Beach Driving - Manual v. Auto Tranny

[PghBill]

I am on one of my periodic trips to Outer Banks, NC. This is not a how to drive on the beach question. Rather, why my '97 with the auto trans seem to perform less sure-footed on the sand than my '91 with the manual.

With the '91, I could put it in low range and first gear, ease out the clutch and it would go through any kind of sand. With the '91, I put it in low range, gear 1 and it has a tendency to want to dig itself in.

Also, on the '91, in high range and loose sand and any given gear, the truck would turn where I wanted it to turn, even when applying more throttle. The '97 seems to want to go straight if I apply more throttle in a turn.

Dropping a manual tranny in my '97 is not an option. BTW, I air down the '97 just like I did the '91 - to about 20 psi. I'm just trying to understand the difference between the the performance of the two trannies and looking for some tips to maximize perfromance on the beach.

Thanks!

 

[PicoG4]

Couple Possibilities:
1 the Rear end Gear Ratio
Traditonally autos are much better on the beach and the more weight displacement the better. If your 97 is geared more for acceleration your going to throw sand.
The key to driving on sand is wide tires, a slow start an keeping momentum. Id take the tire pressure down even lower. I run at 15 on the beach.
And agressive tread is not nesssisarily a good thing. Alot of the locals that go on to the beach with 2wd "which i don't recommend" actually run radial car type tires on their trucks. With a less agressive tread your alot more likley to float in the sand rather than dig
Oh yeah I like the quotes when we couldn't keep the "Beatings" shirts on the shelves last summer

 

[Doug]

Your manual transmission had a lower first gear than your automatic transmission. the manual has something like a 2.8 to 1 ratio while the automatic transmission has a 2.3 to 1 ratio and then your axle ratio is also going to play a big role in how the vehicle is going to act.

 

[unclemeat]

Did the 91 have a limited slip differential?

 

[PghBill]

Hey guys, thanks for the insights!

The rear ratio for the '97 is 3.78 (if my memory serves me - its night and I don't feel like crawling under to look at the tag). The '91 is stock but I don't think it has limited anything.

The difference in overall gearing makes sense. I find that if I go slow and easy on the throttle, it works OK. Also, I found it helps to keep O/D off. One thing, though, the X as I have it set up is no speed demon on the sand. When it hits a soft spot, speed drops and it downshifts. (Is that why they call it an "Automatic???")

BTW, saw an AWD Mountaineer buried up to the rails at Oregon Inlet this afternoon. After digging and airing down, he got out. The same thing happened to a Suzuki whatever. Embarassing!

 

[FordZilla]

I've been riding on and in the Nags Head beaches since '72! Been stuck a few times

From what I can tell sand driving is all about torque and weight distribution. Some rigs "float" and some don't.

Tires help alot and you don't want any sort of mud grip or all terrain. Wide bald street tires are the best short of a big horsepower nonstreetable paddle tire. Run 'em wide and low.

Also you will notice different types of sand....watch out for the coarse "red" sand....gravely and easy to bog down in. Stay in that nice fine "yella" sand. Test your rig on the ramp coming over the dunes....if it can handle the powder you'll do fine on the hard packed sand of the tide line. Oregon inlet is a cakewalk compared to alot of the sand you will find in Nags head, KDH, and North to Corolla and the Va. line.

About your difference in the two X's....one has an SOHC and one the OHV? Maybe one made better torque in the first gear range?

Most likely it was tires, air pressure, and vehicle weight/distribution which made the difference. Balance the weight in your rig differently and see what it does for you. Put that cooler full of chopper blues in the back with the beer cooler.

I've ridden in alot of "NC beach buggies". Some of the best were '72 Blazer, '74 Landcruiser, '74 Suburban with full time 4WD, etc.

Two wheel drivers can go places you would bet they couldn't in a properly set up rig. The best sand vehicle I ever rode in was an '88 Oldsmobile station wagon with a 403 and p265's. It would go anywhere. The interior was stripped and the doors were removed. Made alot of big truck guys look silly.

