Use Existing Heads or Buy New ones?

[shucker1]

@weasel318 ,

Sounds like you have your project under good control.

Well done.

Don't forget to let us know how it turns out please.

 

[fast_dave]

No. Oxygen Sensor Code, just a lean code P0171 and p0174. Tried to fixed that with upper gaskets but didnt do anything. Right after changed the gaskets, i data logged it and the Ltfuel trim was around 21-24% which is still too high. I think i blew the headgasket from driving it too long with it running leaning. As for the air leak, im guessing it was the valve covers that might be letting unmetered air into the pcv? hopefully it doesnt run lean when i get it all back together

@weasel318

When the Check Engine Light code says that the Fuel System is "too lean," - i.e. P0171 & P0174 - it means that the computer has been adding more and more fuel to adjust the lean condition. This is called Long Term Fuel Trim.

Ideally, the Long Term Fuel Trim should be close to 1 to 2 percent.

When a code P0174 is set, on a V type engine, it means that the Fuel Trim is anywhere from 15 percent to as high as 35 percent on BOTH BANKS to compensate for the lean condition.

OHV Valve Covers & Air Leaks:

When used with cork and cork/rubber combination gaskets, 4.0 OHV Valve Covers are very sensitive to over-torquing, can get high & low spots, and thus leak air.

Check that they are square, and the gasket surface is flat and true.

My recommendation, use ONLY 100% rubber valve cover gaskets.

Due to my long term experience with the OHV, what I do is go one step further.

I clean the gasket mount surface BOTH on the Head and the Valve Cover gasket surface with Electric Contact Cleaner (use this BECAUSE no residue is left over when it dries) and clean hi-nap rags (washed tube socks turned inside out),

When the gasket surfaces are operating room clean, I coat BOTH surfaces with Permatex Ultra Copper Form A Gasket (which is BOTH ultra-high temp. & safe for emissions equipment).

Wait a little bit for the Copper Coat to get tacky, and basically glue the gasket on.

If at all possible, wait overnight for the Copper Coat to thoroughly dry, and only then fire up your engine.

Some may find this method unorthodox, but it works for me - Your Mileage May Vary.

Lastly, check the PCV Valve grommet condition - around 130,000 I replaced my original one and the replacement really hugs on to the pcv valve.

It might be because my oil is super thin from the steam diluting it. Before I pulled the motor apart, when i pulled the dipstick out the oil was just dripping off the stick like water.

This all goes hand in hand with what you witnessed on your dipstick = oil saturated with raw fuel - your oil was "thin" from all of the raw fuel in it.

If water/steam had come in contact with your engine oil, you would have seen a frothy brown/cream tone to the oil on your dipstick.

Hope that helps -

 

[weasel318]

Fast_dave, my godmother took it to some shady mechanic that used the felpro cork gasket. When i was tearing the engine apart, all the valve cover bolts were lose. They werent even finger tight. Could this have caused my engine to run super lean?

And yea, i got the ford valve gaskets. Not using cork. Ford used to use cork on their lima engines in the 80s. they switched to rubber reinforced with a metal skeleton in the 90s. It means cork isnt the best gasket LOL.

Also I havent drained my oil yet so im not sure if its a chocolate milkshake yet. The thing is I didnt run it long after the head gasket blew. I pulled in, parked it, started it back up to diag it and it was blowing smoke. So i shut it down. I then started it up 3 more times to move it around my drive way (total run time after gasket blew is probably 3 mins). The top end had some coffee color oil to it. I dont think it was running so rich that it was diluting my oil though? If that was the case I would have black smoke from the exhaust? But not sure. I will change the oil once I finish preping the engine surface (in case any carbon falls into the wrong place I dont have to change my oil again).

Shuckers I will keep you guys up to date. This reminds me, I need to update one of my other thread from a year ago regarding my clutch problem. I will post pics too if youguys want. any request while the engine is apart?

 

[fast_dave]

Fast_dave, my godmother took it to some shady mechanic that used the felpro cork gasket. When i was tearing the engine apart, all the valve cover bolts were lose. They werent even finger tight. Could this have caused my engine to run super lean?

@weasel318

To answer your question - YES.

This engine, due to design, vibrates.

Add to that the wide swings in temperature (heat/cool cycle) that the engine operates under in the high temperatures encountered in the PRK (where both of us reside).

