Important - need oppinions ASAP

[Jester966]

I need to make a decision about purchasing the 2004 V8 XLT that I refered to in this thread: http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=239497

As I described in the previous thread, the truck is exactly what I want except that there is an issue with shifting into reverse. While in a complete stop, I shift into reverse and there is a small "clunk" right after shifting, while still stopped.

So I made an offer on the condition that the problem is repaired, and they accepted. Today I have been back and forth trying to find out what is going on and if it will be repaired, and finally tonight I received an e-mail from the salesman telling me that both he and a technician did "extensive" testing today and came to the conclusion that there is no problem, and that the cause is simply because the V8 has more power than a V6! He is trying to convince me that I was not coming to a complete stop before shifting, even though when I test drove the vehicle with him, I demonstrated the problem to him several times while completely stopped, and he agreed that it was in fact an issue.

As I told the salesman in my reply to his e-mail, I find it very hard to believe that a FORD DEALERSHIP is unable to diagnose this problem. I had assumed that it was something simple like the u-joints needing to be repacked, but he is no longer admitting that there is even a problem! I would just walk away but I really like the truck and it is the only one that I have found so far with exact colour and options that I want. And the price seems reasonable, too.

So I am hoping to get some oppinions here as soon as possible. I was expecting to be picking the truck up on Thursday, and he is also now telling me that there is another person wanting to buy it (I don't know if that is true or not)! I had driven another V8 explorer (the limited that I also posted about) for a full 24hrs only a week earlier, and did not notice this problem at all. So is there any merit to what he is trying to convince me? I find it hard to believe, but I am by no means a mechanic. Can anyone offer any ideas as to what the problem may actually be, or if there even is one?

Thanks in advance...

 

[IZwack]

It might be the rear differential - a common problem in the third generation Explorers.

But when buying a car, if you have any doubts, walk away - it is just a car after all (as in its not marraige)

 

[jrford]

It hard to say without looking at the truck or driving it. The third gens don't have u-joints by the way, maybe have a trans shop take if for a drive and give you a quote.

But guessing since most shifting problems are usually in transmission servo bores or TB or something that requires a full rebuild to be sure. Dealerships really can't rebuild transmissions but they can swap in a reman, which i do know is its about 3200USD. In short they are not going to do it, no matter what. They will just sell it to the next guy who also wants it and who may not care or know about some of the 3rd gen common issues.

Either get a quote from a real trans rebuilder ~$2000USD and save for when it does happen or wait for the next one to pop up. There are bunches of them out there.

 

[rrgone]

TSB 05-21-8 might be relavant. Need to know build date of the truck.

http://www.justanswer.com/uploads/kennyz1963/2008-08-19_131344_05218.pdf

 

[Jester966]

rrgone that sounds like it may be the same issue.
I have the VIN for the truck, is there a way for me to look up the build date and also find out if it has the 5R55S transmission?
(Or if I post it, does anyone here have access to that information?)

Thanks a lot for the information. I e-mailed the guy back last night and suddenly he agrees with me again! I suspect that he was hoping that I would just believe him, and when I argued he realized that he can't BS me into buying a truck with a problem.

 

[rrgone]

I'm going from memory here but what I recall is that the trannys in the 2004s built through 9/23/2004 (which would be all of them I guess) were filled with incorrect fluid. It didn't have the additives required to keep the solenoids from sticking. Ford tried to catch it with a customer satisfaction program (free tranny service with fresh Mercon V) but admitted that if the reverse solenoid is already sticking that the solenoid body could need to be replaced.

The dealer should be willing to perform the diagnostics in the TSB and WSM and give you a written report.

 

[1_v8_merc]

My 04 mountaineer(v8) occasionally makes a slight clunk when going into reverse, but it just sounds like every other vehicle i've owned.

Especially if you park up hill, you'll always get a hard clunk noise when throwing it into reverse...every single car ive owned does that.



Are you sure there is a problem? And your just not being alittle too cautious?
How loud is the clunk?



Also just for knowledge.

Salespeople will say or do ANYTHING to sell a car.
It's a VERY common practice to pressure someone into buying a car by saying "we have another buyer interested in the same car"

99% of the time if there IS another buyer interested in the car, he'll just concentrate on getting THAT person to buy the car since your kind of stalling......i HIGHLY DOUBT there is another person interested in the car, because what are the odds of someone else DECIDING whether or not to buy the exact same vehicle..(unless he is cautious too).
Most people dont THINK about buying cars, they either buy it, or they move on.

Of course there are no guarantees.....im just saying, most salesmen arent out to make friends, so i doubt he'd tell you about someone else looking at the car.....i doubt he's looking out for you because he wants you to have the car and not the other guy.

Jus sayin.......

The ONLY reasons hes gonna tell you about someone else looking at the car is to...

1.) He's not lying about it, however he does it to pressure you into buying the car
2.) He's lying and is pressuring you into buying the car.


The whole "v8 has more power" thing sounds like BS to me....
The truck is at Idle speed or barely above that, the v8 power should have no different than the v6......the v8 isnt that much powerful than the v6 anyways....

