Parasitic Draw - Fuse 25 - Another relay box?

[Godzilla2y]

Oh great and wise forum members. I've got a parasitic draw problem on The Archbishop (96 4.0 EB).

With everything off, there's a draw of approximately 0.5A (ouch)

I know some of this (about 0.15A) is due to the JBL system--that'll probably be a separate post.

The rest of the draw comes from Fuse 25. In my 'sploder, that's for the instrument panel and the GEM/CTM.

I've seen plenty of other forum posts where, when people had this issue, they found it to be the Battery Saver relay needing replaced, which lives in a relay box under the steering column, to the right of the pedals (in LHD vehicles). VERY fun relay box to get to.

I found the relay box (Relay Module, as it's called in the wiring diagrams). I've found two relays that, when I pull them, decrease the current draw on the battery.

One of the relays drawing power is a square. The other relay drawing power is a rectangle, right next to it.

How do I figure out what these relays go to? I have the wiring diagrams. I have the service manual. I think I mostly just need help navigating this dinosaur of a program (or one of the old timers to look at a picture I send and go "yup that's the radio, happens all the time".

For the rectangular relay, I plugged one of the ones from the other slots into its slot and the current draw returned. This suggests, to me, that the component on the other end of the relay is responsible for the draw (and not the relay itself).

I did not look for a replacement square relay to swap into the square relay's slot.

HOWEVER. Even with these two relays (and the JBL system) figured out, there is still about 90mA of current being drawn by something else. Are there other relay module or relay box locations that receive power from Fuse 25? How do I find what is slurping up this last 90mA? Any help is appreciated.

To sum it up:
1. How do I know what each relay is for in the relay module (under the steering column, to the right of the pedals)?
2. What else takes power from Fuse 25 (7.5A)?
3. Why does every problem I get with this Explorer have to be a whole doozie? Why I can't just get the simple problems?

 

[Pete Deering]

Oh great and wise forum members. I've got a parasitic draw problem on The Archbishop (96 4.0 EB).

With everything off, there's a draw of approximately 0.5A (ouch)

I know some of this (about 0.15A) is due to the JBL system--that'll probably be a separate post.

The rest of the draw comes from Fuse 25. In my 'sploder, that's for the instrument panel and the GEM/CTM.

I've seen plenty of other forum posts where, when people had this issue, they found it to be the Battery Saver relay needing replaced, which lives in a relay box under the steering column, to the right of the pedals (in LHD vehicles). VERY fun relay box to get to.

I found the relay box (Relay Module, as it's called in the wiring diagrams). I've found two relays that, when I pull them, decrease the current draw on the battery.

One of the relays drawing power is a square. The other relay drawing power is a rectangle, right next to it.

How do I figure out what these relays go to? I have the wiring diagrams. I have the service manual. I think I mostly just need help navigating this dinosaur of a program (or one of the old timers to look at a picture I send and go "yup that's the radio, happens all the time".

For the rectangular relay, I plugged one of the ones from the other slots into its slot and the current draw returned. This suggests, to me, that the component on the other end of the relay is responsible for the draw (and not the relay itself).

I did not look for a replacement square relay to swap into the square relay's slot.

HOWEVER. Even with these two relays (and the JBL system) figured out, there is still about 90mA of current being drawn by something else. Are there other relay module or relay box locations that receive power from Fuse 25? How do I find what is slurping up this last 90mA? Any help is appreciated.

To sum it up:
1. How do I know what each relay is for in the relay module (under the steering column, to the right of the pedals)?
2. What else takes power from Fuse 25 (7.5A)?
3. Why does every problem I get with this Explorer have to be a whole doozie? Why I can't just get the simple problems.

Response
1. That might be your 4x4 relays. Its a module with a I'd number on it.
2. It should be mark ( label) on the fuse box lid.
3. Ford are built tough.
" I finally get to fuse number 25 on the interior fuse panel, which is labeled Speedometer, and GEM system, and the amp draw drops to .131amps, "
? Do you have automatic light features.
? Are you having problems with interior lights?

 

[FordFlintrock]

When measuring stand by draws it is good practice to give time for vehicle to settle untouched for a requisite 20-40 mins. After that time what you got for draw is what you got. Do you have an under hood light?

 

[Godzilla2y]

Back at it again this morning, made some discoveries re: Fuse 25.

First up, some pictures of the Relay Module I'm talking about, along with the pulled drawing relays:
(Picture of the relay module from the door)
(Picture of the Relay Module from the pedals)
(Picture of the Relay Module with the pulled parasitic relays)

Using a relay from the fuse box under the hood, I discovered that the square relay is itself bad. Swapping a different relay into that slot does NOT draw any power.

