P0741 - Torque Converter Clutch Circuit Performance or Stuck Off

[cjvervaet]

Hey everyone. I have a 2007 Mercury Mountaineer with a 4.0L V6 and the 5 Speed 5R55S transmission. 193K miles with a transmission fluid change about 30K miles ago.

Old Symptom: I've had the vehicle for about 4 years now, the only issue I've always had was a hard slam into reverse after I was driving it a while. I usually put it in neutral, then let it idol for about 10 seconds, then put it in reverse and it doesn't slam. That's one of the symptoms for the issue I have today that is unresolved.

New Symptom: It slips between 2nd and 3rd gear now and it threw the P0741 code at me the other day. Squeaking noise while idling coming from transmission location (YouTube Video Below).

I checked the fluid, it's black, not good at all. So I'm going to drop the pan and do the following.

What I plan on doing:

1. Drop the transmission fluid pan after it drains.
2. Replace the transmission filter.
3. Replace the solenoid pack.
4. Replace the Valve Body.
5. Inspect the reverse servo.
6. Inspect the clutch (after removing the reverse servo).
7. Reassemble everything and fill it with fluid. Take it for a test drive.

I'm wondering if I should check or replace anything else while I have it on the lift? Or if my plans are the correct approach? Maybe I'm not thinking of something I should check or replace?

 

[Rcflyer330]

Ok well I hate to tell you but you are almost certainly looking at a new transmission. It is well known on the 5r55 transmissions that the servo bores will wear and eventually you get slipping between 2 and 3 and reverse issues. let this go long enough and you eventually will break the 2 to 3 servo band and loose gears 2, 3 and reverse.

With the fluid being black you already know something is very wrong. I would be looking at a new transmission and torque converter insted of trying to repair yours its just not worth it.

 

[cjvervaet]

Ok well I hate to tell you but you are almost certainly looking at a new transmission. It is well known on the 5r55 transmissions that the servo bores will wear and eventually you get slipping between 2 and 3 and reverse issues. let this go long enough and you eventually will break the 2 to 3 servo band and loose gears 2, 3 and reverse.

With the fluid being black you already know something is very wrong. I would be looking at a new transmission and torque converter insted of trying to repair yours its just not worth it.

Thank you. What other symptoms are common for worn servo bores besides slipping?

 

[cjvervaet]

Ok well I hate to tell you but you are almost certainly looking at a new transmission. It is well known on the 5r55 transmissions that the servo bores will wear and eventually you get slipping between 2 and 3 and reverse issues. let this go long enough and you eventually will break the 2 to 3 servo band and loose gears 2, 3 and reverse.

With the fluid being black you already know something is very wrong. I would be looking at a new transmission and torque converter insted of trying to repair yours its just not worth it.

I think I'm going to try this servo kit.

2002-2010 OD & IM Kit

AJ1E Superior Solutions, LLC - Ford Servo Bore Transmission Fix Solution Kit

www.fordservoboretransmissionfixsolution.com

 

[Rcflyer330]

look at the symptoms page on the AJ1E website that you listed they have a great description of the servo issues.

Ok I'll admit I jumped the gun on needing a replacement trans (I'm not a professional) we need to do a little investigation first. Start with pulling the pan. I would pull the pan before ordering any parts just in case you do find something. look at the debris on the magnet and in the pan. There will be some metal and clutch material and that's normal but excessive amounts mean you have bigger issues. If you don't find anything concerning then order the parts you listed and replace. what you listed has been reported to fix the issues you are having. you may not need the servo repair kit. the only thing that is concerning is the noise you have.

good luck with repair I hope it does work because the parts are much cheaper then replacing the trans.

 

[cjvervaet]

look at the symptoms page on the AJ1E website that you listed they have a great description of the servo issues.

Ok I'll admit I jumped the gun on needing a replacement trans (I'm not a professional) we need to do a little investigation first. Start with pulling the pan. I would pull the pan before ordering any parts just in case you do find something. look at the debris on the magnet and in the pan. There will be some metal and clutch material and that's normal but excessive amounts mean you have bigger issues. If you don't find anything concerning then order the parts you listed and replace. what you listed has been reported to fix the issues you are having. you may not need the servo repair kit. the only thing that is concerning is the noise you have.

good luck with repair I hope it does work because the parts are much cheaper then replacing the trans.

