Electrical scares me, i think i got this... can someone confirm?

[dersch6221992]

i have no clue what a maxi or atc fuse is lol i just know fuse

but thanks for the help i think i can handle this project now it will hopefully come underway march or april when it gets warmer out so stay tuned for pics and lots more questions thanks a ton you and Dano were great!

 

[dersch6221992]

I don't think 8ga would be enough.
Now here's a pic of my fuse and relay box I made when I redid my wiring a couple months ago.

Check post 421 of my registry to see more of it.

just for basic knowledge what is that bottom right slots and looks like turn signal flasher module??? for?

 

[willindsay]

just for basic knowledge what is that bottom right slots and looks like turn signal flasher module??? for?

Those are spots for extra relays. Those relay blocks were hard to find but I think I got them from Waytec.

 

[dersch6221992]

Those are spots for extra relays. Those relay blocks were hard to find but I think I got them from Waytec.

i have no clue how to wire those so im not worried simple is good for me. how do you have your box mounted though?

 

[willindsay]

Wiring them is simple you just crimp (I also soldered) on a special 1/4inch female connector them pus it into the slot. They make things alot cleaner and when a relay goes I just pull it an place another one in its spot instead of having to remember which wire went to which pin.

Here's a few pics of my box mounted.

I placed all the components in a project box from RadioShack.

 

[Dano!]

Here is where i am at with my wiring. i had to make three harnesses and rout everything through a cannon plug going through my roof, pictures of that are in my build thread on my sig.

as you can see i am just starting to get everything finalized, all my relays will be inside there too. i just dont have alot of room to work with so its pretty slow going.

 

[dersch6221992]

where does the fuse panel ground out? what are the red and black wires coming in from the left? what are the white wires? sorry all the questions.

 

[Dano!]

Well you can see the big red wire connected already. On the other side there is a big black wire that goes back to the battery its not connected yet.

The red and black wires on the left are for the lights on the grill guard. The colorful wires on the top right are for my switches (5 total 2 lights per switch)

The white wires are aircraft grade 12g wire that power my roof rack lights. I happened to have the opportunity to get 300ft for cheap the difference between that wire and normal wire is the shielding on the wire isn't plastic. It wont make much of a difference and not too special.

 

[dersch6221992]

Well you can see the big red wire connected already. On the other side there is a big black wire that goes back to the battery its not connected yet.

The red and black wires on the left are for the lights on the grill guard. The colorful wires on the top right are for my switches (5 total 2 lights per switch)

The white wires are aircraft grade 12g wire that power my roof rack lights. I happened to have the opportunity to get 300ft for cheap the difference between that wire and normal wire is the shielding on the wire isn't plastic. It wont make much of a difference and not too special.

okay cool so basically all that you have left to "wire" is the wire from the 85 pin that goes from relay to the brights wire or the parking lamp wire?

 

[dersch6221992]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Car-Auto-12...0166?pt=US_Relays_Sensors&hash=item43ad583db6 so this is a relay socket... would this be worth getting to clean it up a little bit? or is it just as easy to use the little connectors. this seems like it could be more secure.

also what is the real difference between the 4 pin and 5 pin relays? i saw a pack of 20 5 pin relays on ebay for $20 bucks shipped with the sockets!!! but idk how to wire a 5 pin, could i just not wire the 5th pin would that still work the circuit or no?

 

[Dano!]

My set up will be controlled by my switches, where for you, you want your lights to turn when you turn on your high beams. The way you want to wire it you don't need switches (which isn't bad is like auto lights), the way i am wiring, i turn them on with switches (manual lights)

Just take some time and think about how you want to use your lights, only off road? Do you live in an area where there are unlit highways/back roads where you need extra lights?

Your issue might come up on highways where you need your high beams but can't legally use them because it would blind oncoming traffic.

But if the lights are just for off road use then the concept behind your wiring will work.

 

[Dano!]

OK, the relay socket you linked wont work because the wiring comming out of it is 17g, you will need 12g.

The difference between the two relays is hard to explain.

4 pin relay,
Power comes in and the activation of your high beams creates a 1 way bridge in the relay to route power to your lights.

5 pin relay
Same as a 4 pin relay but when your high beams are off a new bridge is created and the opportunity to power something else is available. Its an option for more complex wiring.

You can use either relay just don't wire the 5th pin and its the same as the 4 pin relay.

