Possible Sport V8s?

Now that I've decided that if I significantly increase the power in my 2000 Sport I will install a V8 I need to consider engine possibilities. I'm not very knowledgeable about Ford V8s since my Sport is the first Ford I've owned.

Of course the easiest would be the 302/5.0L since it came stock in so many of the 4 door Explorers.

The 351 Windsor engine would provide more power but I've read that the deck height is larger to accommodate the engine's longer stroke. It might not fit in the engine compartment.

The stroked and bored 302 to 347 would be about as simple to install as the stock 302 except for a custom tune but is fairly expensive for an OHV engine.

The 4.6L came with the 4R70W in 3rd generation Explorers and I like the idea of a SOHC V8 with all of the chains and sprockets in the front of the engine. However, I've read that the engine is wider than the 5.0L (probably due to the heads) and may not fit.

What I would really like is one of the engines shown below.

However, the 4.6L DOHC V8 is even wider than the 4.6L SOHC V8.

 

[Hitchhikingmike]

Why not just turbo/super charge your current SOHC V6? You have already put so much work into it. There are quite a few performance parts for the SOHC that you can borrow off of the mustang variants.

 

[Turdle]

because the v6 stuff will just blow up

 

[Mbrooks420]

5.0. Like IZ mentioned all the leg work is done. There are tons of proven dead reliable packages. Tons of parts available. And you get rid of that garbage transmission. High power on the v6 4r/5r transmission will kill them. And if you do destroy the transmission, they can't be beefed up all that much. A 4r70w can be built to handle some major numbers.

The 5.0/4r70w will handle power reliably, and can be built until you go broke. The 5.0 is easy because its almost factory fit wise. Turbos are great. Superchargers are cool. Do either one, but do it on a v8.

 

[2000StreetRod]

Why a V8

Jakee, I decided that if I choose to significantly increase my power I will purchase a running 2000, 4 door, 2WD model Explorer with a V8 that was also available with the SOHC V6. I'll remove the V8 powertrain and rebuild/modify as desired. Then I'll remove the V6 powertrain from my Sport and install the rebuilt V8 powertrain with custom exhaust. While driving my V8 Sport I'll install the V6 powertrain in the 4 door in a stock configuration and then sell the vehicle.

My reasoning is as follows:

1. The SOHC V6 timing chain system is unreliable and time consuming and expensive to repair. I won't risk building up an expensive performance engine that could be destroyed at any time due to the rear guide assembly breaking apart.

2. There are too many engine repairs/modifications that require pulling SOHC V6 engine.

3. The 5R55E transmission is not very robust and Ford provided no way to manually select 3rd gear.

4. Camshafts, heads, headers, pistons, superchargers, and other performance items are limited and expensive for the SOHC V6.

5. There are numerous new and used performance parts for the 5.0L V8.

6. I want to start with a fully functional V8 powertrain to reduce unknowns when attempting start up in my Sport. I want to reduce start up problems to wiring and anti-theft issues.

7. I should be able to sell the V6 powered 4 door for about as much as my purchase price depending on the condition of its original V8 powertrain compared to my good condition V6 powertrain.

8. My Sport downtime will be limited to the time it takes to remove the V6 powertrain and install the V8 rebuilt/modified powertrain.

9. If I later decide I want a supercharger I can install it on the V8 provided I can find one.

pwrshft99, I'm not sure that a stock 5.0L will be noticeably more powerful than my current SOHC V6 with it's modifications. The 90mm MAF sensor, large diameter intake tube, 75mm throttle body and a custom tune significantly increased it's "fun factor". The main difference will probably be greater low engine speed torque with the 5.0L. One disadvantage of the V8 vs the V6 will be gas mileage. Now that my timing chain rattle is gone I'm getting about 19 mpg in the city with the A/C running a lot. That's about the same as we're getting on our 2006 V6 Toyota Highlander.

Limited02, I agree that a Kenne Belle is probably less efficient than a turbo but the Explorer Express/Eaton unit may be comparable since it requires less than 3 hp when boost is not needed. Also, access to the engine for normal maintenance (spark plugs & wires) seems better with a supercharger than a turbo.

