PS Pump leak on my '96 V8 ***HELP***

[chuzie]

Ok here is the deal.

My '96 V8 explorer (pump with separate reservoir) had a bad pressure line so I had one custom made at a reputable shop. When I installed it I had a slow ooze where the high pressure line and the pump housing meet.

Now I did use a -06 (5/8 - 18) fitting between the pump and the line to get the setup to work so at first I suspected it was just a crappy fitting (it was brass junk). I kept tightening it to try and stop the leak but I ended up stretching the threads.

I replaced the fitting with a new Aeroquip steel fitting but it did the same thing ( leaked where the fitting flange meets the pump housing)

I figured I had a pump issue so I replaced the pump. Still have the ooze when I am not actuating the wheel and when I do actuate it shoots out atomized fluid from where the fitting flange meets the pump housing(very dangerous).

The new pump came with a nylon o-ring for the fitting but it only helped when the system was not being actuated. I didn't use the rubber o-ring that came with it because I was under the impression you couldn't use rubber o-rings with high pressure systems (am I wrong?).

I am thinking I have chosen the wrong fitting or am missing something in the system here so please chime in and help me out. I really need to get my rig back on the road ASAP.

Again, I am 100% confident everything from the top of the fitting to the line is fine and my only leak is where the fitting and the pump housing come together.

 

[Mbrooks420]

O-rings can stand up to quite a bit of pressure. Most "modern" 2 stroke motors use a large diameter o ring as a headgasket.

 

[chuzie]

So basically I was wrong for not using the rubber o-ring. Let me ask this... I assume I have to use the rubber o-ring in conjunction with the teflon o-ring, right? Or is it either one or the other? If it is both I would venture to guess the configuration would be teflon on the bottom (closest to the housing) and rubber on top (closest to fitting), right?

 

[Mbrooks420]

I have no idea, but would think you would want only a single o ring.

 

[chuzie]

Well, I did find a thread on this site that mentioned a similar problem but really didnt have a good solution and only mentioned the nylon seal and how he overtightened it.

Guess I need to find a place that can sell me a replacement nylon seal or two or three so i can get this figured out.

FWIW- I measured the depth of the port on the pump housing and it matched up with the length of the fitting so I know that is not the issue. I did notice that the fitting has very little flange surface area. This is the fitting I am using http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=AER%2DFBM2964&N=700+115&autoview=sku

And it looks like this

I cant find anything with a larger flange area so I wonder if that is effecting the ability of the nylon ring to seal properly.

 

[chuzie]

Ok I am convinced the problem I am having is the fitting and, more specifically, the flange size. I tried a new teflon seal in conjunction with the rubber o-ring and no luck.

The flange of my fitting measures .690 (11/16). I do not think this is sufficient to support the teflon seal and thus my leak.

Can someone please measure the flange of their STOCK fitting and let me know what it comes out to from flat side to flat side? I may just have to purchase a stock fitting and adapt it to my custom hose since I don't have a stock fitting right now.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[chuzie]

So today I went to the junkyard and cut out 1/2 of a PS pressure hose from the pump side and am going to take it to my hose guy to make it work with my custom hoses that have really turned out to be a pain.

I am not sure if it is going to fly yet but I have sunk about $150 into the simple PS venture and will likely drop another $20 tomorrow on a new hydro fitting. Next time I will be very elaborate in determining my plumbing needs before I have work done. I bet it would have been a lot cheaper... in the ballpark of $50.00 instead.

Will let you know if it works tomorrow. I bet it will but the hose ned was from a 96 V6 rather than a V8 and I know the pumps are different but I am pretty sure the fittings are the same. Why Ford used that funky looking hose end is beyond me!!!

 

[chuzie]

IT WORKED!

The fitting I was using originally was nowhere close to what I should have had to properly seal that funky ford port. I had my hose guy put an an hose fitting on the other end of the piece I cut from the explorer in the junkyard and used both the rubber o-ring and teflon seal and I am not leaking a drop. It does swivel but no leaks so I am fine with that. Lesson learned. Don't assume it is going to work and always plan plumbing mods out carefully because they can get expensive bery fast especially if you are fixing screw-ups one after the other.

 

[CDW6212R]

Those teflon seals are very special, Ford did not sell them separately three years ago. The teflon seals come on new Ford lines, and they are one time use only.

Do not take those connections apart unless you have new seals to install again. I have heard of people using teflon tape, I chose to buy some from an aftermarket source. They were a little small but they worked. Regards,

 

[chuzie]

I went the teflon tape route on another vehicle PS system before and it was not pretty. Sure it sealed but some of the tape ended up in the system and was a mess. I had to use a lot to get it to seal and that was a mistake too.

The teflon seals for our explorer (and other ford applications) are available at the ford parts desk at the dealership for about $1 each and they come in packs of 7 if you know you are going to screw a few of them upin the process. I made three trips to the dealer for seals before I got it right.

Ended up soaking the teflon seal in hot water and using the housing of a dry erase marker to get it to slide onto the fitting. The housing of the marker (with the felt ink pad removed was perfect because it allowed the PS fitting to slide into the hollow tube perfectly and then I slid the seal over the outside and right onto the fitting.