Thank you!

 

[Blackhawkxx]

I think I'm going to try this servo kit.

2002-2010 OD & IM Kit

AJ1E Superior Solutions, LLC - Ford Servo Bore Transmission Fix Solution Kit

www.fordservoboretransmissionfixsolution.com

Be sure to let us know how it goes.

 

[cjvervaet]

OK. I should be all set for the job this weekend. I do have some questions.

The leak I'm seeing is between the bellhousing and the flywheel, right behind the oil pan for the engine. I'm wondering if the transmission gasket or the real main seal could have been damaged and causing the leaking? Getting that whining sound in the video right at that location as well.

While I have it on a hoist this weekend, is there anything I could check to determine where the leak and noise could be originating from? I'm thinking a bearing for sure. It gets louder as you rev the engine.

 

[cjvervaet]

OK. I should be all set for the job this weekend. I do have some questions.

The leak I'm seeing is between the bellhousing and the flywheel, right behind the oil pan for the engine. I'm wondering if the transmission gasket or the real main seal could have been damaged and causing the leaking? Getting that whining sound in the video right at that location as well.

While I have it on a hoist this weekend, is there anything I could check to determine where the leak and noise could be originating from? I'm thinking a bearing for sure. It gets louder as you rev the engine.

I just took it out and noticed that it stops whining when it's warmed up.

 

[Rcflyer330]

the noise could be transmission pump related or torque converter. is the fluid leak engine oil or transmission fluid? take a white paper towel and see if its redish ypu can also smell it. If you cant tell what fluid it is grab some engine oil off the dip stick and compare the color.

 

[cjvervaet]

the noise could be transmission pump related or torque converter. is the fluid leak engine oil or transmission fluid? take a white paper towel and see if its redish ypu can also smell it. If you cant tell what fluid it is grab some engine oil off the dip stick and compare the color.

I won't be able to tell the color right now since the transmission fluid is black. Once I drain it and start working on it this weekend, I'm hoping to find out more. There is an access plate right under the flywheel location, and I'm wondering if that gasket is leaking, or it's the rear main seal. Once the engine warms up, the noise stops.

 

[cjvervaet]

the noise could be transmission pump related or torque converter. is the fluid leak engine oil or transmission fluid? take a white paper towel and see if its redish ypu can also smell it. If you cant tell what fluid it is grab some engine oil off the dip stick and compare the color.

Hey everyone. I have a 2007 Mercury Mountaineer with a 4.0L V6 and the 5 Speed 5R55S transmission. 193K miles with a transmission fluid change about 30K miles ago.

Old Symptom: I've had the vehicle for about 4 years now, the only issue I've always had was a hard slam into reverse after I was driving it a while. I usually put it in neutral, then let it idol for about 10 seconds, then put it in reverse and it doesn't slam. That's one of the symptoms for the issue I have today that is unresolved.

New Symptom: It slips between 2nd and 3rd gear now and it threw the P0741 code at me the other day. Squeaking noise while idling coming from transmission location (YouTube Video Below).

I checked the fluid, it's black, not good at all. So I'm going to drop the pan and do the following.

What I plan on doing:

1. Drop the transmission fluid pan after it drains.
2. Replace the transmission filter.
3. Replace the solenoid pack.
4. Replace the Valve Body.
5. Inspect the reverse servo.
6. Inspect the clutch (after removing the reverse servo).
7. Reassemble everything and fill it with fluid. Take it for a test drive.

I'm wondering if I should check or replace anything else while I have it on the lift? Or if my plans are the correct approach? Maybe I'm not thinking of something I should check or replace?

Update.

I had it up on a hoist today and dropped the pan. I was using my friend's garage, who is a retired Ford mechanic that worked on Automatic Transmissions for 25 years. He was there today, which was a blessing. The magnet did have metal shavings, but for a vehicle with 194K miles, and with the pan never being removed before, he said that wasn't bad at all. He was actually surprised how little was in there, even without issues.
He recommended I just change the solenoid pack and valve body for today. The servo kit looks straight forward, but he did say we would need to adjust the bands once you pop that servo out of there. There were no apparent leaks around the servos, and they looked dry as a bone.

