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possible suspension modification??

nava joe

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July 20, 2005
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City, State
ann arbor, MI
Year, Model & Trim Level
1991 navajo lx
I just inherited a 1991 mazda navajo from my grandfather, which enginewise and transmissionwise is in perfect condition, there is only 67,000 miles on the body, the only problem is that the suspension is completly shot. I want this car to be my winter beater car and i wouldn't mind putting a lot of work and a decent amount of money into it. oddly my friend just totaled his 2002 explorer about a week ago when he flipped it on some sand dunes. I was wondering if there would be anyway to take the independent front and rear suspensions off his totalled car and put them on my navajo keeping in mind that i don't mind spending a decent amount of money investing in this little project, if anybody has attempted this or knows anything about the possibilities let me know
 



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Wow sounds like fun and a VERY VERY hard project. Would be interesting to see finished.
 






nava joe said:
I just inherited a 1991 mazda navajo from my grandfather, which enginewise and transmissionwise is in perfect condition, there is only 67,000 miles on the body, the only problem is that the suspension is completly shot. I want this car to be my winter beater car and i wouldn't mind putting a lot of work and a decent amount of money into it. oddly my friend just totaled his 2002 explorer about a week ago when he flipped it on some sand dunes. I was wondering if there would be anyway to take the independent front and rear suspensions off his totalled car and put them on my navajo keeping in mind that i don't mind spending a decent amount of money investing in this little project, if anybody has attempted this or knows anything about the possibilities let me know
If his '02 is a 4-door model, neither end of it would be worth your time to swap. Transforming your front end to use torsion bars, and rack-n-pinion steering, would be a huge undertaking, for not much gain. The rear end of his would be IRS, with halfshafts through the frame...........you don't want that.

When you say that the suspension is shot, what do you mean? The only real parts of the suspension in your '91 are the coils up front, and the leaf packs in the rear. Replacing these springs with new units would be a much better project than trying to replace yours with the SLA front, and IRS rear of your buddy's '02.
 






well to tell you the truth i don't really need this car, i have an 04 volvo S60R, but I also live in michigan and many winter days the roads are very wet and salty, and i kinda want a POS to drive those days, I am looking for a project that will take a while, give me some alone time and all that, I don't mind a lot of work and I want to familarize my self with cars a bit more before i undertake restoring an old Jag E-type (my dream for 10 years). Yes the 02 is a 4 door, i thought that the totally independent suspension would be cool on an SUV that old, if its a lot of work i don't mind, if its impossible then i will maybe try and find some other projects to do with the car
 






id kill for coil springs..ugh i have a 2nd generation. u cant do much with mine. dude if i could id trade suspensions with u. it sounds like the only thing u have to change is probably ur coil springs, ur leafs springs, and shocks are probably way over due. if u get tht stuff replaced ur gunna have a hard hitting suv
 






Umm, I have a question. If this is your "winter beater", and you want a "POS" to drive on wet/salty roads, then why in the world would you invest any decent amount of money in it?

On the subject of swapping suspensions, putting in front and rear independent suspensions would be taking a step backwards in function, not to mention it being a pain in the ass. Might as well just swap in a solid axle. Also, like Robb said, the only things that can really be shot in the suspension on your truck (besides bushings) are the coils in the front and leaf springs in the rear. Replace those and it'll be good as new.
 






step backwards eh? i am not trying to go offroad or anything, if it was really a step backwards in technology and all i don't believe FoMoCo would have invest nearly a billion dollars developing the fully indepentent suspension for the 02+ explorer. I love sporty cars and an indepedent suspension is key to making this or any car more sporty (I don't believe you for a minute that a solid front axel is sportier in any vehicle unless your sport is rock crawling, and even then the hummer is totally indepedent so it can work) I want a challenging project and the parts seemed readily available from a totalled car
 






As mentioned, the rear halfshafts on the IRS Explorers go through the frame, and are supported by coils..........................all of which is COMPLETELY different, frame wise, than your Explorer. With a helluva lot of work, you could force this on to your X, but you would not gain much. IRS is a little more comfy than the solid 8.8, but I still can't see it being worth the trouble. For the rear, if it is only going to be a winter beater, the solid axle 8.8 should serve you well IMO........................but maybe not?

