How to: 4R70W Rebuild Diary Discussion, Questions, ETC

[97BlackX5.0]

I did not have a tranny jack. I did similiar to what you did... Ramps in the front and then jacked the rear up and put it on jackstands. I used a floor jack to support the tranny after i unbolted the rear support and..... it kinda fell out of the truck off the jack after the last bolt. One tip though... its hard to move around under there with a floor jack while your trying to unbolt stuff.... so before I had things too loose I sed a ratchet tie down between the frame rails to support the back end of the tranny. (make sure its a good one) I did not have to move my truck so I cant help you on your ramp problem... I would say jack up one side... put a jack stand under it then add a block of wood to the jack and go higher till you can slide it under the other side... then repeat.... Now to get it back in.... I sort of crawled uner the truck with the trannyhad my ratchet die down a little loose. pushed it up and got the converter bolts in the flexplate then stuck the tail end in the tiedown and ratcheted it right up into place....

 

[97BlackX5.0]

also the dipstick bolt that is on the backside of the passenger side head of the engine is almost impossible to get to.... I was able to get the dipstick out of the tranny without loosening or removing this bolt..... but it wasnt easy....

 

[Glacier991]

As for those parts, I do not know what they are. I am not fully into the VB yet, but I doubt they came OUT of the VB. They look for all the world like spacers. Sorry I am no help.

 

[supra77r]

97Black....
Did you have a lip seal protector when you put the seal on the direct clutch piston and put the piston in the drum? I dont have a protector and was wondering if you didnt have one, what did you do to work around it?

 

[Glacier991]

You really should use a lip seal protector.... borrow a set of tools for the 4R70W.

 

[supra77r]

Chris, I sent you a email about TOOLS.

I know I probly am going to have to use the protector for safety and because I tried to get the piston in the drum and I cant even get it to go all the way down. I tried really hard and it just wont go! I got it all the way down on one side but not the other. Besides, your right it was not going in the right way for a good seal the way I am doing it.

I dont know if this matters at all, but I got my new seals from TransUSA and they are just a little bit different then the old one (stock) I took off. It has a little bit bigger of lip to it which makes it lip over the piston alot more than the old one (stock). Basically its just a little bit bigger in width.

Talked to the guy at TransPartsUSA (great part place and the best customer support ever!) and he said that they (ford) used to use the wider ones along time ago on trannys and then started using the thinner ones and then went back to the wider ones now because they worked better he said. So it seems like it would be a little harder to get the piston all the way down into the drum with this newer (wider) style seal to me? Not sure.

 

[97BlackX5.0]

No I didnt have any special tools... I just lubed everything with tranny fluid and then vaseline... (the tranny that is) and it all slid into place without any problems... The direct clutch spring pack was probably the hardest part.... I just started putting C-clamps on it till I ran out and then i was just able to get the snap rinn on.... Then I realized I forgot a seal on the main plunger and had to do it all over again. The accumulator pistons I used a wooden handle of a ball peen hammer.... i would hold the wooden handle in one hand and then with the snap wring on the pliers and helping to push the wooden handle in with the other hand I would quickly try and get it in the bore with the other.... In other words I pushed down on the hammer with both hands while one was also holding the pliers and slid the snapring in at the same time and then once the snap wring was in the bore then i let the piston push it back up into the groove. I used a motorcraft rebuild kit that I got off ebay and 90 percent of the seals were exactly the same. for the front pump seal and the like i used a big socket as a driving surface or a block of wood.

 

[97BlackX5.0]

those pieces are not anything inside the valve body I am almost sure of it. however I would guess that they came off the slide rod that manually shifts the piston or the range controller on the side of the case of the tranny or the park pawl mechanism.

 

[Glacier991]

I do loan rebuild tools for the 4R70W, with a few exceptions of tools that are either fragile or have cutting edges on them. I have virtually every tool made to rebuild this transmission. I require a deposit at LEAST equal to the tool's value (I do not want to be in the business of selling tools, just loaning them) and you pay shipping both ways. The Diary shows all the tools in use as needed. I HIGHLY recommend lip seal installers - can you do it without them if you are careful? Usually yes... but... not 100%.

For those wanting solid seals on the output shaft where it enters the direct drum I can do that for you. I can also install clutches in clutch packs and set the clearances for you if you prefer. I can sleeve a case but by the time you ship it to me, you may find a local place that can do it cheaper than the round trip postage plus my cost.