 

[PghBill]

Originally posted by FordZilla
I've been riding on and in the Nags Head beaches since '72! Been stuck a few times. . . Also you will notice different types of sand....watch out for the coarse "red" sand.... .About your difference in the two X's....one has an SOHC and one the OHV? Maybe one made better torque in the first gear range?

I'm relatively new - haven't got stuck yet, but a couple of 'almosts' - the fisrt time my wife drove into the course red sand - just backed it out.

FordZilla, you are probably familiar with the Conch St. ramp - this spring, the drop to the beach is over 10 feet due to beach erosion - and steep. Of course, I got down OK, but I could not go back up with the '97 - had to go south to the next ramp near Nags Head Inn.

BTW, both have the OHV. From what I gather, the gearing in the two are different. The '91 definitely is better.

OH, well, the Nags Head beaches are now closed until October 1. Maybe I'll try again in the fall.

 

[FordZilla]

We always moved down to KDH for summer vacation during college. Best memories. When I was a kid growing up in Va.Beach you could still get on the beach in Sandbridge and drive down to Duck. It was only about 30 miles on the beach. Then they closed the beach for the refuges and everyone had to drive around Currituck Sound. I have photos of all us kids playing with the dog on top of Penny's Hill, with a 70's something Landcruiser in the background. Can't drive on the dunes anymore.

Haven't been out to Nags Head but a few times in the last couple of years. It has grown up so much, but still a great place to unwind.

That gearing must be the key. My '91 has 3.73's with the traction lock. I wonder how that will do in the red sand? Might not want to find out!

Penny's Hill is a big dune similiar to Jockey's Ridge. Back in the day everyone would test there rig on the climb to the top. As I recall the Landcruiser had to make a couple of runs at it. If you bogged down during the attempt you had to back down the steep slope at high speed. Pretty exciting for an 8 year old.

It's just an interesting place. When I was working on a house piling crew during school, I was invited into one of the old beachfront cottages. It is in the South KDH area. Anyway these folks had original photographs of the Wright Brothers flying gliders hanging on their wall. Bet the Smithsonian would like to look at those.

Sorry to get off topic. I bet a re-gear and maybe an exhaust/chip will get you where you want to be.

 

[unclemeat]

FordZillia,

I have been to Penny Hill. The first time I ever went wheeling was in a army surplus jeep, climbing Penny Hill. That was in the the late 60s.

I think that the sand between Buxton and the Pea Island refugee is the trickest.

 

[zavetsky]

I know this is a mighty old thread, but I searched for OBX and found it...<grin>

That Oregon inlet strand can be TOUGH.....

I lost a tranny there 3 years ago (the warranty on the new one runs out end of September...just after my planned trip there this year!!)...Because of how much water/sun that strip of sand gets, it gets SOFT and DEEP.....plus, I think the extra high winds that usually are in that area are also what makes it tougher.....

I am from Pittsburgh too, and LOVE the OBX....Go tehre pretty much every year...I used to take my ATVs down too, but they made them illegal everywhere there now...... I have two ATVs siiting waiting for me to either sell them or start riding again.....

I am prepping the X with new rad/water pump, hoses, new U joitns, etc trying to get ready...

I LOVE it down there!

We normally stay in a hosue on the 4x4-only area up above Corolla..

2 months to go......

I CANT WAIT!!!

Originally posted by PghBill
Hey guys, thanks for the insights!

The rear ratio for the '97 is 3.78 (if my memory serves me - its night and I don't feel like crawling under to look at the tag). The '91 is stock but I don't think it has limited anything.

The difference in overall gearing makes sense. I find that if I go slow and easy on the throttle, it works OK. Also, I found it helps to keep O/D off. One thing, though, the X as I have it set up is no speed demon on the sand. When it hits a soft spot, speed drops and it downshifts. (Is that why they call it an "Automatic???")

BTW, saw an AWD Mountaineer buried up to the rails at Oregon Inlet this afternoon. After digging and airing down, he got out. The same thing happened to a Suzuki whatever. Embarassing!

 

[PghBill]

Originally posted by zavetsky
. . . We normally stay in a hosue on the 4x4-only area up above Corolla. . .

Nice ride up the beach. My avatar pic was taken at the fence at the NC-VA border.

Wife & I will be there again in October. Feeshin'll still be good.