Timberline or Hybrid

[Rubberhead]

So, I've had a bunch of Explorers going all the way back to 1995. I usually buy new and drive them to 200k. So, I'm up to replacing my 2014 LXT 4WD but just don't totally love the current line-up. The current AWD version of 4WD drive is perfect for me but I do tow a 3,500lb+ boat for 100+ miles 7 to 10 times a year. I put about 20k a year on my Explorer, mostly highway but need the 4WD for some light off roading at the deer club and pulling a smaller duck boat in winter weather.

So, I like the Timberline because the looks on the increased off roading capabilities. My 80-something year old Dad is about to trade his 4WD Tundra on a smaller Tacoma so getting a little better 4WD system reduces the chance that I may need to get help. I'm confused about why the highway mileage of the Timberline is 21 MPG where it's 26 MPG for the same engine and, basically, same drive system on an XLT or non-Hybrid. Question: Does experience really show that the Timberline's fuel economy is that much worse than a similar XLT or Limited? I do drive a lot of miles so a nearly 25% decrease in fuel mileage is a major consideration.

Question 2 is on the turbocharged engine. Like I said above, I expect to get a lot of miles and years out of my Explorers (that's why I've stuck with them for so long), but simple logic says that asking a 2.3L engine to do what a 4.6L, or 4.0L or even 3.5L or 3.3L engine is just going to add wear and tear and shorten the life of the engine. I am a very disciplined maintainer of my stuff and usually change the oil every 4 to 4.5k and down to 3.5k when I'm towing frequently so I know that discipline will help me get more miles out of a turbo but I'm considering as an alternative, just ordering a 3.3L Hybrid with the Naturally Aspirated engine and losing a little of the off road capabilities. Question 2: Can I get 200k+ miles out of a 2.3L EcoBoost given the use I describe?

I completely understand that the Explorer Hybrid is not built to compete with the Highlander Hybrid on fuel economy but I like Ford's hybrid implementation because of the towing I mentioned. But, Ford's hybrid Explorer is one of the least popular configurations so I wonder if I'm not just swerving to avoid one ditch and ending up in the other...

I am glad the collective wisdom of you guys is available to help me navigate this course that ahead of me. Any thoughts on these two 2023 Explorer platforms would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much for any and all thoughts, you guys are great.

2023 Timberline with moonroof and Technology Package or
2023 4WD Limited 310A package with moonroof and Towing Package.

 

[Franks23]

I tow a 4500 Lb Travel Trailer, the 2.3 does a excellent job, The Explorer is well qualified in the towing department. For the most part we stay off the interstate and travel the back roads of America. If you want to tow hard and fast, get something with a longer wheel base like a F-150 or above. As for longevity, who knows? We used to be able to do a garage rebuild with pocket change, now we need to mortgage the farm.

Be prepared for 10mpg or so towing. That Boost side of the equation really hurts plus the book recommends 91 octane when towing.

 

[2020FordRaptor]

Towing wise you cant go wrong with either. Gas mileage wise, if you get the Hybrid in AWD, the gas mileage will not be much better than the Timberline. We had a Limited Hybrid AWD and we never saw any better than 24 MPG city or highway. My vote is timberline.

 

[Beargap]

So, I've had a bunch of Explorers going all the way back to 1995. I usually buy new and drive them to 200k. So, I'm up to replacing my 2014 LXT 4WD but just don't totally love the current line-up. The current AWD version of 4WD drive is perfect for me but I do tow a 3,500lb+ boat for 100+ miles 7 to 10 times a year. I put about 20k a year on my Explorer, mostly highway but need the 4WD for some light off roading at the deer club and pulling a smaller duck boat in winter weather.

So, I like the Timberline because the looks on the increased off roading capabilities. My 80-something year old Dad is about to trade his 4WD Tundra on a smaller Tacoma so getting a little better 4WD system reduces the chance that I may need to get help. I'm confused about why the highway mileage of the Timberline is 21 MPG where it's 26 MPG for the same engine and, basically, same drive system on an XLT or non-Hybrid. Question: Does experience really show that the Timberline's fuel economy is that much worse than a similar XLT or Limited? I do drive a lot of miles so a nearly 25% decrease in fuel mileage is a major consideration.