The leak I was worried about is probably the rear main seal. It's right on the rear side of the oil pan, where the transmission mates with the flywheel. That's the rear main seal area, and I hate to admit it, but I just dumped a bottle of Blue Devil in there a couple days ago for now. I'm going to switch to 10W-40 or maybe 15W-40 to slow it down. I cleaned the area up really well. When it was on the hoist, I had it running for about 45 mins or so. I didn't see any new streams of oil, so maybe that Blue Devil stuff worked, I'll keep an eye on it.

The whining stopped. It very well could be the pump was starving. Not sure, but I'll keep an eye on it.

The old valve body looked clean, no apparent blocked channels. 2 orange balls fell out of the old valve body when I was wrapping it up. Maybe that's the smoking gun?

The new solenoid pack slipped right in. I did soak it in clean fluid first, I heard you want to do that to get air bubble out of it. We'll see how that works out.

I removed the reverse servo and inspected the band i could see. I didn't see anything that looked out of the ordinary. Looked pretty clean to me.

After filling it with new fluid and running it on the hoist, I cleared the PCM and drained the capacitors so it would learn new shift points.

My first test drive went OK. It acted funky for the first mile or two. The further I drove it the better it improved. I did notice one thing, not slipping, but it's as if I wasn't getting 3rd gear from BEFORE I did these repairs. It's like I have a new gear. I can't really explain it, but when I'm accelerating it seems like there is a gear it's using that it didn't use before. Anyway, that could be the new valve body or solenoid pack doing it's job. I'm not sure, but I was happy with the first test drive for the night.

I'll send an update this week to check in on how it's going. If I feel like it's slipping still, I'll swap the servos out.

 

[cjvervaet]

Update.

I had it up on a hoist today and dropped the pan. I was using my friend's garage, who is a retired Ford mechanic that worked on Automatic Transmissions for 25 years. He was there today, which was a blessing. The magnet did have metal shavings, but for a vehicle with 194K miles, and with the pan never being removed before, he said that wasn't bad at all. He was actually surprised how little was in there, even without issues.
He recommended I just change the solenoid pack and valve body for today. The servo kit looks straight forward, but he did say we would need to adjust the bands once you pop that servo out of there. There were no apparent leaks around the servos, and they looked dry as a bone.

The leak I was worried about is probably the rear main seal. It's right on the rear side of the oil pan, where the transmission mates with the flywheel. That's the rear main seal area, and I hate to admit it, but I just dumped a bottle of Blue Devil in there a couple days ago for now. I'm going to switch to 10W-40 or maybe 15W-40 to slow it down. I cleaned the area up really well. When it was on the hoist, I had it running for about 45 mins or so. I didn't see any new streams of oil, so maybe that Blue Devil stuff worked, I'll keep an eye on it.

The whining stopped. It very well could be the pump was starving. Not sure, but I'll keep an eye on it.

The old valve body looked clean, no apparent blocked channels. 2 orange balls fell out of the old valve body when I was wrapping it up. Maybe that's the smoking gun?

The new solenoid pack slipped right in. I did soak it in clean fluid first, I heard you want to do that to get air bubble out of it. We'll see how that works out.

I removed the reverse servo and inspected the band i could see. I didn't see anything that looked out of the ordinary. Looked pretty clean to me.

After filling it with new fluid and running it on the hoist, I cleared the PCM and drained the capacitors so it would learn new shift points.

My first test drive went OK. It acted funky for the first mile or two. The further I drove it the better it improved. I did notice one thing, not slipping, but it's as if I wasn't getting 3rd gear from BEFORE I did these repairs. It's like I have a new gear. I can't really explain it, but when I'm accelerating it seems like there is a gear it's using that it didn't use before. Anyway, that could be the new valve body or solenoid pack doing it's job. I'm not sure, but I was happy with the first test drive for the night.

I'll send an update this week to check in on how it's going. If I feel like it's slipping still, I'll swap the servos out.

View attachment 441770

View attachment 441771

Cold start this morning, no whining sound. Fingers crossed!

