95-01 SAS via early Bronco feeler

[quikstang2]

I've been itching for another truck for a while now, so...
I'd like to grab a V8 Explorer/Mountaineer and throw some parts on it that are lying around. Dad has a 1975 Bronco that's essentially complete. It was sold to him as a parts truck, and the thing is rotted so bad now that it's basically only worth what its title/frame will go for. But pretty much everything is there.

I've read up as much as I could on the SAS swap, and I know it's pretty much a "do my own thing" kinda deal. I'd just like some pointers on how much of the Bronco stuff I should hold on to before I part out whatever is salvageable that I don't need, because I need all the room I can get. The more Bronco stuff I can use, the better... so I don't have to buy anything else.

Also, what Explorer/Mountaineer would be easiest to start off with? 2WD or AWD? Obviously the newer motor makes more power, but the older trans/t-case is more stout, and there's no emissions laws in FL so I've got no problems with backdating to the carb... but if I could reprogram the computer to run the newer motor with the old trans, then that would be cool too.


Anyways, the options are wide open. Throw me all the ideas, suggestions, tips you have. Be as detailed as you want to be.
As far as height goes, I don't need anything larger than 35" tires. If I can clear larger with the Bronco parts, great. If not, cool. If I can only go 33"s, no worries there either. I'm aiming more for a clean stock look, nothing too extreme. That's kinda my style: factory never made it this way, but you'd swear it was stock.

 

[gavin]

basically the only things worthwhile keeping would be the axles, really.

if you get a 2WD Explorer, you'd still have to swap the transmission for a 4WD one plus get a transfer case.
You also don't want to use the AWD transfer case; but in that case, all you would need to swap out would be the t-case for a 4406.

There would be absolutely no sense in keeping/using the carb'ed Bronco motor if you get an EFI V8.

And the V8 Explorers 4R70W is a stout transmission. It's also used (or was used) in F150's with the 5.0. The 4R70W is an AOD-E with a wide gear-set.

 

[quikstang2]

So the coils and leafs are useless? Any of the drive shafts? Coil buckets, or are the ones on the Explorer good enough?

I don't mind having to swap the trans in a 2WD for the '75 Bronco one. We had the 4R70W in an '87 Bronco and it was terrible.

And since I'd rather use the Bronco trans, if going with the carb motor is easier than making the EFI one work without the stock trans, then I'll go with the carb motor... or carb the Explorer one for better heads and such. So there is sense in going carb. I just wanted to know if there were any more options I haven't seen with keeping the EFI while using the older trans.

 

[gavin]

ok, so the coils may be useful. Coil buckets possibly, since the 2nd Explorers don't have coil buckets.
leaves? not sure. Depends on their length vs length of Explorer leaves. Unless you wouldn't mind doing more work moving the forward spring hangar if the lengths are different.

you'd get a lot better idea on this stuff though, looking through some of the SAS threads.

and your 87 Bronco wouldn't have had the 4R70W
AOD.

AOD-E didn't come out until 1992.
4R70W came out in '93.

Some good info on the AODE and 4R70W
http://www.becontrols.com/tech/ch2aodefund.htm

 

[quikstang2]

Ok, technically you're right... but it's still an AOD, and I do not like it. IF its drastically better than the older versions, I'd consider it for ease of swap, but I'd still rather use the mechanical bits off the Bronco over the electric ones on the Explorer... because the guy helping me repair/build it won't touch electrics, and I prefer mechanical things like levers over figity things like buttons. I know... bear with me. Thanks for that link though. I'll go through it before I make any final descisions.

I went through all the SAS threads I could find, and tried searching for Bronco stuff... didn't see anything mentioning it, probably because there are better options. I've just got a parts truck that I'm assuming I could make work, so why not? I don't mind having to move things around on the frame.

Really just trying to make a list of everything I could possibly use off the Bronco before I get rid of it and later realize I threw away a free part, and now I've gotta pay for another one.

 

[gavin]

well, since you don't know exactly what you're wanting to do yet, keep the drivetrain at least. Motor, t-case, trans, and both axles. Coils may be okay, but you may end up needing taller ones. Wouldn't hurt to keep them for the initial mock-up though.
Leaves are tough to say. I don't know what the length of the EB leaf packs are compared to the Explorer leaf pack. I fthey are longer, it may be worth keeping them. If they are shorter, probably not so much. Also need to verify whether or not both leaf packs are the same width. If they are, they could be worth keeping. If not, they wouldn't.

oh, possibly the steering box off the EB. I'm not sure what box people are using for a SAS, but I would think an EB box would work (assuming it does have power steering, of course).

and yeah, the AOD is essentially an improved C4. The AOD-E is an improvement to the AOD, plus added electronic control. The 4R70W then improved upon the AOD-E.

 

[dhkmom48]

Just throwing this out here but why not find a body to swap onto the Bronco frame?

Seems you want to keep most of those parts anyways.

Maybe a 2 dr Explorer has a close wheelbase?

Or can you stretch the rear of the Bronco frame and slide the rear axle back to fit an Explorer body?

Seems to me that would be the least amount of work and/or money to invest...

 

[quikstang2]

Just got some more specs off dad... it's a 289 and not the 302. I'm definitely leaning more towards trying to chip the computer to run the stock Ex/Mounty motor with the Bronco trans.
I do have a somewhat direct replacement for the Bronco's motor though. The LTD's 3.8L is dead, and it's got an AOD in it so that might be the new home for the Bronco's motor. Beats having to find an A4LD, wiring, ECU and other bits to make the 2.3L I have fit.

gavin - Yeah, I'll probably have to hold on to whatever parts I can, then sell what I don't need later if I can find someone who needs them. I'll have to get into where the truck is and start measuring what I can as I take the rusty slush of a body off it. I'll just have to search/ask around if they match the Ex/Mounty close enough before I get into buying one.
The EB does have power steering, good call on that. Not sure if it'll go in easy, but it might be usable.
I know all those variants are supposed to be better than the original C4, but after using both, I know that's not the case. Also, the Bronco has a Dana20 gear driven transfer case. Much more stout than anything since. I'm just leaning this way now. If it's not going to work, or is outside what I can do, then I could just save the drive train and throw it in a 4x4 Ranger frame, then do a frame swap on my truck Wishful thinking...

dhkmom48 - Makes sense, but we've had pretty good offers on just the frame/title in the past. If someone can rebuild it off the frame, or save another EB, then I'd rather see that happen instead of me hacking up the frame when I can just hack up and Explorer frame that's not quite so rare. Selling the Bronco frame should offset a good amount of my costs on this as well, and I might take the time and effort to fully box the Explorer frame anyways.

 

[gavin]

Also, the Bronco has a Dana20 gear driven transfer case. Much more stout than anything since. I'm just leaning this way now. If it's not going to work, or is outside what I can do, then I could just save the drive train and throw it in a 4x4 Ranger frame, then do a frame swap on my truck Wishful thinking...

yeah, the Dana20 is definitely a great t-case. But may need to measure it and compare it to a 4406. The BW4406 is already a tight fit on the 4 doors. The 4406 is even a bit smaller than the older 1356.

 

[quikstang2]

Wasn't aware of there being such a tight fit there... Hmmm...
I need to stop by and look at the Bronco soon. If the frame isn't gone I may save up for a fiberglass tub. I've seen a couple EBs rolling around recently, and I get jealous.

At the very least, I can get measurements on all this stuff for everyone if there's an interest in the future.

 

[4pullingGM]

The broncoII's have the same wheelbase as the early bronco. Explorers have a longer wheelbase. Sounds like an awesome project though!