Question 2 is on the turbocharged engine. Like I said above, I expect to get a lot of miles and years out of my Explorers (that's why I've stuck with them for so long), but simple logic says that asking a 2.3L engine to do what a 4.6L, or 4.0L or even 3.5L or 3.3L engine is just going to add wear and tear and shorten the life of the engine. I am a very disciplined maintainer of my stuff and usually change the oil every 4 to 4.5k and down to 3.5k when I'm towing frequently so I know that discipline will help me get more miles out of a turbo but I'm considering as an alternative, just ordering a 3.3L Hybrid with the Naturally Aspirated engine and losing a little of the off road capabilities. Question 2: Can I get 200k+ miles out of a 2.3L EcoBoost given the use I describe?

I completely understand that the Explorer Hybrid is not built to compete with the Highlander Hybrid on fuel economy but I like Ford's hybrid implementation because of the towing I mentioned. But, Ford's hybrid Explorer is one of the least popular configurations so I wonder if I'm not just swerving to avoid one ditch and ending up in the other...

I am glad the collective wisdom of you guys is available to help me navigate this course that ahead of me. Any thoughts on these two 2023 Explorer platforms would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much for any and all thoughts, you guys are great.

2023 Timberline with moonroof and Technology Package or
2023 4WD Limited 310A package with moonroof and Towing Package.

We have a trailer that is 5000 lbs loaded (sometimes a few hundred more in the past) that we used to tow with a 2008 Mountaineer with a 4.6L V8 and a tow package rated at 7000 lbs. We don't haul as often these days, so took a chance on a 2021 Explorer XLT with the 2.3L engine and tow package rated at 5300 lbs. We actually used it last fall pulling 4500-5000 lbs and I was amazed at how well it did, frankly a lot better than the old V8 vehicle. The tow package includes plug-in capability for electric brakes like the old one did, but adds many new features like automatic downshifting on hill descents when in tow mode, manual paddle shifters (not really as needed with the auto downshift) and automatic extension of the blind spot monitoring. This 2.3 actually has more horsepower than the old V8. Mileage drops from around 28 on the highway to less than half when towing, but the vehicle does very well. No idea about longevity, we usually go more than 10 years and well over 100K miles in the past, and I worry about turbos and such, but for now very happy.

=Vic=

 

[Rubberhead]

Thanks @Franks23, @2020FordRaptor, and @Beargap - that's exactly the information I was hoping to get.

I feel confident that any version of the 2023 Explorer platform can handle the towing duties I need.

So, here's basically where I'm at now...

IF the Timberline's highway mileage is closer to the 4WD XLT/Limit's listed Hwy Mileage of 26 MPG than the Timberline's listed 21MPG
THEN I'll probably just go with a Timberline and deal with the longevity questions with closer attention to maintenance and driving habits and possibly an extended warranty
ELSE IF the EcoBoost's longevity is in serious question
THEN I'll order a Limit Hybrid because of it's NA engine, not necessarily because of the hybrid systems or fuel economy,
ELSE IF the Timberline's highway mileage is actually close to 21 MPG
THEN I'll order a XLT or Limited 4WD with the EcoBoost and temper my "overlanding" and deer recovery practices to my current levels
END IF

Sorry for the programming format but I'm trying to make sense of my own spaghetti logic too...haha

Thanks for anymore or additional feedback.

 

[peterk9]

I'm still intrigued by your stated mpg highway figures. The difference between the tire sizes (18 vs 20) is minimal at -1.6%. The Timberline does, however, come with all-terrain tires. Would that make that much of a difference?

Peter

 

[2020FordRaptor]

I'm still intrigued by your stated mpg highway figures. The difference between the tire sizes (18 vs 20) is minimal at -1.6%. The Timberline does, however, come with all-terrain tires. Would that make that much of a difference?

Peter

Yes A/T will make a noticeable difference. More rolling restsiatnce.

 

[Rubberhead]

I'm still intrigued by your stated mpg highway figures. The difference between the tire sizes (18 vs 20) is minimal at -1.6%. The Timberline does, however, come with all-terrain tires. Would that make that much of a difference?

Peter

It doesn't make sense to me, either, Peter. The increased ground clearance and skid plates would certainly have an effect on aerodynamics and the tires you mentioned would, I'm sure, increase the rolling resistance. The only other thing might be the limited slip differential but all these added together just don't seem enough to account for a nearly 25% decrease in highway mileage. I did find two quick and almost throw-away comments in Youtube reviews of the Timberline of highway mileage, in presumably new vehicles, of 24ish MPG. That makes more sense to me.

