his truck and discovered he needed the knowledge of others to help him get out of his pickle. The original poster is in the same boat as I'm sure Rick was back in the day.

If the original poster is anything like me, why in God's green Earth would someone pay $50 when 5 minutes and a set of jumper cables will accomplish the same thing? (not sure where you live, but around here, try $120 for an on-site call and an hour's worth of labor) I'm sure he's well-aware he could call a locksmith, but he chose to ask us if there might be an alternative: There IS. It's simple, poses no more risk than jump-starting a dead battery, and only requires that he get ever-so-slightly dirty laying underneath it. If he thinks he's capable of doing it, great. Go for it. If not, he can still call a locksmith or AAA.

 

[Donner]

Never have I called anyone inept or implied that they were. As the poster stated, Originally Posted by 99stocksport - thanks for all ideas yall. i think imma try the starter idea. and if that doesnt work imma find a way to get that hood open.

thanks again

Just because someone asks for help doesn't mean they shouldn't be referred to another party. And for me, if someone is trying to break into a vehicle, I have to assume it might not be theirs - from the sound of the poster's approach, his risk of injury or damage was high.

 

[gijoecam]

Just because someone asks for help doesn't mean they shouldn't be referred to another party. And for me, if someone is trying to break into a vehicle, I have to assume it might not be theirs - from the sound of the poster's approach, his risk of injury or damage was high.

Why would you assume that? He's been a member of this board for nearly three and a half years... Seems like an awful long time to pre-meditate breaking into a vehicle that has a dead battery and the keys in the ignition before asking for help. If he was truly trying to break into a vehicle for nefarious reasons (a vehicle that's remarkably similar to the one in his avatar he claims as his own), a brick would have been just as effective a long time ago.

Have a little faith in people...

I offered a solution that will work to get him out of his bind. Your coat-hanger idea, while good in theory, seemed a whole lot more dangerous in practice. (A 4-foot exposed conductor blindly snaked through the engine compartment versus an insulated jumper cable on a battery cable... hmmmm... Tough choice...) It seemed a lot less likely to cause a problem than shoving a coat hanger down from the cowl to touch the battery post (which is covered by a plastic snap-down cover, by the way...)

I'm still unclear on what exactly I took out of context? You posted a link to a thread where someone had done something similar, but it was not the same issue. That poster had the hood open and was replacing the alternator when the battery died. Simply hooking up a pair of jumper cables to the battery was all he needed to do. (just like AAA does thousands of times a day without calling a locksmith... not that a locksmith would have been able to help get the truck running again anyways... he'd just tell you to call AAA)

 

[Donner]

Again, in this case, like the other, to avoid injury or damage, just call someone. I did not assume this poster was a thief.

The coat hanger was not an idea, it was just saying that the distance between the battery is short - it's less than 4 feet.

I would rather see someone, if they can, spend the $$$ to get their vehicle functioning in issues like these. Tinkering with a battery is potentialyl hazardous to the person and the vehicle.

And please stop putting words in my mouth - that first paragraph is completely out of context with what I said. I use a generality, you accuse me of a direct accusation... You've done that 3 times...

 

[gijoecam]

And please stop putting words in my mouth - that first paragraph is completely out of context with what I said. I use a generality, you accuse me of a direct accusation... You've done that 3 times...

Again, in this case, like the other, to avoid injury or damage, just call someone. I did not assume this poster was a thief.

I have not accused you of anything. You said it yourself:

if someone is trying to break into a vehicle, I have to assume it might not be theirs

__________________________________________________________

You took my advice to the poster out of context, and suggest that I say inept and so on and so on - Fact is that poster should just call for help. End. I don't mean to insult the poster, but when people lock their keys in the car, it's best to call for help - I never implied anyone was or is inept. There are people that have done damage to their vehicles, and injured themselves trying to get in to their car using these methods. Pay somebody $25-$50 and get into your car. This is just drama... some of us can break into cars, some can't. Those who try should read your disclaimer before continuing.

I never said that you called him inept. I stated my opinion on your comments; that you're acting like he and the rest of us here are mechanically inept. That's my opinion of your 'general' statement and I'm entitled to it. I and others on this board treat him as though he is trying to work his way out of the pickle he got himself into and nothing more. Please re-read what I wrote. I never accused you of anything, nor did I take anything out of context. In fact, I repeatedly quoted your written words exactly.

You're acting as though everyone here is completely mechanically inept. People safely and successfully use jumper cables all the time without any dire consequences. Hell, the people that work for AAA do it all the time too... why can't we?

___________________________________________________________

The coat hanger was not an idea, it was just saying that the distance between the battery is short - it's less than 4 feet.

Reeeally... Hmmm.... He asks how he can break into his vehicle, and you reply with:

Why not just lift the cowl?

and when I questioned it, you wrote,

push past the weather stripping and get straight to the positive side of the battery. connect the negative accordingly. you guys didn't know this?

and when I questioned it the second time, you wrote,

4 feet is the distance from the stretched out hanger that would touch the pos side. It's not that difficult.

I would rather see someone, if they can, spend the $$$ to get their vehicle functioning in issues like these. Tinkering with a battery is potentialyl hazardous to the person and the vehicle.

Spoken like a locksmith who doesn't want to help this guy out of a bind. Everyone needs to call a locksmith to get into their locked car.... just like everyone needs to take their vehicle to the dealership to have new keys programmed into the system, right?