 

[Jakee]

In the end, it's your choice and I'll support that anytime. I just want to make sure you realize most of what these guys are telling you is only their opinion and is not backed by much experience with pushing the V6 motors potential.

 

[pwrshft99]

I wouldn't let gas mileage worry you much.. my 2000 V8 4 door is putting up very similar numbers to my 98 V6 sport in town and actually better on the highway.

Surely the V6 can perform if enough effort is put forth. But dollar for dollar the modifications will be more rewarding with a V8...

 

[IZwack]

So can we can get back on topic - which 8 cyl to go with?

 

[Jakee]

So can we can get back on topic - which 8 cyl to go with?

Why are you even saying this?

 

[IZwack]

Sorry - I thought this thread was about selecting which v8 to go with:

Now that I've decided that if I significantly increase the power in my 2000 Sport I will install a V8 I need to consider engine possibilities. I'm not very knowledgeable about Ford V8s since my Sport is the first Ford I've owned.

Of course the easiest would be the 302/5.0L since it came stock in so many of the 4 door Explorers.

The 351 Windsor engine would provide more power but I've read that the deck height is larger to accommodate the engine's longer stroke. It might not fit in the engine compartment.

The stroked and bored 302 to 347 would be about as simple to install as the stock 302 except for a custom tune but is fairly expensive for an OHV engine.

The 4.6L came with the 4R70W in 3rd generation Explorers and I like the idea of a SOHC V8 with all of the chains and sprockets in the front of the engine. However, I've read that the engine is wider than the 5.0L (probably due to the heads) and may not fit..

We're going off on a tangent here and not really talking about the which v8 flavor would best fit.

 

[Hitchhikingmike]

well then... I guess there is no replacement for displacement is there?

 

[heaterhotter]

5.0l v8

i would personally go with the 302 because of ease of installation and performance parts are all over the internet i personally have wanted to do a v8 swap to my 2000 sport and may start to plan the process sometime this month with parts for rebuild and research on any issues members have had especially with the PATS system on the newer explorers. Power wise the 302 should satisfy your needs with horsepower ranging from 210(OHV) 205(SOHC) and 215(SOHC GT-40P heads). The only thing im waiting for really is for my trans or motor to blow up or show signs of either going and buy a doner 4-door and basically swap everything, the engine, wiring and ignition for the pats. Does anyone here know of any issues or any tips on the swap for both 2wd and the all wheel drive set up. Has anyone tried to swap a 302 from a mustang? would it mount up properly? Also how about transfer case options in my case i would like to do a manual tcase. Im just puting out some idea and hope to know how everything goes well with your future swap streetrod and will be very interested in your end results. Good luck

 

[Limited02]

IZwack- The only reason Jakee and I are pushing for the V6 is because it has the potential to be plenty fast with minimal work and it's already there. Jakee would know more from first hand experience because he has a turbo'd V6 and has shut me up on how fast he could run

It seems to me it's a lot of work to buy a donor vehicle just to swap motors and resell the donor after you get it running again. It also seems that you won't be achieveing outright power anytime soon, only when money allows. Mounty03 has a turbo'd 4.6(built block) and has blown his tranny twice(also a built tranny, but couldn't be made much stronger). But he's also a full weight AWD 4-door with 450+hp going through the tranny.

I would swap the entire 4.6/5R tranny in because of the 5 speed over the 4R70W's 4 speed and because you're 2wd and lighter than a 4-door= less stress on tranny when higher power levels are achieved.

From a stock power potential, both the 5.0 and 4.6 are limited to about 450 crank horsepower before you start blowing things up. That's assuming you have a good running motor with a spot on tune. If I'm not mistaken, 5.0's need a block girdle thing to help keep them from splitting after you go 450+ HP, so an aftermarket block would be best if you are going to high power levels with a forged 5.0. The 4.6's with forged internals can get pretty high on factory blocks(maybe 800+HP)

If you go V8, you may hit some road blocks and headaches that may make you get rid of the project all together and you'll wish you stuck with the V6. I can say that's what happened with my V8 swapped 92' Ranger, sold it for a fraction of what I had invested into it. But if time and money is the least of your worries and you get whatever V8 swapped in and running that you want, then you have a V8 Explorer Sport that's fast.