 

[cjvervaet]

Hey everyone. I have a 2007 Mercury Mountaineer with a 4.0L V6 and the 5 Speed 5R55S transmission. 193K miles with a transmission fluid change about 30K miles ago.

Old Symptom: I've had the vehicle for about 4 years now, the only issue I've always had was a hard slam into reverse after I was driving it a while. I usually put it in neutral, then let it idol for about 10 seconds, then put it in reverse and it doesn't slam. That's one of the symptoms for the issue I have today that is unresolved.

New Symptom: It slips between 2nd and 3rd gear now and it threw the P0741 code at me the other day. Squeaking noise while idling coming from transmission location (YouTube Video Below).

I checked the fluid, it's black, not good at all. So I'm going to drop the pan and do the following.

What I plan on doing:

1. Drop the transmission fluid pan after it drains.
2. Replace the transmission filter.
3. Replace the solenoid pack.
4. Replace the Valve Body.
5. Inspect the reverse servo.
6. Inspect the clutch (after removing the reverse servo).
7. Reassemble everything and fill it with fluid. Take it for a test drive.

I'm wondering if I should check or replace anything else while I have it on the lift? Or if my plans are the correct approach? Maybe I'm not thinking of something I should check or replace?

200 miles into the repairs and a couple things.

1. No more slamming in reverse.
2. While cruising at say, 50 MPH down a flat level road, I am noticing a little flutter in RPM. Very slight, but a flutter.
3. This one has me wondering. When accelerating, sometimes it dogs when I'm in 2nd or 3rd. For those who have driven manual transmissions, it's like you hit the gas but didn't downshift. You can feel a vibration and then you downshift. Similar type of feeling with this. I let off the gas and that seems to do the trick.

I'm not sure if the shift points are still relearning or maybe my bands need adjustment or what.

Any ideas?

 

[Rcflyer330]

200 miles into the repairs and a couple things.

1. No more slamming in reverse.
2. While cruising at say, 50 MPH down a flat level road, I am noticing a little flutter in RPM. Very slight, but a flutter.
3. This one has me wondering. When accelerating, sometimes it dogs when I'm in 2nd or 3rd. For those who have driven manual transmissions, it's like you hit the gas but didn't downshift. You can feel a vibration and then you downshift. Similar type of feeling with this. I let off the gas and that seems to do the trick.

I'm not sure if the shift points are still relearning or maybe my bands need adjustment or what.

Any ideas?

glad the fix is working so far. you may want to manually reset the learned transmission tables and drive normally for a few hundred miles. If you didnt reset them then it may take 500 miles or more, I think, for them to automatically relearn.

 

[cjvervaet]

glad the fix is working so far. you may want to manually reset the learned transmission tables and drive normally for a few hundred miles. If you didnt reset them then it may take 500 miles or more, I think, for them to automatically relearn.

OK, I was wondering if there was a way to set them manually. I'm not sure how to do that. Do you know if a thread that has those instructions? Off to Google I go to see if there is instructions or a video. hahaha.

 

[cjvervaet]

Update: 05/18/2023

Hey gang, just an update for those that may need this thread for a similar issue. So my solenoid pack and valve body replacement didn't go the way I wanted. Just to catch some folks up, I did the following last Saturday.

1. Drained the transmission.
2. Dropped the pan and removed the filter, reverse servo, solenoid pack and valve body.
3. Replaced the solenoid pack and valve body with remanufactured replacement parts.
4. Replaced the filter and added new fluid.
5. Cleared the PCM and reset the TCM to re-learn the shift points.

After a few days of driving, things were going OK I suppose. No more whining noise and shifting in reverse was smooth. It would struggle up hills a tad and the RPM's would flutter at steady lower speeds (around 50 mph). On Tuesday I took it to work, about a 40 mile one way trip. On the way to work while on the expressway, it was doing great I thought. On the way back I took the back roads, about 10 miles from home it threw the "P0741 - Torque Converter Clutch Circuit Performance or Stuck Off" code at me again and was acting up. So I took it straight to a transmission shop.