Note that the 8 Valve Cover Bolts are spaced pretty far apart and due to the beforementioned conditions, they loosen fairly easily (see pics) and there are many places for air leaks to occur. The rearmost bottom bolt, closest to the firewall, on BOTH sides, needs to be checked every oil change...

To wind this up; those are the reasons why I essentially "glue" the Rubber Valve Cover Gaskets to the Head and Valve Cover with Ultra Copper - hope that helps!

 

[weasel318]

Should I get the Morona valve cover support rail to fix the problem??
Tom Morana Racing Engines

 

[fast_dave]

Should I get the Morona valve cover support rail to fix the problem??
Tom Morana Racing Engines

@weasel318,

In all my years on this forum, I've never heard of / seen anyone shell out the $130 to see if the Moran Valve Cover Supports really do anything...

Take one for the team and try 'em out & do a write up! ;-)

I can tell you that my method spelled out ABOVE costs $8 for the Contact Cleaner, $6-7 for the tube of Ultra Coat, $0 for a couple of clean cotton tube socks, and the cost of Rubber Valve Cover Gaskets.

For me, my method lasts 100,000 Miles before having to be renewed - and by that time, I usually also replace the Upper Intake Manifold Gaskets - another well-known problem item on the X Engine.

If I was to improve my method one step further, I'd swap out the stock valve cover bolts for studs inserted into the head, and nuts/lock washers(or self-locking airplane nuts) holding down the valve covers.

Pic of Upper Intake Gaskets.

 

[weasel318]

I heard earlier 4.0 had valve cover reinforcements for corner bolts and such? Like it was a washer but rectangular and used to spread apart the force of the bolts.

I cleaned the valve covers with ZEP citrus degreaser. Didn't want to spend a fortune on the cleaners LOL. The oil + dirt from offroading was almost 1/4 inch thick. Im going to use the Ford gasket by itself and if it leaks I will try your way. Dont want to add too many variables to the project right now. Afraid I might F something up. LOL

 

[weasel318]

Oh I got my headgaskets today and it seems like the ford headgasket is graphite and completely different than the FelPro. Which one is exactly better?

 

[fast_dave]

I heard earlier 4.0 had valve cover reinforcements for corner bolts and such? Like it was a washer but rectangular and used to spread apart the force of the bolts.

The problem with this design valve cover is two-fold.

The first is spreading the force of the bolts so they do not deform the valve cover.

The second is that there are not enough valve cover bolts to properly seal the valve cover for the long term - that's why I included the pictures of the valve covers.

Look at the valve cover; The front third & back third need, at minimum, two more bolts each.

Those pics are worth 1,000 words to anybody trying to attain leak free valve covers

That's part of the reason I went to gluing my gaskets on.

I cleaned the valve covers with ZEP citrus degreaser. Didn't want to spend a fortune on the cleaners LOL. The oil + dirt from offroading was almost 1/4 inch thick. Im going to use the Ford gasket by itself and if it leaks I will try your way. Dont want to add too many variables to the project right now. Afraid I might F something up. LOL

Can't tell you if ZEP leaves behind any residue.
I can tell you that CRC Electric Contact Cleaner doesn't leave behind any residue (last line on the can - see pic).

Virgin Rubber Valve Cover Gaskets that haven't been exposed to oil glue on quite easily and with excellent long term results - that's the way I do it.

I've never tried to glue on a used rubber Valve Cover Gasket that's been exposed to heat cycling and engine oil.

 

[fast_dave]

Oh I got my headgaskets today and it seems like the ford headgasket is graphite and completely different than the FelPro. Which one is exactly better?

As the years go by, Fel-Pro continues not to really impress me...

 

[weasel318]

Oh yea, if it leaks again I wont reuse the gasket, I will get new ones and then try that method. But the project is on hold. cylinder heads came in today and they are completely messed up.

 

[siggy-TX]

Well gee, you learn something new every day. I have cork valve cover gaskets, and those things were a PITA to get torqued down properly with the thick and mushy cork gaskets (could also be my lack of a 1/4" torque wrench, but I made the click sound myself so I think I'm good ). Had to go over them 2 or 3 times as they compressed and the bolts became super loose. I'm having some less than perfect idling and smell a little gas under the hood. @fast_dave 's advice seems sound. 8 bolts is not a lot for how big these valve covers are. I wish our covers had a rubber gasket that set in a groove like Hondas have.