 

[kaptainkriz]

In the southern hilly sections of I81 in VA, we get just under 25mpg at speeds around 70mph in our Timberline. It drops significantly around town. Not towed with it yet - we use our 2018 V6 explorer for that.

 

[Rubberhead]

Thanks @kaptainkriz - that's exactly the information I was hoping to get.

 

[A1cntrlr]

I have the cruise control set to 4 over the posted speed limit. This means I run at 74/69 depending on the Interstate/Highway speed limit. My usual route to my brother's house is fairly traffic free and is about 90 miles each way. Most weekends I'm pulling a small trailer (Jetski trailer) set up for hauling my kayak. On that route I average 21mpg in my Timberline. When I'm not putting the trailer I get close to 25mpg. This isn't based on the dash display, as that one always seems off showing 24/27 with trailer/without. I track it via actual miles between fill-ups and fuel put in.

I came from a 2007 Explorer Sport Trac 4x4 4.6L V8. I'd be feeling really good getting 18 to 19 not towing and 16 to 17 towing the same trailer.

As with nearly anything, you take care of it and it'll take care of you. Maintenance is key. Don't miss an oil change. Hear a weird noise? Investigate it and fix it. The Ecoboost engine was a concern of mine as well, but the more I thought about it, the Ecoboost has been around for quite a while so I figure most of the issues are known and have been addressed over time. The only concern I have is the transmission, but the transmission in my Sport Trac went at 94k (drove it to 190k and now my brother-in-law has been driving it for a while now) so I'm pretty sensitive to feeling weird shifts, and there seem to be plenty, but again it's just normal operation so I've read (skipping gears on upshifts type things.)

 

[Rubberhead]

Thank you @A1cntrlr

I'd love to get 24-25 on the highway with a Timberline not towing anything.

I found a gas mileage tracking site but it doesn't split the 4WD XLTs from the 2WD but even with that, the Timberline (always 4WD) averaged (and median values) of 2.67 MPG less than the combination of RWD and 4WD XLT Explorers. If the site identified the percentage of 4WD vs RWD XLTs, I'd be able to figure out the fuel inefficiency of the Timberline vs a normal 2.3L 4WD, but alas, I can not...

I know this is over analyzing things but I have fun doing it. Thanks again.

 

[2020FordRaptor]

Rembemver too that technically the newer Explorers have AWD not 4wd.

 

[Rubberhead]

Rembemver too that technically the newer Explorers have AWD not 4wd.

Thanks for the reminder. Yes, I am aware that there is a broad set of mechanical and computer technologies used by vehicle manufacturers to drive power to wheels beyond a single drive axle. I imagine too that, 100 folks would have close to 100 different opinions on whether a particular implementation is 4WD or AWD, especially now that there are just so many combinations and permutations. I think most would agree, however, that a full-time system that lacks a low gearing option is AWD. I wouldn't disagree.

I'm absolutely sure that Ford's implementation in the Explorer is designed to keep a soccer mom, with a minimum of effort, knowledge and experience, from getting stuck somewhere. It turns out that the soccer mom implementation works just fine for me too. All I'm trying to do with it is make it to the boat ramp during a duck season's winter weather event and get as close as possible to a downed deer on a wood's road or transmission right-of-way. BTW - I live and hunt in the coastal two-thirds of South Carolina so our winter weather events are laughable compared to many. That being said, we don't have the road clearing equipment either so 4" of snow is a serious problem for our roads. 4WD low gearing? I'd have to drive for an hour just to see a rock or a 5% grade so rock crawling isn't even a thought.

Considering all this, though, since it's just semantics, I stuck with Ford's nomenclature and called it 4WD.

 

[peterk9]

Thank you @A1cntrlr

I'd love to get 24-25 on the highway with a Timberline not towing anything.

I found a gas mileage tracking site but it doesn't split the 4WD XLTs from the 2WD but even with that, the Timberline (always 4WD) averaged (and median values) of 2.67 MPG less than the combination of RWD and 4WD XLT Explorers. If the site identified the percentage of 4WD vs RWD XLTs, I'd be able to figure out the fuel inefficiency of the Timberline vs a normal 2.3L 4WD, but alas, I can not...

I know this is over analyzing things but I have fun doing it. Thanks again.

The Timberline is advertised as having "Intelligent 4WD" like most of the Explorer trims. This means that like most other 6th gen Explorers, it is basically rear-wheel drive biased, switching to AWD (4WD) when needed. I'm quite sure Ford doesn't have a full-time AWD 5th or 6th gen Explorer.

Peter