Using several other rectangular relays in the other open space, I discovered that pulled rectangular relay is good. Power is still drawn (about 110mA) with a new relay plugged in. This relay controls, at the very least, the interior lights (tested by opening the door and plugging the relay in to see the lights come on, then unplugging it to see the lights turn off).

With both of these relays removed, there is still a 90mA current draw from something. I need to find what that something is.

I have plugged the interior lights relay (rectangular one) back in and now have a current draw of about 200mA. I came inside to post this and give the vehicle that time for everything to sort itself out (in case there's something that stops after 20 minutes or more).

 

[Godzilla2y]

Response
1. That might be your 4x4 relays. Its a module with a I'd number on it.
2. It should be mark ( label) on the fuse box lid.
3. Ford are built tough.
" I finally get to fuse number 25 on the interior fuse panel, which is labeled Speedometer, and GEM system, and the amp draw drops to .131amps, "
? Do you have automatic light features.
? Are you having problems with interior lights?

1. I can't find anything that would suggest the 4x4 relays run through this 7.5A fuse, especially considering everything else that goes through this fuse.
2. The lid for the Relay Module does not include labels about what each relay is for.

?1. Automatic lights, as in automatic headlights? No.
?2. No interior light issues that I know of

 

[Godzilla2y]

When measuring stand by draws it is good practice to give time for vehicle to settle untouched for a requisite 20-40 mins. After that time what you got for draw is what you got. Do you have an under hood light?

After about 10 seconds, current draw drops to a consistent level and stays consistent for an hour or more (haven't tested for longer).

Yes, I have an under hood light. I have made sure to unplug it and/or exclude its current draw from these measurements.

 

[Godzilla2y]

Last night I plugged the relay for the interior lights back in and tried pulling each of the relays in the back, by the rear windshield washer fluid tank. None of those reduced the current draw.

After I got that all back together (and fished out the screw that I dropped, damn thing), I turned to the radio.

First unplugged the cigar lighter. Nothing. Then the 4wd control switch. Current draw dropped to 0.8 while on the 200mA setting.

Then things got confusing. I don't know if I'm just a dummy, or my DMM is broken, or both.

I turned my DMM dial to 20mA and the reading went from 0.8 to 0.08. I turned the dial to 2A to see shat happened and it read 0.08. Back to 200mA, 0.8.

"Maybe it's a nearly imperceptible low current," I thought. I plugged the 4wd controls back in and the current draw was still at the mysterious 0.something8.

After that, I took the amp inside (other post) and took it apart. Came back out to the barn and discovered the DMM had become disconnected. Fixed the connections and the draw was back to the original levels.

So I'm at a loss. On one hand, I wonder if this extra current I've seen this whole time has been the battery saver relay. But wouldn't pulling the saver relay drop the current? On the other hand, I wonder if my DMM is faulty--how can the reading be the same despite a measurement factor difference of 100? On... one foot..., I wonder if I've just been also battling poor connection issues.

Today I'll try securing the DMM probes better. I'll also disconnect and reconnect the 4wd controls while measuring to see if I can replicate yesterday's results. Anything else I should try?

 

[Godzilla2y]

DMM probe connection issues sorted.

With the interior lights relay unplugged and the bad square relay unplugged from the Relay Module, current draw is approximately 110mA.

I started unplugging things from the radio/center console area. After unplugging the rear wiper switch, parasitic draw dropped to about 30mA. That's a CONSIDERABLE improvement. So now to find if it's the switch itself or some other issue.

 

[fosterzcj]

Could it be a pinched wire somewhere along the line for the rear wiper blade? My 05 had one similar that I had to separate and insulate.

 

[Godzilla2y]

Could it be a pinched wire somewhere along the line for the rear wiper blade? My 05 had one similar that I had to separate and insulate.

That's possible. I took apart the rear wiper switch and found nothing particularly concerning. It looks like a potentiometer to me. The switch knob uses a spring-loaded ball system to click at different locations.

Luckily for me, there's basically only one way this thing goes back together (I wasn't prepared when prying it open and it flew apart).

The wipers and contacts seem mostly fine, though that top-left pad looks like it may be rubbed away a little (at about 9 o'clock, if we imagine the circle of pads as a clock), and the inner wiper looks like it may have something going on (about 10:30 on a clock, in the inner ring in picture 2).

I'm going to clean this switch up, introduce it to some fresh new silicone dielectric grease, and reassemble it.

Tonight I'm hoping to get the interior panel of the liftgate removed--UPS is supposed to be bringing me a new hatch/glass handle. I'm going to check all the wires and plugs for the rear wiper while I have it apart.