The front SLA IFS swap would be a complete PITA!!! Lots of frame mods to get the torsion bars and shocks to work out correctly, completely fabbing up the proper x-members, plus scratch building the steering system to work the rack...............lot a work for not much gain. Just my opinion though.

What was wrong with the suggestion of just fixing/replacing your springs and shocks?
 






I never said it would be sportier with solid axles, nor the current setup. Just that I think it would be dumb to swap in IFS and IRS.
 






well honestly there is was study done in Ford to see why the suspension on the 02+ explorer didn't perform to expectations, it was supposed to be a lot better than it is, as I am sure you all know by now they are getting rid of the IRS for next year for a solid rear, (the new durango has a solid rear and supposedly handles better as does the 06 explorer, although i haven't driven either) the IRS is extremely expensive for a car in its price range. I thought that with less weight and messing around enough i would be able to take advantage of the full potential of that suspension
 






wow slow down

Your truck is better suited for building as is then by converting it to torsion bar, a arm independant front suspension with rack and pinion steering. the rear is a coil sprung a arm suspension with a center moutned diff and cv axleshafts. Short on travel and problematic when modified.

Your TTB setup and rear leafs are for more stout and easily buildable in a variety of ways. You say you want to make this truck a winter beater?
To me this means rust and bashing it into snow banks :) Thats cool...if thats what you want.

If the stock suspension is toast, then the place to start is with new bushings, shocks and springs. Bearings, brakes, etc, parts are surprisingly cheap compared to most vehicles and the aftermarket for your truck is actually pretty good. You can go from mild to wild.......

Now if you dont want to keep the Navajo, you could sell it. truth is your navajo, or explorer sport is quite a capable off road truck, and they tend to last for a long long time when cared for properly.
You have a 4.0L OHV pushrod V6 engine, it makes plenty of torque and they generally last 250K + miles. You have a 8.8 31 spline rear axle that can take plenty of abuse.
The dana 35 ttb up front has some weak spots up front but they can easily be upgraded.

None of this can be said for the later model IFS or especially the beand newish IRS....I wouldnt wish that on anybody! At least not some sort of converison to IRS on a leaf spring truck, the rear frames are completely different, and the IRS is short on travel and we shall see how stout it is...

have you seen some of the built navajo's on this site? IMO after wheeling all over with a bunch of Rangers, Explorer's and the like, the Explorer sport/navajo is the most capable off road of the bunch, for all around trial wheeling and rock crawling the wheelbase/stance it just about perfect. Not to mention the stock power to weight ratrio.....
 






hmm, alright well I don't really know a lot about truck suspensions and the like, is there such a thing as an adjustable suspension for a 91 navajo? like is there something i could install so that with out to much work I could raise it or lower it a few inches, I don't really want a lift kit or anything like that but something so when i drive to work on the highway i can ride a bit low and if i want to mess around in a snow drift i could raise it up a bit, i bet with some blizzaks on this thing with the 4 wheel drive going this could be a beast in a snow bank. if there is any brand you reccomend i am all ears
 






Nope. Unless you swap adjustable coil buckets or coilovers in, then there's no way to raise and lower it on demand.
 






what about like an air suspension, I thought i remember watching some show on spike like a year ago where the put an airbag suspension on an F150 or GM truck and they could raise that 6 or 8 inches on demand, maybe I am going crazy though
 






As far as I know, it would work on the back but not on the front without major modification.
 






dude thats more for those low riders.. like the billions at my school. dude id kill to have coil springs on my ex. dude be happy lol. haha IRS.. they have those on escapes and cars. u cant beat a solid axle. simple=reliable
 






Amazingss1287 said:
dude thats more for those low riders..
"Dude" that's not true at all. If it was, they wouldn't make kits for Chevy 2500HD's, Dodge Ram's, etc. to raise them 8" on demand! These suspensions are pricey though, from what I last saw. And since there aren't any made for Explorers/Navajos, it would = a LOT of work.