But, if you aren't willing to invest in at least a dial caliper and maybe a few other tools, you won't want to borrow my tools. You can do it is stages, but the entire set requires a pretty hefty deposit and is rather heavy.

 

[BrooklynBay]

Here is an alternative to buying specific lip seal installation tools for each transmission: http://www.transmissionpartsusa.com/Universal_lip_seal_installer_tool_p/300-0000t0015.htm

 

[BrooklynBay]

Here is a picture of that universal lip seal installation tool:

 

[supra77r]

I appreciate everyones help. I went to a tranny shop and the builder there was really nice and let me use some of his tools (lip seal protectors) and all went well today. Seals in direct clutch in nice and good.

Chris, the only tool I am interested in now is the one that installs/sizes the solid seals on stub of output shaft.

Oh and I found out what those parts were in my last pic....I will get the name of them soon, but they go in the top part of case that connects to VB. They both fit in one of those ton of wholes and from what I understand are useless and no need to reinstall! Ill get the name of them soon, bothering me I cant remember the name.

 

[Glacier991]

That tool is one of the "fragile" ones. If you send me your direct drum and output shaft I can install those seals and send it back inserted in the direct drum. The tool is about $60 and too "fragile" to loan out. Odds on it would come back with a piece broken sooner or later. I'd rather be the one who breaks it as opposed to someone else who might not want to buy a new one.

[late edit] Those sleeves are used to mate up a smaller locator pin used in later model VB's. there are 2 pins and hence 2 inserts that allow use of VB's with smaller locator pins! I'll post the FORD PN here _________.

 

[Glacier991]

Well... it is looking like the trans in this thread might have found a home.....I'll be delighted it this works out.

 

[Glacier991]

The trannie is sold. Once I finish it I will probably do one more, but only as a build so spec for someone. I need to get to the transfer case rebuilds and the Frankentranny rebuilds.

 

[cknorw]

For more info, read my first post under "Glacier-back from vacation"

Regarding the pump, I think i'm good with bleed hole at 12'oclock. My repair manual says 12, but the insert in my rebuild kit says 2. I noticed the pump pic in the rebuild diary is at 12.

Also, after figuring out how to measure it, it looks like I have more than .025" clearance between the stub shaft and the output shaft inside the direct. Given Glacier's advice, I think i'm good there too. Plan on rebuilding this weekend.

Any advice on filling/initial running of a newly rebuilt tranny?

 

[Glacier991]

On the 4R70W put a quart or so of ATF in the converter thru the plug hole and replug it....Refill the tranny to spec.... start up and run it in neitral a few mins. Shutdown and let it sit 30 mins.... the start and drive it.

Reasoning... you SHOULD have soaked the frictions pre build. This process will fill the TC, and coat the frictions in ATF... letting them sit another 30 mins ensures they are well soaked and will not burn.

 

[cknorw]

Update... Transmission installed Saturday, new intake manifold installed Sunday. Cranked car on Monday (dead battery late Sunday) and ran as suggested. After 5 min run time and 30 min off, cranked again and put in reverse and drive several times. Engaged well. Took it on short trip round the block and it drove great. Had all gears, changed smoothly. No warning lights. Took car on short trip Tuesday with no hick-ups. Tranny working great.

One small item I had in it pre-rebuild and post-rebuild. I notice when it changes from 2nd to 3rd, 3rd doesn't hold unless under at least moderate load. If driving under normal conditions, seems to want to change from 2nd through 3rd into 4th. I thought it would clear up with valve body overhaul, but it didn't. I changed the EPC solenoid, but not the SS-1 or SS-2 solenoid (I know I should have). Could either be the culprit? Think I will replace at first service to be sure. Any thoughts?

 

[Glacier991]

2nd gear has SS1 and SS2 both "off". 3rd Gear has SS1 "off" and SS2 "on". So if you had a culprit it might be SS2, but I am not sure what is causing your problem, it could be input related, and in fact I'd bet on that more than the solenoids. But if you felt you wanted to try replacing a solenoid, I'd replace SS2.

My bet is on a sensor input issue. Another place where the transmission tester would be worth its weight in gold.

 

[cknorw]

Please elaborate. Can you describe in some detail sensor input? How to check? Should it trigger a warning light? The transmission tester, is it a hydraulic or electrical tester? Thanks for all your input.