I'm tired and if I said something that doesn't make sense or I'm way off topic, disregard whatever I said and I'll just watch this thread to see where it goes. Once again, I vote V6

 

[Turdle]

I recommend everyone read the thread title

to me, "v6" is no more "on topic" than "stockings and panties".

 

[IZwack]

Curious: what is wrong with the 4 speeds of the 4r70? I ask because it is a lockup torque converter with an overdrive (.67 ratio?) so I think it would do pretty well on the highway.

 

[pwrshft99]

I would swap the entire 4.6/5R tranny in

Installing a 4.6 in a second gen would be a huge, expensive project with fabrication required.

If a V8 swap is desired, a 302 is the only way to go, and if you want to mod it the sky is the limit.

Hell if I ever get the money for tourqe monster headers, ill get them for regular 302 heads. A stock 302 with heads, intake an exhaust is an easy 300 HP driver.

 

[Axial32]

DO IT.. YOu KNOW you wanna join the club..
I LOVE my V8 in my sport..
All the onlooking eyes as I roll into the Lincoln Tech. parking lot is just amazing.. I basically sound like a mustang with a cam..
I've already had a random person at a gas station come up to me and ask what's under the hood...

Oh.. my only problem so far is all my vaccum leaks.. I need some diagrams to figure out where all the lines really go.

 

[mr.p]

Drop A/C, drop the power steering, get the 4.6L out of a bullit, find a stand alone ECM and just wire in the speedo oil and rpm gauge. Buy a T-56 and get a custom driveshaft made. This would be the nicest way to do it. Try to get the engine stripped down as possible.

I know when i toast my 4.0L Im deffinately not dropping an outdated engine in, it will have to be really worth the swap and a 5.0L just doesnt seem worth it at all unless it has some serious work done to it and that gets very expensive.


factory 4.6L is 300ish hp vs 210HP 5.0L in stock form....plus a t56 would benefit me in swapping from auto to manual id gain a gear. My explorer does 62ish MPH in first gear, so splitting that up would be wonderful.

I just dont see why the 4.6L would be way more "expensive"

 

[mr.p]

heres some dimensions i snagged from a mustang forum

302
27-1/2 Inches L
20-3/4 Inches H
18-3/4 Inches W

351W
27-1/2 Inches L
23-3/4 Inches H
21 Inches W

4.6L SOHC
28 Inches L
26 Inches H
28-5/8 Inches W

4.6L DOHC
28 Inches L
29-7/8 Inches H
30 Inches W


not sure on the accuracy

 

[pwrshft99]

Installing a motor in a vehicle it never came in from the factory is a huge challenge.

There might be some ways around a few problems. Fabricating engine mounts and exhaust manifolds are two problems won't be easy or cheap, nor the electronics.

A scrapyard 300 HP 4V 4.6 will be $1500-$2500 compared to 302s you can find as low as $250. You can rebuild the 302 for about $600 and add aftermarket heads for $700-1000 to come up with 300 HP from a fresh 5.0.

I always tell people to check out the Painless Wiring 5.0 harness. It's perfect for swapping a fuel injected 5.0 in anything that didn't come with one. Basically you need the harness and the computer and sensors from any 89-93 V8 Mustang.

Makes for a simple engine swap but it might take more work to get the automatic trans all good electronically..

Unless power adders are involved, the 4.6 has no real advantages over a 5.0...

My 5.0 EX is even getting better gas mileage than my 4.6 GT did when it was stock years ago..

 

[2000StreetRod]

reasonable choices

mr.p, thanks for the very helpful measurements! It is obvious from the listed engine widths that the only reasonable choices are the 302, the 347 (same size as 302) and possibly the 351W. Either of the 4.6L engines would require gutting and cutting unsuitable for a street vehicle.

I believe I read somewhere that the GT40P heads (apparently Ford's best flowing heads) will fit the 351 if the head bolt holes are drilled to 0.5 inch diameter. I don't know what other mods might be required to make them fit. The difference in the 302 and 351 deck heights might prevent the use of stock exhaust (or bolt on replacement) manifolds. I can't recall reading any threads by someone who replaced their 302 with a 351W. Also, the higher deck height might eliminate the possibility of a supercharger due to reduced hood clearance.