I explained what it was doing to the mechanic, and what code it was throwing P0741, and what I did to it last weekend. I also explained that I have a servo kit that we could try and install if they think it's the OD or IM servos. It's my first time at this shop, and I never met this guy before, and he didn't know me from Adam. I'm not a mechanic anymore and was never a car mechanic, but I was a mechanic in the US Navy for a while. If I take something to a shop it's because I either can't figure it out myself, or I can't do it with the equipment I have at home, or both. I told the guy that I'm pretty sure it's the torque converter, but they're the experts so just call me and let me now. I think everything I said went in one ear and out the other. I don't think he understood what the servo kit was for either, but I could be wrong.

The next day he called, and told me it was throwing code P0741. No kidding. He then explained that he should swap out the entire transmission because the torque converter was stuck or switched off. For $4800 he could swap out the transmission for a used one with 115K miles on it. No thanks. I told him to just change the torque converter. We had a little back and forth, pleasant, but still a little back and forth. We landed on him changing the torque converter for $1000.

I know I could get the parts for probably half, but again, I don't have the equipment to drop the transmission and I would need some help with that as well. It's just me.

He called today and said it was done and not throwing that code anymore. I asked if they changed the fluid and he said no. No big deal with the fluid, it's 5 days old. I asked if he reset the TCM and he said no. OK fine. I reset it myself today. I crawled underneath and looked at the bell housing, it looks like they did drop the transmission. I just wanted to be sure, you never know these days.

It is probably too early to tell, but it's driving pretty darn good. Shifts smoother than I recall, doesn't struggle up a hill anymore, and it downshifts without issues when it needs to while going up hills. At slower steady speeds, the flutter is gone.

Not saying it's fixed, but I'm really hoping this did it. I still have that servo kit and I can always slap that on there if I get any more issues. That'll be the extent of it I think before I look for a replacement transmission. Wish me luck, I'll check back in after 500 miles or so to let you know how it's doing.

 

[cjvervaet]

Update: 05/20/2023

OK, so that code came back today. It's been driving great, and hasn't slipped at all and all the other symptoms have went away. I was planning a camping trip next weekend and wanted to test drive while pulling the camper. I drove it for about 40 miles this morning and on the way back, while on the highway that trouble code fired off again.

I'm lost. I changed the valve body, solenoid pack, torque converter (done by a mechanic), filter and fluid. The only thing left are the servos, which looked great when I was working on the transmission last week.

I don't know if it's some other mechanical issue, or maybe it's old and triggering that code? I would like to believe it's just old, but when it triggered the code the first time ever I was having a lot of symptoms pointing to an actual issue. I really don't know where to go from here.

 

[Blackhawkxx]

If you have any small old transmission shops in your area, maybe stop in to see if they have any ideas. The right place will talk to you if they see you know what you are talking about. Couldn't hurt as it seems you are out of ideas.

 

[cjvervaet]

Hey everyone. I have a 2007 Mercury Mountaineer with a 4.0L V6 and the 5 Speed 5R55S transmission. 193K miles with a transmission fluid change about 30K miles ago.

Old Symptom: I've had the vehicle for about 4 years now, the only issue I've always had was a hard slam into reverse after I was driving it a while. I usually put it in neutral, then let it idol for about 10 seconds, then put it in reverse and it doesn't slam. That's one of the symptoms for the issue I have today that is unresolved.

New Symptom: It slips between 2nd and 3rd gear now and it threw the P0741 code at me the other day. Squeaking noise while idling coming from transmission location (YouTube Video Below).

I checked the fluid, it's black, not good at all. So I'm going to drop the pan and do the following.

What I plan on doing:

1. Drop the transmission fluid pan after it drains.
2. Replace the transmission filter.
3. Replace the solenoid pack.
4. Replace the Valve Body.
5. Inspect the reverse servo.
6. Inspect the clutch (after removing the reverse servo).
7. Reassemble everything and fill it with fluid. Take it for a test drive.

I'm wondering if I should check or replace anything else while I have it on the lift? Or if my plans are the correct approach? Maybe I'm not thinking of something I should check or replace?

Final Update 05/31/2023

Welp, third gear blew. I ended up putting in a new transmission. Ran great over the weekend. Got a new issue now. FML.