@weasel318 I also cleaned all the crud out of my valve covers with citrus degreaser. I wouldn't worry too much about residue, it's just going to get coated with oil anyway. What I did was spray the heck out of it with degreaser, scrub like my life depended on it, then rinse off with the hose. Hand dried the covers with a cloth then gave a generous coating of WD40 to prevent rust from forming (after cleaning off all the old oil these suckers rusted in about 10 minutes!). For extra effect, paint the outside of them while you're at it. Admire your workmanship, then put them back on where they are covered with a million wires and such and you can't even see the results of all that work you did. Perfect!

 

[fast_dave]

I also cleaned all the crud out of my valve covers with citrus degreaser. I wouldn't worry too much about residue, it's just going to get coated with oil anyway.

@siggy-TX

When gluing the rubber gaskets to the heads and valve covers, in order to assure a sure seal with the Ultra Copper you need to worry about left over residue from the cleaning product.

80% of the result of your labor is taking the time to do the proper prep labor and not cut corners.
Throw caution to the wind, Mr. Murphy will come into the picture - YMMV

 

[fast_dave]

Oh yea, if it leaks again I wont reuse the gasket, I will get new ones and then try that method. But the project is on hold. cylinder heads came in today and they are completely messed up.

@weasel318

Did you buy King's Cylinder Heads or???

 

[siggy-TX]

@siggy-TX

When gluing the rubber gaskets to the heads and valve covers, in order to assure a sure seal with the Ultra Copper you need to worry about left over residue from the cleaning product.

80% of the result of your labor is taking the time to do the proper prep labor and not cut corners.
Throw caution to the wind, Mr. Murphy will come into the picture - YMMV

good point! Since I didn't do the whole gluing deal, I didn't worry too much about the WD40 on the mating surface to my cork gasket, but if/when I redo the valve cover gaskets, I will be sure to be thorough and get all the residue off with CRC electronics cleaner. I'm pretty sure I used acetone though to remove the oil film before I slapped it on the cork gaskets (also used acetone for the head mating surface) but didn't do any prep at all to the cork gasket. OP, take @fast_dave 's advice not mine, he's the real deal! As for Mr. Murphy, I'm well aware of his persnickety insistence on sticking around from start to finish in automotive projects

 

[fast_dave]

Remember, those valve covers weigh about 7 - 8 pounds each.

They're supposed to be held in place by 8 tiny valve cover bolts, on a vibrating engine, encountering widely swinging heat cycles.

Gluing the rubber gaskets to the Valve overs and Heads is the added insurance policy

 

[weasel318]

Just wanted to give everyone an update and close this thread off.

Long story short I ended up reusing my existing heads and had some local machine shop rebuild them. They might or might not have done a good job on it since I now have an oil consumption problem it seems.

However, the heads I bought from King weren't good at all. They sent me a total of 6 heads. The last two weren't damaged HOWEVER the heads didnt fit at all! The dowel pin holes were way TOOOOOOOOOOO small to fit onto my engine. I asked my local Ford techs about whether or not these engines came with a variety of dowel pins and they didnt now. Thus I came to the conclusion that the cylinder heads were cast/machined wrong. Just a tip to anyone redoing their cylinder heads, DO NOT BUY new ones if your old ones look fine. Just reuse them because if you buy new ones they DO NOT FIT!!!! If you guys have any questions let me know I will be happy to answer them!

 

[EB4X]

Off topic but Fast Dave >> "PRK (where both of us reside)"
People's Republic of Kalifornia ? Yes??

Also.... weasel318 --- Temple City....I'm guessing you are a semi-regular at Azusa ?

 

[weasel318]

Hi Hi EB4X! Not a regular but I have been there a few times with my dads Bronco. Haven't been there for a while since im not a big fan of flooding the thing and then going home to wash it out LOL. I usually do trails around in the Cajon Pass area like SugarPine Mountain and Cleghorn. Do you frequent azusa? Maybe we can go offroading sometimes!??!!!

 

[EB4X]

"not a big fan of flooding the thing" ....yeah especially now with all the rains were having that main entrance river crossing is no doubt very high right now.... and mine being STOCK HEIGHT and all! ...I'll have to wait a few months or maybe just lift my front/engine with a torsion twist...or a snork : )
But yeah...let me know...I got a buddy with a Cherokee and one with a yota.... we'll do a caravan!