So if you bought the 5 pin relays with sockets for them, the 5th pin will be shielded by the socket and you don't need to worry about shorting anything.

 

[dersch6221992]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-pcs-12-V...3129?pt=US_Relays_Sensors&hash=item588e28afa9 okay so this deal is tempting... but its only 14/16 gauage wire 6" long. if i had 2 lights wired per relay so 16.66 amps. would the 16ga (im assuming this is going to be the 85/86 pin for grounding and going to the parking lamps/ brights) and the 14gauge be enough in the short distance if i soldered/ crimped 12 gauge wire onto the end of that? or should i find some more higher gauge wired ones?

edit: according to wire gauges in a short distance the 14/16 gauge wire should be able to handle 20 amps fine. in 3 foot or less 16 gauge can handle 50 amps!

so eventually i may go this route

 

[Dano!]

Although its true that within 3 ft it can handle. 50 amps,

You need to measure the whole length.

For me its from my fuse block -> relay -> lights -> and back to ground. For me that's like 30ft.

 

[dersch6221992]

well what i figured i would do would be a positive 12 guage from light bar to the 6" piece of 14 gauage wire on the relay. and the relay to the fuse panel and then the fuse panel would use the 4 gauge to the battery. and i would just run a sepreate negative 12 gauge to the fusepanel and ground it out.

the postive and negative shouldnt be much more then 20 feet 25 max. and the 2 100w lights put out 17 amps max.

from what i have gathered looking at a couple different fire charts.
12 gauge- 18 amps at 25 feet
14 gauge- 18 amps at 15-20 feet

so i could almost just run 14 gauge but for the long distance i will do the 12 gauge and just run it to the 14 gauge and i should be fine. plus the relay is a 40 amp relay... does that matter or is that way to big of a relay?

ive decided since im sure many other people have these questions i want to do my first ever how to thread on this. i feel like me and you put a LOT of great information together here. and i could do a nice how to on wiring a fuse box. and then running offroad lights to parking lamps. and running offroad lights to the high beams. what you think?

 

[willindsay]

I'd stick with 12ga for everything accept the relay trigger wires. Splicing the 12 to the 14ga will create a weak point where water can get in. And Like I said I always go one size larger on the wire than I need to be safe.

As far as the relay's go 30/40amp is the standard size so they'll be fine. Dano already covered the 4an5 pin relays.

For relay holders I'd deff use them makes things alot cleaner and easier to work on later.
I'd make my own from this from Del City.
http://www.delcity.net/store/5-Pin-Molded-Relay-Socket/p_790144

I prefer these as they have a mounting tab.
This+This= Relay socket with mounting point

 

[willindsay]

Another thing to think about how are you going to splice your wires?

But connectors or Solder?

I strongly suggest Soldering and then double walled heat shrink. It will make a strong connection and keep moisture out.

 

[dustinjorge]

fwiw regarding 5 pin relays.. If your only using 4 pins it's actually a good idea to wire them backwards, power to 87 and light+ from 30. The reason being that then there is no hot pin when the relay is not switched. If you put hot on 30 and light+ to 87, then 87a will be hot when the relay isn't switched. So you need to shield it yourself.

Also, pins 86 and 85 are reversible, that is, it doesn't matter what direction you hook them up. Light Gage wire (18ga) is fine for both switch and switch ground 86,85 as the relay coil only pulls ~.125 amps at 12vdc.

I jumped my brights from down by the bulb, it was the easiest place. I don't remember what color the wire is but I just pulled the bulb and checked the leads with a multimeter to see which was hot with brights.

 

[dustinjorge]

Hey also, for your connections solder is your best bet. I usually use bare butt connectors, tin both wires, then crimp and solder for > 16ga and for light gauge tin then hook and twist then solder the joint. Dab on some liquid electrical tape before sliding self sealing shrink over the joint and shrinking. I then tightly wrap with silicone self sealing rescue tape.

On that note, I can't say enough good things about this stuff. Get it in the plumbing section at the hardware store... fuses to itself instantly, watertight, stretches tight, insulates up to 8000 volts, and will withstand 500°F, and it's only $10 a roll. A roll goes a long way too since you stretch it.

http://www.rescuetape.com/

 

[dersch6221992]

thanks everyone. i think i may look into getting my own relay socket then so i can wire up the 12gauge on the 30/ 87 and i can do 18 on the 86/85

Thanks guys! like i said should move forward on this in march or april if it warms up