 

[fosterzcj]

I'd also check inside the rubber boot where the wires run to the wiper motor. That's where mine went wrong. But any of those flexible boots are going to have worn wires eventually

 

[Godzilla2y]

Cleaned the switch up with some 91% isopropyl alcohol. Looks a lot better now. There are some obvious wear marks on the contact pads, but nothing too concerning for a 30-year-old switch in a truck with almost 120,000 miles.

 

[fosterzcj]

I'm not seeing anything bad on the board contacts. Leads me to believe there's a short somewhere. Have you tested the wiper switch?

 

[Godzilla2y]

I'm not seeing anything bad on the board contacts. Leads me to believe there's a short somewhere. Have you tested the wiper switch?

No. I don't know wtf is going on. When I posted earlier, the current draw dropped 70mA when I unplugged the rear wiper switch.

I had some familial obligations to attend to, so I unplugged it all and hooked up the battery charger to let it recover from all the tests over the past few days.

Came back to it, got the multimeter hooked back up, and the parasitic draw was up to 1.2 without plugging anything (radio, rear wiper switch, fog lamps, etc) back in.

So I DID plug all that stuff back in, and the parasitic drain didn't change. Unplugged. Replugged. Unplugged. Replugged. Nothing.

I did find that unplugging the connector closest to the driver-side for the hvac controls dropped it a little. And unplugging the middle connector in the GEM dropped it a little. But, with the two of those unplugged, I could only get it down to about 65mA or so (instead of the 30 from earlier in the day).

 

[fosterzcj]

Do you by chance have an anti theft system in ot?

 

[Godzilla2y]

I'm very tired. Today has not been as productive as I would have liked. I also had a radiator fan, liftgate handle, belt and idler pulley, and power steering hose delivered today.

Once I'd get tired of trying to find the electrical gremlin, I'd switch to something else.

• Busted off both the bolts from the old handle, so now I'll need to get new 1/4 28 nuts for the new one. Looks like the whole locking assembly is seized, too. How does it get so rusty inside that thing??
• Can't find the radiator clutch fan tool, so I'll have to rent one of those from the tool store.
• Can't find the electrical gremlins.

I got a few things plugged back together and tried testing a couple odds and ends to see if everything worked as well I remembered (everything did not, in fact, work as well as I thought).

The driver's door lock button doesn't work, but the unlock button does.

I remembered from many forum posts here and many youtube videos that the wires in the driver's door boot can get brittle and break. Took that all apart. Wires look brand new everywhere I can see them. Checked the parasitic draw while this connection was unplugged, still 110mA.

Then I remembered a forum post or video from I can't remember when to next check the wires under the trim by the back driver door.

Checked the harness at the rear of the back driver's side seat, which looks fine. Didn't want to get into tearing apart that part of the trim tonight, even though the whole back is currently opened up.

Then I remembered some more:

• A long, long time ago, this thing went through a flood. I don't know how high the water got inside, but I'm guessing it got inside at least a little.
• In 2012 (several years after the flood), I was trying to get this thing running so I could drive it to and from school. At that time, the interior lights would not shut off. 2012-me solved this by cutting the wire for the back driver's side door. (Thanks, kid.)
• Other thread is looking like there is a short in the stereo outputs somewhere...

I think I really need to tear up the trim by that back driver's side door. I think I'll find the source of a whole bunch of issues somewhere in there.

 

[fosterzcj]

I wish you the best when you do tear up the molding if it was flood damaged you may find a nasty surprise but would explain some electrical gremlins. As for un seizing the lock assembly simple wd 40 or pb buster should work with slowly and gently working the key in and out.

 

[Godzilla2y]

I got the rear hatch handle replaced, and felt ready to try the electrical work again after letting myself cool on that subject.

Started taking the trim and the seats out to get a better view of those harnesses at the lowest point in the truck, and I broke the 15mm bolt on the passenger side. Off to an excellent start.

I called it a night shortly afterwards, but I did get some promising pictures of the harness on the driver's sid, right before my phone died:

 

[Turdle]

You've been asked twice . Does this explorer have any type of anti theft system, factory or aftermarket?

 

[Godzilla2y]

You've been asked twice . Does this explorer have any type of anti theft system, factory or aftermarket?

I've avoided the question so far because I'm not sure of the answer. And because I've been making progress with my investigation in other realms.

I think it does not have a factory anti-theft system. I just double-checked: closed all the doors, hooked the battery back up, and turned the key on--no indicator light related to any PATS system turned on with that initial key-on cycle. What else can I do to verify if it does or does not have one?

I know it does not have an aftermarket one.