Shackles vs. Add a leaf. Which would have more flex/articulation?

[Positive Vibes]

Ok hear is the story. Went to 33's and had a lot of rubbing in the front. I didn't want to trim, so I replaced the coils and added a few spacers in the front. Well now the front sits higher that the rear and I would want to have it sit at least semi level. So my question is should I do the warrior shackles? I was talking with Hank and he had a greasable shackle but wasn't sure if it would fit (it was made for a heep). Do I add a leaf? Or should I have my leaf re-done? What you boys and girls think. Thanks!

 

[Alec]

How much rear lift do you want? I'd say go with the dual add a leaf kit for about 2.25" of lift and the best strength/flex. Warriors won't change your stock flex and will give about 1.75". Single aal is good for about an inch and helps flex.

 

[CAC91]

I'd like to know the reasoning behind you saying an add-a-leaf adds flex, Alec. The add a leaf will stiffen the pack as a whole and I would say that will reduce flex.

 

[Alec]

Well, they add arch and also add to the strength of the pack. All I know is I got much better numbers with the aal than without, and I didn't get much lift out of it. I think it's cause the aal wants to arch out and flex.

 

[Maniak]

The add-a-leaf will actually stiffen up the springs.. which will give you the same or less flex..

The stock springs with WAR-153 shackles will give you more flex since you have a longer arc caused by the extra length in the shackle. It isn't much more.. but it is more...

I normally dont' like add-a-leafs (have tried it a few times) since they do stiffen up the rear... They are good to use if your springs are already slightly weak.. but the War-153 keep the ride about the same but give you some lift.. (1/2 the difference in height.... stock shackles are normally 5.5" .. WAR-153 are 8.5".. so 3" difference = 1.5" lift)

~Mark

 

[taxx]

Originally posted by Maniak
The add-a-leaf will actually stiffen up the springs.. which will give you the same or less flex..

The stock springs with WAR-153 shackles will give you more flex since you have a longer arc caused by the extra length in the shackle. It isn't much more.. but it is more...

I normally dont' like add-a-leafs (have tried it a few times) since they do stiffen up the rear... They are good to use if your springs are already slightly weak.. but the War-153 keep the ride about the same but give you some lift.. (1/2 the difference in height.... stock shackles are normally 5.5" .. WAR-153 are 8.5".. so 3" difference = 1.5" lift)

~Mark

Of course the shackles degrade your stock springs faster and you will eventuyally need the aal. So why not just do it now.

 

[Maniak]

How do they degrade the springs faster? If you use the vehicle like you used it before.. the Shackles won't degrade the springs...

If you now flex the rear much more than you did before.. then yes.. I could see that you are wearing them out faster.. but not that much..

It not like they flatten them out or anything...

~Mark

 

[taxx]

Actually flattening them out is exactly what they do. Granted mine have several miles on them, but most people that go with the shackles that I have seen end up with flat springs. Others that go with the aal and shackles only end up with about 2" of lift once it is all broken in.

And if you get a decent aal it doesn't affect the ride quality that noticeably. If you go to a spring shop and get one that has the same rate as ours it will beef up the pack but keep the ride quality pretty close to stock.

 

[Maniak]

There was a very long thread about this before.. and it turns out that putting longer shackles on doesn't flatten the spring...

In short.. What it does is change the angle of the spring. To test this.. Put a straight edge across the 2 ends of the springs.. measure how much arch you have in the spring... Now put on the new shackle and do it again. The arch is the same amount..

I have OME-36 springs with War-153 shackles.. We have 80k+ miles on them.. and they are still great (they were already broken in when we got them)...

If you add an add-a-leaf (not an overload) it will increase the spring rate.. which changes the ride.. If you were to add a new leaf from a spring shop it still will change the spring rate since you are adding springs... If you add an overload spring it doesnt' change the spring rate until the suspension compresses enough to use the spring..

~Mark

 

[Positive Vibes]

The guy at the shop told me to take it to a leaf spring guy tell him what I want and have him make new springs. I really would rather do the shackles. Are warrior the only ones out there for us?

 

[Maniak]

The Warrior shackles are the only ones that say "explorer" as the application. Specifically they say 1996 Ford Explorer 4 door and are 8.5" long (3" longer than the common shackles.. Some explorer have 6.5" long shackles.. but most have 5.5")

You can actually use most jeep shackles but they normally aren't long enough...

If I were looking to lift 2" or so.. and had the money.. I'd use OME-36 springs (old man emu).. They give 2" of lift.. are made well.. and will have more droop that non modified stock springs..

~Mark

 

[Positive Vibes]

Maniak: Thanks for the info. Do you know of a part # or where I could check them out on line. Also what would be your estimate on $$. Thanks again!

 

[taxx]

$$ the shackles will be about $50 shipped, the OME springs I think are more like $350, but I am not sure, search here there are a few on here that have them.

 

[Maniak]

OME-36 springs are close $300-$350 a set..

ARB USA distributes them.. If you find a place that can order ARB stuff you can get the OME-36 springs...

~Mark

 

[Positive Vibes]

Anyone have the part # for the warrior shackles. I checked 4x4wholesalers but they don't list one for the X. I think this is my best solution. Thanks!

 

[Alec]

WAR 153

 

[Positive Vibes]

Duh!

I kinda figured but usually things aren't so easy.

Thanks Alec!

 

[KEbert]

I thought I'd add my opinion here being that I have dealt with both.

Add a leafs don't help felx. And being that nobody makes a full legnth add a leaf, they all suck. Not to mention it will ride horrible.

Shackles don't flatten out springs. There is no extra weight or force added to the springs with longer shackles. However, longer shackles decrease your departure angle. I have James Duff Shackles on mine (7.5") and they are the first place I hit when I go offroading. So you do have to sacrifice something.

The best option, in my opinion is to have your springs rearched by a spring shop. They will flex better and give you more height. OME springs will do the same thing for you, proably better, but for more money.

 

[Positive Vibes]

KEbert: Thanks for your input. How much would you estimate getting my springs rearched? I just called in for the shackles but I'm sure I can cancel my order.

 

[Robert]

Longer shackles do not decrease your departure angle. They sit no lower than the stock shackles. They just raise everything else up. If they are the first thing to hit now when the stock ones weren't, that is only because everything else is a little higher. Now that they are the most vulerable part on the back, it is more noticeable when they hit.