Is it just me, or does the mechanic seem crazy?
The engine size or power output should have no bearing or affect on the Transmission shifting right?

 

[shadowless127]

i'm with 1_V8_Merc...

My 03 mounty v8 gives a slight clunk when shifting into reverse, but nothing my 93 X, my mom's 05 Pacifica and my stepdad's 02 Expedition doesn't do. And as far as him questioning whether you were at a complete stop when shifting... if you shift into reverse and are not at a complete stop the car jerks a bit due to motion change (did this one an accident a few times).

My advice, walk away.

I got a great deal on my Mountaineer because I was very bleh about it when I was looking at it. I also went over it with a fine tooth comb for about 10 minutes before the test drive, and about 15-20min AFTER. This allowed me to find out that the previous owner installed a remote start , was a nice bonus.

 

[Jester966]

OK...
They have put it back up on the hoist and looked at it. Now the diagnosis is that there is a problem in the transfer case. They say they will not replace it at the current price. However it would be replaced under warranty if I purchase one (which they will sell me at "their cost").

Does this make sense?
I thought the transfer case was for the 4x4 - so does it make sense that a problem here would appear when I shift into reverse while in 4x4auto?

I'm on the fence but I really want it... I told him I'd call him back tonight.

 

[shadowless127]

Walk away bro...

 

[IZwack]

Yup, walk away. Its just a vehicle, plenty of fishies in the sea.

 

[Donner]

I agree to walk away, but I'd run instead...

I need to make a decision about purchasing the 2004 V8 XLT that I refered to in this thread: http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=239497

As I described in the previous thread, the truck is exactly what I want except that there is an issue with shifting into reverse. While in a complete stop, I shift into reverse and there is a small "clunk" right after shifting, while still stopped.

So I made an offer on the condition that the problem is repaired, and they accepted. Today I have been back and forth trying to find out what is going on and if it will be repaired, and finally tonight I received an e-mail from the salesman telling me that both he and a technician did "extensive" testing today and came to the conclusion that there is no problem, and that the cause is simply because the V8 has more power than a V6! He is trying to convince me that I was not coming to a complete stop before shifting, even though when I test drove the vehicle with him, I demonstrated the problem to him several times while completely stopped, and he agreed that it was in fact an issue.

As I told the salesman in my reply to his e-mail, I find it very hard to believe that a FORD DEALERSHIP is unable to diagnose this problem. I had assumed that it was something simple like the u-joints needing to be repacked, but he is no longer admitting that there is even a problem! I would just walk away but I really like the truck and it is the only one that I have found so far with exact colour and options that I want. And the price seems reasonable, too.

So I am hoping to get some oppinions here as soon as possible. I was expecting to be picking the truck up on Thursday, and he is also now telling me that there is another person wanting to buy it (I don't know if that is true or not)! I had driven another V8 explorer (the limited that I also posted about) for a full 24hrs only a week earlier, and did not notice this problem at all. So is there any merit to what he is trying to convince me? I find it hard to believe, but I am by no means a mechanic. Can anyone offer any ideas as to what the problem may actually be, or if there even is one?

Thanks in advance...

Run away, fast... There is nothing about this investment that you need. Run!

 

[guillo99]

walk

well i don't know how much they want for the truck ,but i would only buy a truck w that issue if i getting a super deal that give me room to replace that part and still be ahead.make crazy offer if you really want this truck and let they come to you ,you have nothing to loose and maybe they agree.

 

[CmdrPopNFresh]

walk away! if they are really that bad at diagnosing a vehicle you shouldnt be buying from there. it sounds to me like theyre shotgunning it. its probly just that tsb but theres no reason you should have to deal with that.

 

[2002GreyHD150]

I know its a little late... but for anyone looking for 411 on this...

1.) my wife's '04 Mountaineer Premeir (4.6 awd) has had consistent trans issues from day 1, new.

2.) the main shift control solenoid was replaced 3 times under warranty. The first time they did the "required" fluid "upgrade".. yet the work done didn't add up. When I looked at the work sheet, the quantity of fluid wasn't a full "transfusion", so I questioned it... left the truck 1 more day, the tech didn't drain/flush the torque converter or flush the tranny cooler & lines... dip sh*t....

3.) odd ball hard shifting, surging, just general transmission related driveablity issues were FINALLY solved the 4th visit, under warranty, totally different dealer in a totally different state... 4th solenoid, 4th fluid/filter flush-change, BUT the problem was fro the wrong fluid issue there was damage/debris (seals had deteriorated & started coming apart) was in the actual valve body itself. They replaced the valve body as a unit. Power flushed the entire trans/converter/cooler as a system (because I stood in the bay & made them) & viola' we haven't had an odd shift/surge problem since.

Now.. yes, the 2002-2005 explorer/monty definitely has a jerk to it when going into reverse... I think its partly due to the 8.8 rear axle, as a rule, has a fairly loose Oe spec on the pinion lash.. so you feel the driveline engage. In the '89 Mustang I built for my wife as a play toy, the OE 8.8 with stock gears had a horrible clunk, not just a jerk. As soon as we replaced the 3.08 gears with more fun 4.10's properly installed the clunk was gone.

Rob