Like j602 and Robb have said, it wouldn't be worth all of the hard work to swap in an IFS and IRS. If this is a "beater" I don't really think I'd want to invest a ton of money into it. If a lot of money was invested into it, I know that I wouldn't drive it like it was a beater (unless I was a millionaire :D). If you want to "refresh" the suspension, you can get some new bushings, coil springs, and leaf springs for it and it's good as new. :)
 






independent suspensions are also on humvees, every land rover, and the new porsche SUV, save the humvee they all handle amazingly well on the road and all of them are very capable offroad, just because it doesn't have a solid axle it doesn't mean that it is not good on not capable
 






"very capable offroad" is relative to what terrain offroad you are speaking of.

And you can't just adjust an independent suspension (and expect it to handle properly while moving). You would constantly be throwing your camber all over the place.
 



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Just thought I'd chime in here with a slightly different perspective.

First, when you say "Winter Beater", what exactly do you mean by that? Do you just want something that will handle in the snow? Will you ever take it off-road? or do you just want something that, if you spin and crash in the snow, you don't really care? There are a lot of ranges.

On the IFS and IRS, I can say they do all have their place. There are several problems you would run into. The first would be finding the room to fit all the suspension components, but it can be done. The second is that the newer Explorer's are wider (Both Suspension wise and Chassis wise) than your '91. This means that you would most likely have to either widen the chassis at the points where you mount the IFS and IRS Differentials. Also, to take advantage of having front and rear suspension in the snow, you would want to swap out your Transfer Case for an automatic one, something like the control trac. This would allow you to put it in "AWD" mode and, if any of the wheels slip, it will engage the front axles so you don't spin and die.

There's a lot more than just that involved in a swap, but that's kind of a start. Now, in terms of why you want to go to IFS and IRS. If you're sole purpose is to drive to and from work safely, I would say that the IFS and IRS would be perfectly fine. Its main advantage is that it does a great job of keeping all 4 wheels on the ground. The problem is, due to the shorter A-Arms, the amount of travel you get is very limiting if you ever take it off-road beyond a small mud puddle or some dinky rolling hills.

Also, comparing Humvee Suspension to Explorer's Suspension is like comparing an R6 to a Tricycle, they are totally different classes. Humvee's A-Arms are about a foot longer then the explorers, plus they have the Gear Reducing hubs that raise the wheels an extra 2 inches more off the ground, getting the frame that much more clearance. They also have the entire driveline hidden behind blast shielding so that no road grime can touch it. Plus, if you've ever sat in a Humvee (I have 3 friends that own them, and I do mean Military Humvee's, not Hummers) you will know that they don't really fit on the roads. On a wide freeway they have about 2" of clearance on either side before hitting the markers, on city streets, your strattling lanes. But, its because of this wideness that makes them such great off-road vehicles.

I would say your best bet for what you want would be to swap out the front TTB Suspension for a Solid Axle Dana 44, then put the whole suspension on air bags. Air bags give a soft ride and would allow you to run it lower on freeways (lowering your center of gravity) and then raising it up some if you want to go off-roading, but you will probably need to do 4-link suspension all around and move the bags half way up the links to get enough variation in height to get any real lift/lowering ability.

It is all possible, its all a matter of how much time and money you really want to spend. But, if you just want a reliable machine and something to work on, I would say fix what you have now. Replace all the rubber components, new shocks, maybe new springs, then dig a little into the engine. You can have a lot of fun working on the X without tearing the whole thing apart. Custom Bumpers, Sliders, roof racks, exo-cages. You can do almost unlimited things to improve its abilities without ever touching the suspension. And the more you know about your vehicle before you tear it down to its skin, the better your chances are of getting it back together.

Man... I've gotta work on my long threads, sorry guys :rolleyes:
 






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